2021 Abu Dhabi Grand Prix - Yas Marina, Dec 10 - 12

[basti313]

I also do not see a real argument on the other side. Just look down to today and what is left today is some nonsense on Ferrari drivers on chewed up rubber.
With a little bit of reality and you see:
- Ham and Bono clearly expected THIS situation. You can clearly hear this on the team radio.
- Every one who got the "no unlapping" call was like "WTF???". Just hear the Alonso team radio.

The only one really surprised of the call was Toto...maybe the most humble person in the F1 circus. Ok, closely followed by Verstappen senior on the list of...
I am not very happy that we see a no show of Merc Vs RedBull and I really not care who wins besides the fact the Merc is responsible for this unfair rules. This whole F1 with the ugly engine rules is a highly unfair scenario crying for fairness now by Merc fans or the Merc team is the most brazen thing I can imagine.

[diffuser]

The last lap cannot be a green flag racing according to the rule... so it has to be a yellow flagged lap, so any positions gained in that lap is invalid and illegal.. .. hence the position gained by Max will revert back to the one he had on lap 57. So there is no shortening for the race, only changing finishing order which is perfectly possible

Race Director's decision overrides all rules. So it's a legal decision and stands. Then what is the next argument in court?

It absolutely doesn’t. You would get laughed out of any court with that interpretation.

Yeah Masi Safety car decisions were submitted to the Stewarts after the race. The stewarts basically stated that his decision was basically within the rules(however unfair they were to move 4 cars out of the way to allow Max free attack on Hamilton after Max had changed his tires). Within the rules means the race director can do what he did.

[pantherxxx]

To really simplify what happened:

Mercedes believed that there won't be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they didn't change tyres.

Red Bull believed that there will be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they did change the tyres.

Red Bull's strategy worked better, and Verstappen won.

[dans79]

To really simplify what happened:

Mercedes believed that there won't be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they didn't change tyres.

Red Bull believed that there will be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they did change the tyres.

Red Bull's strategy worked better, and Verstappen won.

And If Massi had followed the precedent he himself had set we wouldn't have had a restart!

[Tom145145]

To really simplify what happened:

Mercedes believed that there won't be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they didn't change tyres.

Red Bull believed that there will be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they did change the tyres.

Red Bull's strategy worked better, and Verstappen won.

Not true, you are forgetting they would have lost track position and would have sealed their fate. The only way your better strategy works for Merc is if they play it in hindsight.

[Roo]

There has been an argument made that "any" as pertaining to lapped cars does not mean "all" in an attempt to justify letting only a select few lapped cars go past. Assuming that this is part of the logic being applied, then by extension, the message in 48.12 of "LAPPED CARS MAY NOW OVERTAKE" does not have to be "all" lapped cars, and therefore the message sent to the selected 5 can be interpreted as the one implied by this article. Meaning that 48.12 actually WAS invoked as soon as that message was sent out.

Frankly, I think regardless of the wording of the rules, it seems to me that Article 48.12 is intended to come into effect if it is decided that lapped cars are overtaking, whether it be one of them, all of them, or any combination in between.

You could be right if only the rules did say that message should go to ALL drivers, and only when ALL lapped cars have gone passed the safety car and go to the back at an appropriate speed.. then it does on to say

"This will only apply to cars that were lapped at the time they crossed the Line at the end of the lap during which they crossed the first Safety Car line for the second time after the safety car was deployed"

and

that the FIA hadn't already ruled that RD hadn't followed the rules.

[diffuser]

To really simplify what happened:

Mercedes believed that there won't be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they didn't change tyres.

Red Bull believed that there will be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they did change the tyres.

Red Bull's strategy worked better, and Verstappen won.

No that isn't correct. Mercedes didn't change the tires cause they didn't think they needed to take the risk of falling behind Max(if something went wrong in the pits). With 4 cars being between Max and Hamilton on a restart it would have been hard for Max to get passed all 4 and Hamilton on 1 lap. Then Masi went and removed the 4 cars between Max and Hamilton, leaving Hamilton on 30+ lap old Hards vs Max on 3 lap used softs. I'm sure Mercedes would have had a different startagy, if they knew Masi was gonna do something that was unprecedented. Something, I can't remember ever being done. I've only ever seen no cars let through or all the cars, not just some. Hardly a fair fight.

[basti313]

To really simplify what happened:

Mercedes believed that there won't be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they didn't change tyres.

Red Bull believed that there will be a safety car restart in 5 laps so they did change the tyres.

Red Bull's strategy worked better, and Verstappen won.

And If Massi had followed the precedent he himself had set we wouldn't have had a restart!

No, there would always have been a restart. The track was clear with three laps to go.

The big show would have been: Alo and Vet just jump out of the way as we have seen with Schu. Lando and Ocon being the roadblock for Ver...

I do not want to know how this would have gone down...these poor guys would have been in a Timo Glock situation. I think it was good in any regard that the usual procedure was followed and Masi took them out of the show.

[falonso81]

Was it all clean? No.
Was there any driver at fault? No.
Is it fair that a driver get punished for that? No.
I believe everyone agrees to the above statements, so can the people that cry for Verstappen to have his title removed, explain how that would be fair?
There is no turning back once the race is over. If by any chance, some court and some lawyers overturn this result, it would mean the end of F1 as we know it.
Toto must go, not Massi. FIA and their personnel, regardless if they made a mistake or not, should not allow themselves to be ordered or bullied by any participant.

[f1jcw]

Was it all clean? No.
Was there any driver at fault? No.
Is it fair that a driver get punished for that? No.
I believe everyone agrees to the above statements, so can the people that cry for Verstappen to have his title removed, explain how that would be fair?
There is no turning back once the race is over. If by any chance, some court and some lawyers overturn this result, it would mean the end of F1 as we know it.
Toto must go, not Massi. FIA and their personnel, regardless if they made a mistake or not, should not allow themselves to be ordered or bullied by any participant.

How is it fair the title was given on the whim of the RD ignore set rules and making up on the fly? Is it Lewis fault he got this wrong and handed the title to Max.

At this moment in time F1 is worthless and pretty much the end, as the RD can decide the champion on whim.

So Toto, should go but not Horner who asked the RD for one more lap?

[markymark666]

Was it all clean? No.
Was there any driver at fault? No.
Is it fair that a driver get punished for that? No.
I believe everyone agrees to the above statements, so can the people that cry for Verstappen to have his title removed, explain how that would be fair?
There is no turning back once the race is over. If by any chance, some court and some lawyers overturn this result, it would mean the end of F1 as we know it.
Toto must go, not Massi. FIA and their personnel, regardless if they made a mistake or not, should not allow themselves to be ordered or bullied by any participant.

No you're not right... Verstappen would only have to give up the illegally acquired title ...

[Just_a_fan]

For those that complained about the Mercedes team's response after the race, Max confirms that Toto congratulated him, as did Lewis:

Verstappen said: "Toto sent me a text - congratulations on the season and that I deserved to win, that was very nice." The Red Bull driver added: "Lewis is a great sportsman in general."

Verstappen was talking in his first news conference since becoming champion, and he admitted he was suffering a little after partying through the night in celebration with the Red Bull team.

He said he understood how much Hamilton would have been hurting.

The Briton led for the vast majority of the race and was on course for the title, only to lose it on the final lap.

"Of course it helps if you have already seven titles," Verstappen said. "That comforts him a bit.

"I think if it was the other way around, it would have been more painful for me because I didn't have one.

"Lewis came up to me and congratulated me. It must have been very tough in that last lap. It also shows the respect we have for each other.

"Of course we had our tough times through the season but we respect what we're doing and we were pushing each other to the limit and it has been very enjoyable racing against him."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/59643983

[Hoffman900]

Was it all clean? No.
Was there any driver at fault? No.
Is it fair that a driver get punished for that? No.
I believe everyone agrees to the above statements, so can the people that cry for Verstappen to have his title removed, explain how that would be fair?
There is no turning back once the race is over. If by any chance, some court and some lawyers overturn this result, it would mean the end of F1 as we know it.
Toto must go, not Massi. FIA and their personnel, regardless if they made a mistake or not, should not allow themselves to be ordered or bullied by any participant.

Christian Horner: “we were screaming at Michael to let them through”

Christian and Toto are the same, both can be windbags, and both do exactly what they accuse the other of.

[Pany]

Wrong. Mercedes knew the lapped cars had to go away, either going as usual in front and make a quick lap to take position from the back, either by going back to get the same position., in order to accomplish the task to finish the race by racing. Thats it

[diffuser]

Was it all clean? No.
Was there any driver at fault? No.
Is it fair that a driver get punished for that? No.
I believe everyone agrees to the above statements, so can the people that cry for Verstappen to have his title removed, explain how that would be fair?
There is no turning back once the race is over. If by any chance, some court and some lawyers overturn this result, it would mean the end of F1 as we know it.
Toto must go, not Massi. FIA and their personnel, regardless if they made a mistake or not, should not allow themselves to be ordered or bullied by any participant.

Cause he wasn't the faster driver, in the faster car, that made few mistakes, on the team that made fewer mistakes. He won because Masi made a mistake.

He won 2nd fastest driver of the 2021 aided by Masi to be Champion.