2023 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 01 - 03

[Spoutnik]

Charles did the same to Lewis 2019 but Lewis went in the gras, avoiding it, no penalty. Sainz did the same two times this race, no penalty because the Red Bulls avoided. Piastri didn’t yield, penalty. Make of that what you will. Position was gone, yielding would’ve been the sensible choice. Guess he was still pissed McLaren undercut him with Lando. Not to mention he ran of Lewis one lap earlier…

People keep saying this but it's not true at all... It's a completely different setting and Piastri had half a car next to Hamilton rather than barely a front wing.

2019 Hamilton vs Leclerc is more similar to Leclerc vs Perez this race, Piastri had nowhere to go here. I like Ham but this was unnecessary, he was passing on the inside and Piastri already gave up, why should he expect to be closed out?

I posted the video. Piastri had enough room to do exactly what Lewis did. And he was not fully alongside as Hamilton.
If piastri had dodged, the same result as charles and lewis maybe. But there was a collision so of course 5 seconds. Thats the rules and fair. Piastri is responsible for his own risk management.
You cannot ask for a harsher penalty for hamilton just because of how piastri managed his risk.
Its 5 seconds for causing a collision and thats the rule.

Lewis obviously had his usual "bozo moment once in year" (i.e. vs Albon 2020/2019, vs Verstappen at Silverstone, vs Alonso last year)
But I think Piastri should've backed off really, not need to defend that much.
Lewis maneuver against Norris and Albon was much riskier but went well cause the opponent managed their risks more.

[PlatinumZealot]

New recrod. Ten wins in succession.
It might be 18 wins at the end of the season.

Absolutely! a record that only can be beaten by the man himself or the team themselves.
RBR is making history today, this is awesome!

Many great dominant cars have been produced. None have been driven like Max has.

Max is obviously great. He's certainly an andriod the way he drives. He is an elite, but we have to put elite drivers in different categories. Those with toothless teammates and those with strong teammates. Being a Redbull "golden boy" he will be protected and he has no choice in his teammates no matter what Marko says. To dispel this shiny protective coating, Max NEEDS a strong teammate NOW to seal his legacy and put him in the latter category of elites who have faced all commers (Senna, Moss, Hamilton, Lauda). Bring Carlos.. Put a Norris. Or sign a George Russell... we need to see how he overcomes a strong teammate fighting for politics, fighting for WINS and Championships.

[AR3-GP]

It is weird that causing a collision that obliged another driver to pit which dropped him places back is penalised completely the same way as leaving the track and gaining an advantage.

It's was pretty much a racing incident. Wasn't foolish or malicious. Remember Leclerc did this in the same corner and went unpenalized a few years ago.

Leclerc did it again today vs Perez. and it should have been penalized then, and now.


Some people say Ferrari drivers always get penalties ( ). Ferrari drivers had teflon shields today.

[Spoutnik]

He is in a different league.-

Until he’s put alongside a good teammate. Unfortunately, the fans haven’t seen that yet

I red the same things about Vettel in 2013...
We saw what we had to saw when Ricciardo came in, and then Leclerc at Ferrari and his battle against Hamilton in 2017 and 2019.

But I appreciate the domination from Verstappen, it's like when Vettel did this incredible weekend at Singapore in 2013.

[chrisc90]

He is in a different league.-

Until he’s put alongside a good teammate. Unfortunately, the fans haven’t seen that yet

Abit like lewis then. Put him alongside someone who is allowed to race and ends differently to the norm.... Boats was never allowed to race Lewis. Perez just isnt fast enough to Mount a realistic challenge.

[JordanMugen]

we need to see how he overcomes a strong teammate fighting for politics, fighting for WINS and Championships.

Bring in Charles.

Verstappen + Leclerc will be a cracking lineup IMO.

[Silent Storm]

Amazing how people forget how well Max has handled Daniel Ricciardo as a young inexperienced driver in 2016, the same Daniel who beat 4x WDC Sebastian Vettel in 2014.

[ringo]

The redbull is driven well by max. But it's not accurate to say mercedes had this kins of dominance.
We have to consider the car with its regulation and reliability of fhe time.

This rb19 racing with 2 meter wide cars that are heavy... For some reason thes tanker type f1 cars are just more predictable and super reliabile. The tyres are also more stable than mercedes dominant times.

Back then Hamilton had to push against a teammate who had equal priority. And the mercedes had many weaknesses.
Mainly suspension and tyre weakness. The other weakness was its poor agility.
Then you did have the random engine issue or overheating brake etc. Etc.
Max is doing great and what's expected. But it's very wrong to say he is doing some more special than any other champion.

Even Jenson Button in the rocketshit Brawn GP car in 2009 had an enthralling battle with Barichello, who did have the edge in qualifying pace, but just lacked the strategic thinking of Jenson.

Max just needs a top driver as a teammate to race for really cement his legacy. Right now he is statistical champion like Vettel. And even Vettel had Webber to fight some times.

[JordanMugen]

But I think Piastri should've backed off really, not need to defend that much.

100% Hamilton fault who was rightly penalised.

[Just_a_fan]

It is weird that causing a collision that obliged another driver to pit which dropped him places back is penalised completely the same way as leaving the track and gaining an advantage.

It's was pretty much a racing incident. Wasn't foolish or malicious. Remember Leclerc did this in the same corner and went unpenalized a few years ago.

Hamilton was not alongside when Leclerc did it to him - he was behind so Leclerc's chop did not go directly into his car. Leclerc was also the defending driver in 2019 whereas Hamilton did it into the chicane whilst not ahead, and when trying to overtake.. it's not the same situation

He was well alongside and Leclerc pushed him on to the grass and received a black and white flag as a "penalty".

[ringo]

He is in a different league.-

Until he’s put alongside a good teammate. Unfortunately, the fans haven’t seen that yet

Abit like lewis then. Put him alongside someone who is allowed to race and ends differently to the norm.... Boats was never allowed to race Lewis. Perez just isnt fast enough to Mount a realistic challenge.

Bottas was allowed to race. Why are you making stuff up?
Bottas in fact has gone wheel to wheel with Hamilton many times while sharing the same peice of track. Even in 2021 when he should have been helping Lewis. He raced Lewis harder than he did Max!

[LionKing]

Amazing how people forget how well Max has handled Daniel Ricciardo as a young inexperienced driver in 2016, the same Daniel who beat 4x WDC Sebastian Vettel in 2014.

It is obvious to those who want to see. I honestly don't see Verstappen being outscored by a Button caliber driver, nor watch while his teammate wins 7 races in a row with the same car.

[JordanMugen]

And even Vettel had Webber to fight some times.

Webber, not that talented by his own admission, managed to keep up because Vettel was only a Tier 1B driver and not a Tier 1 driver.

But absolutely bringing in Leclerc or Norris to Red Bull would be excellent. A team should ALWAYS sign the two fastest drivers they can find.

Delaying Russell's promotion to Mercedes was untenable. Russell should have been in the second Mercedes car to compete for the 2020 and 2021 WDCs. The delay was totally unnecessary and uncalled for. Red Bull and Ferrari promoted their junior drivers (Gasly, Albon, Leclerc) in a much more prompt manner.

[dialtone]

It is weird that causing a collision that obliged another driver to pit which dropped him places back is penalised completely the same way as leaving the track and gaining an advantage.

It's was pretty much a racing incident. Wasn't foolish or malicious. Remember Leclerc did this in the same corner and went unpenalized a few years ago.

Leclerc did it again today vs Perez. and it should have been penalized then, and now.


Some people say Ferrari drivers always get penalties ( ). Ferrari drivers had teflon shields today.

Haha, (in lurch voice) you rang?

IMHO LEC v PER wasn't a penalty or even anything to talk about. Perez wasn't alongside and deserved no space. Moving under braking is done by literally everyone as a defensive move at least once because you're never penalized for doing it once. LEC then basically let PER through because he didn't want to burn tires.

Nothing else happened, SAI IMHO wasn't moving under braking, more just braking in a very uncomfortable position for the driver behind.

[Just_a_fan]

He is in a different league.-

Until he’s put alongside a good teammate. Unfortunately, the fans haven’t seen that yet

Abit like lewis then. Put him alongside someone who is allowed to race and ends differently to the norm.... Boats was never allowed to race Lewis. Perez just isnt fast enough to Mount a realistic challenge.

Bottas was one of several team mates - three of the team mates were world champions / soon-to-be world champions. That's the difference quite simply.