2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

[mwillems]

Well I recall Brundle mentioning almost every race that "McLaren fires its tires up better than anybody."

Yes but that was not a great thing once we were in the race as we were getting the tyres too warm and it took a fair bit of management to keep them in the right window.

This appears to have calmed down a bit now, not sure where exactly the balance is now but I haven't seen anything that suggests they unduly overheat in the race or that they don't warm up in a positive way at the start. Someone else might have some better observations, but it seems fine from what I can see lately.

For Vegas it's a positive, but they may still see more deg vs other teams on longer runs. I get the feeling the race will be 1 stop, so firing up the tyres after the pitstop quickly might net Mclaren quite a few seconds vs another team that can't.

Do you think the tyres behave the same way that they did several races ago though? The tyre temp profile looks different to me now. I'm not sure they are getting the same heat in at the start since Singapore. Agreed that in Vegas, or any colder race, it was a benefit at the start and in the race, but over a season it wasn't great of course as on the whole that would cause us to take a fair bit longer to complete a race due to more deg.

Either that or we ARE getting the same heat in at the start and the extra downforce from the floor is making the race itself more manageable and reducing deg. I suppose we may have the best of both worlds?

[K1Plus]

Yes but that was not a great thing once we were in the race as we were getting the tyres too warm and it took a fair bit of management to keep them in the right window.

This appears to have calmed down a bit now, not sure where exactly the balance is now but I haven't seen anything that suggests they unduly overheat in the race or that they don't warm up in a positive way at the start. Someone else might have some better observations, but it seems fine from what I can see lately.

For Vegas it's a positive, but they may still see more deg vs other teams on longer runs. I get the feeling the race will be 1 stop, so firing up the tyres after the pitstop quickly might net Mclaren quite a few seconds vs another team that can't.

Do you think the tyres behave the same way that they did several races ago though? The tyre temp profile looks different to me now. I'm not sure they are getting the same heat in at the start since Singapore. Agreed that in Vegas, or any colder race, it was a benefit at the start and in the race, but over a season it wasn't great of course as on the whole that would cause us to take a fair bit longer to complete a race due to more deg.

Either that or we ARE getting the same heat in at the start and the extra downforce from the floor is making the race itself more manageable and reducing deg. I suppose we may have the best of both worlds?

The thing is, McLaren probably has the most floor downforce on the grid along with Red Bull after the concept change. Plus, the Mercedes engine is reliable and considering cooler conditions, you might not need gills that open for PU cooling.
What I am glad to know is that with the Singapore upgrade, it seems they've shed considerable drag and it might not be like their Monza performance.

[Mostlyeels]

https://www.racefans.net/2023/11/10/mcl ... -be-tough/

Stella confirms they've improved deg.

“I think generally we are gradually acknowledging the fact that it looks like together with the Singapore upgrade we have also been able to cash in some improved capability to limit tyre degradation,” he said. “And now I think we have observed this behaviour for enough races to say that it is a consistent pattern.

“So partly this is coming from the car. At the same time, I think Lando having a car that allows him to do a little bit more of what he wants, he’s taking advantage in order to stress the tyres less.

“I think the main enabler was the development of the car and then as soon as the car allows you to do something the drivers understand how to get further advantage out of that.”

[Darth-Piekus]

Out of curiosity. Are we following the Red Bull way regarding suspension? Pullrod in front, pushrod in the back?

[Marc.W]

Yes, McLaren is the only other team with the same Pullrod front Pushrod rear setup as Red Bull

[Darth-Piekus]

I was asking cause I saw a Youtube video claiming that many teams copied Red Bull like Mclaren which is not a bad thing as copying is normal for F1. However Mclaren if I remember correct had this set up in suspensions 2 years now. Do I remember correct?

[Marc.W]

I was asking cause I saw a Youtube video claiming that many teams copied Red Bull like Mclaren which is not a bad thing as copying is normal for F1. However Mclaren if I remember correct had this set up in suspensions 2 years now. Do I remember correct?

No, Mclaren have used this same layout since the beginning of 2022, same as Red Bull

[Darth-Piekus]

That's good to know.

[trinidefender]

At the hands of Max, the RB19 is nearly unbeatable on race trim.

Its impossible to beat something that holds the same level of high performance for the entire tire stint.

McLaren may start the stint a bit faster, but it cant maintain it. And its not that much faster than the RedBull to the point where the drop off doesn't make a big differencen.

On the net, RedBull is much faster.

And heck, in Brazil even Perez had incredible tire wear performance. He was battling with Alonso for the good part of 20-30 laps and there was no significant wear on that thing.

The RB19 is much faster than the MCL60 over a single lap too, it’s just Lando that makes it look the other way round

I have a lot of respect for Lando as a driver, but I still dont think he is quicker than Max on a single lap.

Maybe on a good day. But thats not taking anything away from Lando to be honest. In my opinion, I dont think anyone, not even Lewis would outqualify Max over a full season on the same car.

And if you remember during the quarantine, especially on GT3 races in iracing, Lando did not have that final tenth in him to beat Max.

Maybe very slightly off topic but....

Have you seen Max's compared to Lando's SIM setup. Max has a full racing chair, one of the best racing wheels etc. Lando has.....a chair, wheel, pedals and a monitor. If that's not worth a couple tenths then I don't know what is. Also I don't think Lando was taking the sim racing as seriously as max was. I wouldn't put too much stock into Max beating Lando by a couple tenths in SIM races with all those differences.

[AR3-GP]

chair, wheel, pedals, and "a monitor"

[organic]

Ok but really their pace in home simulator in a GT class has no bearing on their driving irl

[Darth-Piekus]

You do know that reality has many differences than a simulator. The Simulation will never be able to be as good as the original. I've been saying that for Consoles vs Emulators and that also goes for Simulators vs Reality. In my opinion Verstappen seems to be a slightly better driver because the car helps him make fewer mistakes, is easier to drive and at the moment a click better aerodynamically and a click better in tyre degradation. I think once Lando gets an equal car he can take the fight to Max. Who knows maybe Oscar will evolve even more to pass both Lando and Max.

[mwillems]

The RB19 is much faster than the MCL60 over a single lap too, it’s just Lando that makes it look the other way round

I have a lot of respect for Lando as a driver, but I still dont think he is quicker than Max on a single lap.

Maybe on a good day. But thats not taking anything away from Lando to be honest. In my opinion, I dont think anyone, not even Lewis would outqualify Max over a full season on the same car.

And if you remember during the quarantine, especially on GT3 races in iracing, Lando did not have that final tenth in him to beat Max.

Maybe very slightly off topic but....

Have you seen Max's compared to Lando's SIM setup. Max has a full racing chair, one of the best racing wheels etc. Lando has.....a chair, wheel, pedals and a monitor. If that's not worth a couple tenths then I don't know what is. Also I don't think Lando was taking the sim racing as seriously as max was. I wouldn't put too much stock into Max beating Lando by a couple tenths in SIM races with all those differences.

I don't think the Sim Racing comes into it as you say, unless there is something in Max reaction time that would benefit him everywhere.

Anyway, Lando is top notch in the race, you can see he drives the car brilliantly, I'm not sure anyone could question that. The only think I can see that he needs to be better at is the consistency with which he can put in the top fast laps in Q, marry that with his race day and you've got a driver to challenge Max it seems.

[mwillems]

Ok but really their pace in home simulator in a GT class has no bearing on their driving irl

Absolutely agree, but it's an amazing picture none the less, even if it is totally off topic

[Tomsky]