Sauber C29

[myurr]

[quote="wesley123]true, what i can think of is that that v-nose adds the springs etc. even higher up in the car, thus increasing CoG height

My line of thinking was that the V-nose helps more if you want a mid to low nose, and that the McLaren and BMW have slightly higher noses than the Ferrari and RB.

[/quote][/quote]

nope, the ferrari nose is bij far the highest nose already, and also have to V-nose implemented. The red bull last year also had a really high nose.[/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote][/quote]

At the bulkhead then yes it is higher, but at the tip it's an inch or two lower than the McLaren and at a similar level to the RB from last year.

Compare on the side profiles the height of the nose in comparison to the wheel rims.

[wrigs]

[quote="wesley123]true, what i can think of is that that v-nose adds the springs etc. even higher up in the car, thus increasing CoG height

My line of thinking was that the V-nose helps more if you want a mid to low nose, and that the McLaren and BMW have slightly higher noses than the Ferrari and RB.

[/quote][/quote]

nope, the ferrari nose is bij far the highest nose already, and also have to V-nose implemented. The red bull last year also had a really high nose.[/quote][/quote][/quote]
I think the point of the V-nose is not so much to lower the whole nose-section of the car, as it is to lower the middle and guide the airflow better over the rear of the car. As such, there is absolute answer as to whether or not the V-nose is a good thing, because it depends on the rest of the car. The F10 will have been developed specifically for use with this kind of nose, whereas McLaren, Sauber and Renault have all opted to go for a more normal nose, altering the rest of the car design with that decision.

[Raptor22]

The V-nose offers a few solutions to some pretty basic problems.

1) how to maintain decent suspension geometry with a high nose
2) how to create as much air space between the front wheels to allow the highest volume of air possible to flow under the car to diffusor.

the geometry problem can be solved with shorted upper suspension members since the cars are so stiff that roll centre is not such a major factor in suspension design.

The volume issue is a different thing and there are downstream features that influence this so yes, whether the designer opts for raised sides on the front monocoque or not is dependant on the entire design concept.

Some designers would prefer to minimise the air under the car and maximise the airflow through the sidepods and over the car. etc etc etc etc

[Pandamasque]

Under the nosecone there's a FW31/MP4-25 snowplough!

[ben_watkins]

The sidepods have an upper surface like the F10..

I just love those wheels! Best I've seen in ages on an F1 car

[myurr]

I read, think it might have been on Scarbs site, that the purpose of the V-nose was to allow more air past the front wheels. By raising the sides of the nose it creates a channel through which a larger volume of air can pass.

Thinking about it now, if this is the case, then with the narrower front tyres then the advantage would be smaller (volume is already bigger, raising the sides would increase volume by a smaller percentage compared to the new larger whole). Thus I would guess that the other teams have decided that the disadvantages outweigh the, now smaller, benefits.

[Raptor22]

bigger volume is bigger volume so the advantage is incremental.

The front wing is a biger determinant in whether you'd opt for raised sides or not.

Although discussion around this feature is interesting, its all just mere opinion without a detail understanding of how the front wing, front wheels, splitter and side pods and rear deck all interact with the floor of the car.

Ultimately every designer, wants to have as much air on top of the car rather than under it. raised forward monocoque sides is merely a feature that can be utilised to achieve that but there are other solutions.

That ferrari have copied it makes me wonder whether they really have the level of competency in the design office they had 6years ago. Back then the cars were sensible but lately they seem to be following others. Worrying for a Maranello driver

[ISLAMATRON]

Ultimately every designer, wants to have as much air on top of the car rather than under it.

Than why the raised noses since the early nineties Benettons?

[robbertmd]

A bit more revealing image of the C29's rear end, but still covered up.

[tomazy]

A bit more revealing image of the C29's rear end, but still covered up.

Is this a 3 peace rear wing? is this legal?

[WhiteBlue]

Neat car but scary looking without any sponsorship.

[RacingManiac]

Is that a triple decker diffuser?

[Raptor22]

Ultimately every designer, wants to have as much air on top of the car rather than under it.

Than why the raised noses since the early nineties Benettons?

Because a raised nose comes with an undertray air splitter andit was first seen on a March in 1989. Tyrell brought a much more radical version out on the 1991 car.

Raised noses allow clean air to the undertray splitter thereafter air is directed around and through the car (i.e. above the floor).
raising the nose further improves the efficiency of the front wing and everybody uses this concept now.

so when we talk about high and low noses we are talking relatively because every single F1 car uses a raised nose.

lower noses allow a lower cofg where ballast can be placed. higher noses may produce more downforce at the front but that has to be weighed against the weight of ballast and the benefit to vehicle dynamics, hence there is a trade off that needs to be made and that influences everything else.
but the basic principal is to have as much air weight above the car (floor) that there is under it. If they could have a vacuum under the car they would 100% happy

[Raptor22]

Is that a triple decker diffuser?

not sure what you mean by 3ple decker diffusor.

theres certainly higher exit on either side of the rear crash structure but the double deck element exits very close to the lower rear wing element which is quite neat since if its closely coupled (enough) it could effectively enlarge the diffusor dramatically

[ringo]

..sorry