Mercedes AMG F1 Team 2012

[strad]

Tyrell and Honda never set the world alight

HMMMMMmmmm...How do you figure that?

but secretly began to build his own Tyrrell 001 chassis. This was not ready until August 1970 and did not race until the Canadian GP in September but Stewart gave it pole position on its debut and led until the car suffered a stub axle failure.

For the 1971 season the car was developed into the Tyrrell 003 and Stewart continued the 1970 partnership with another French rising star Francois Cevert. The 003 won its first race in Spain and the Scotsman went on to five further victories to win his second World Championship. Cevert added another victory and Tyrrell took its first Constructors' title. Things were more difficult in 1972 with Lotus a much stronger rival and despite four wins, Stewart finished runner-up to Emerson Fittipaldi. In 1973, however, Stewart won another five victories to win his third title, although Lotus won the Constructors' title after Stewart decided not to race in the United States Grand Prix at Watkins Glen, following the death in practice of Cevert.

AS for Honda..

as 1965 developed so the cars became more quicker and more reliable. Ginther finished sixth at Spa to score Honda's first World Championship point and led the race at Silverstone. Towards the end of the year there was a new engine and in Mexico City - the last race of the 1.5-liter formula

And we all know how their engines ruled in the 80s..It's my opinion that winning Constructor championships and powering champions IS setting the world alight.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

@strad


How does Honda powering McLaren to victory as an engine supplier differ to that of Mercedes role? They're nigh on identical. I don't think singling out Mercedes GP as a failure then using an example of Honda succeeding as a manufacturer is fair, given that Mercedes are successful in the same area.

And Tyrell had lost the plot in the 80s when Big budgets hit the scene. Basically, Tyrell did not move with the times because it did not have the financial clout or wherewithal to compete with manufacturer backed indie teams like Ferrari McLaren and Benetton.

The culmination of this was, along with Ken's ill health, that BAT came in to take the team off his hands.
You cannot say the same of McLaren or Ferrari. This is the point I'm making.

Red Bull are the only team that can be directly compared to Mercedes. And even then, the comparison is difficult.

If you look at how this team has morphed and transformed over the years since the BAT takeover, you will see that little if nothing remains of the Tyrrell team that preceded it.

[dren]

I must admit that this car seems to have a completely different level of attention to detail, when compared to the W02.

This has been echoed by the team also. And if I remember correctly you were calling out the W02 very early on due to the attention to detail...or lack of. Have to say you were spot on with that.

[strad]

You cannot say that Tyrell and Honda didn't accomplish squat and that was the implication and that is flat wrong...

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

You cannot say that Tyrell and Honda didn't accomplish squat and that was the implication and that is flat wrong...

What did Honda achieve as a team? Please can you point me to that.

After 1978 Tyrell's team declined. Reasons for that were that F1 was modernising at a pace the team couldnt keep up. Budgetry issues also accounted for the team throughout the 80s and 90s and this team were perenial back markers.

To compare Mercedes current achievements to that of the latter day Tyrell team, you will find that Tyrell where nothing more than backmarkers with pedigree in the late 60s and 70s. That means nothing in 2012.

[marcush.]

unfortunatelly time is too short to come up with new parts in reaction to the finings of the first test week in Barcelona ,so they have to make do with what they had in the pipeline for this test so I expect no fireworks yet .
certainly this car has a level of attention to detail we have not seen from this team before.I just love it gone are the crude make do solutions they have definitely gained some considerable expertise in the design department.

[dren]

C'mon guys. Back to the Mercedes team.

If everyone can figure out how to meet at my house, I'll supply the beer. Party for the first F1 race of the year.

We can safely say from the W03s testing form and attention to detail that this team is moving in the right direction. The quotes from key personnel echo this as well.

[marcush.]

Finally the team has direction and seems to have found the answers they have looked for .It was a hurting experience also for those who really care for MGP.I really look forward to see what the old fart can do with W03.

[NewtonMeter]

FYI, a trackside observer in the form of Alex Wurz reckons:

Red Bull
McLaren
Mercedes
Ferrari
who cares

http://www.motorsport-total.com/f1/news ... 22822.html

[xpensive]

I must admit that this car seems to have a completely different level of attention to detail, when compared to the W02.

I would really like to see what they have going on under those clever sidepods as yes, they are very low. Also, around the engine cover area they do no appear to bulge in a draped fashion like the Mclaren or Red Bull, but rather they are a straight and low path to the back.

I'm thinking more in terms of the detail-quality, from the close-ups I have seen so far, the W03 is in a different league.

[NonNewtonic]

I must admit that this car seems to have a completely different level of attention to detail, when compared to the W02.

I would really like to see what they have going on under those clever sidepods as yes, they are very low. Also, around the engine cover area they do no appear to bulge in a draped fashion like the Mclaren or Red Bull, but rather they are a straight and low path to the back.

I'm thinking more in terms of the detail-quality, from the close-ups I have seen so far, the W03 is in a different league.

The lower or upper league?

[Ferraripilot]

Maybe first signs of Bell's job?

Yes, I could believe this. It seems Bell buried himself in Brackley for better part of a year designing this car and was essentially given carte blanche. Haug was correct in stating the car has 'lots of little things' rather than one big breakthrough. All of these smaller items working together make a nice difference in what is already a very nice package.

I have no doubt W03 will be a regular at the podiums, and I believe I could see it as a hands-down favorite for races such as China, Malaysia, Monza as it has retained W02s excellent top speed yet of course has more competitive aero that W02 desperately needed.


So far, I'm hearing Mclaren is very handy and probably quickest in fast turns while W03 is reportedly a very stable machine everywhere while the RB is pretty much great everywhere of course. I *heard* ust a rumor that Merc had the quickest sector 3 time at Barcelona of all so far. I don't think they are showing their hand yet. It's going to be a great year for Merc. WHile I don't believe this is a championship year, I do believe good things are coming

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

I will reserve judgement until the first GP is over.

So far no ghosts in the closet as in the W01/02. But, there are some signs that degredation hurts them more than others. This is all dependant on stages of development, which tyre, at what time of afternoon and what stage the track had been rubbered in, I know.
But The general gist is that Red Bull and McLaren are well ahead.

Ferrari will come on strong from now until the Oz GP, of that Im sure. And Force India are surprising everyone with the cars balance in medium and slow corners(mean diddly squat if they have run 1/3 full tanks mind).

My expectations of the W03 was to be more competitive than the W02. I was also very heartened to see that they completed 2000kms with 1 gearbox leak, and a hydraulic failure(first 2 days), along with no real glaring flaw as the previous 2 years.
If they can build on this solid foundation I will be happy, they need to demonstrate progress. The signs look good, but Im still holding fire on judgements...

[xpensive]

Is it time for this year's Mercedes wager, what do you think JET?

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Is it time for this year's Mercedes wager, what do you think JET?

4th, maybe 3rd if Ferrari have truly screwed up with their odd ball front pullrod F2012.
Podium or 2 on merit perhaps.