Caterham F1 team 2014

[acosmichippo]

LMP1 did not encompass Porsche when Lotterer won his titles.
Toyota and Peugeot did not compete against Audi in unison. They did so alternate to the other so far as I recollect.
So Audi had 1 real competitor at any stage of its challenge, other than in house.
And any in house competition could possibly be subject to team orders.
This allied to the fact that each car has 3 drivers.

Lotterer won this year with Porsche and Toyota in the field. Of course you could say it was an engineering win more than anything, but I still think it's unfair to say the competition over his whole 6 years of endurance racing (not just Le Mans) is "laughable".

[FoxHound]

Is it F1 standard?

Compared to F1, the standard is metaphorically laughable.

[acosmichippo]

Actually, I'd say the top WEC drivers are probably at least as good as F1 back markers, Kobayashi included. He raced in Le Mans Last year, and placed 5th in the GTE Pro class (behind two Porsches, Aston Martin, and Corvette), let alone anywhere near LMP1. In the whole WEC championship, he had no class wins, no poles, and placed 7th in class after all 8 races. If WEC competition is so laughable, why didn't he do better? Or get hired on a better team?

[FoxHound]

Actually, I'd say the top WEC drivers are probably at least as good as F1 back markers, Kobayashi included. He raced in Le Mans Last year, and placed 5th in the GTE Pro class, let alone anywhere near LMP1. If WEC competition is so laughable, why didn't he do better?

Simply, he does not race tin tops.
Where was Ralf Schumacher or Petrov or even the great Hakkinen when they raced tin tops? Nowhere spectacular.

Alan McNish is well into his mid 40s and won Le Man's last year.....and the FIA endurance championship.
Yet, when he raced in DTM he finished 10th.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_McNish

If you get a peachy race seat in LMP1, you crush ass. That can go for F1 too.

[acosmichippo]

Actually, I'd say the top WEC drivers are probably at least as good as F1 back markers, Kobayashi included. He raced in Le Mans Last year, and placed 5th in the GTE Pro class, let alone anywhere near LMP1. If WEC competition is so laughable, why didn't he do better?

Simply, he does not race tin tops.
Where was Ralf Schumacher or Petrov or even the great Hakkinen when they raced tin tops? Nowhere spectacular.

Alan McNish is well into his mid 40s and won Le Man's last year.....and the FIA endurance championship.
Yet, when he raced in DTM he finished 10th.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Allan_McNish

If you get a peachy race seat in LMP1, you crush ass. That can go for F1 too.

So you're saying the problem isn't the level of competition per se, but sports car drivers should not move to open wheelers and open wheel drivers should not move to sports cars? While I still disagree, that's a much more reasonable position than saying WEC competition is "laughable".

[FoxHound]

Name the level of competitive depth in LMP1.

Name the same level of competitive depth in F1.

In 2012 we had 7 different winners in the first 7 races. When has LMP ever had that?

[acosmichippo]

I can't even begin to get into all the different reasons why that is a poor comparison point.

[ScottB]

Name the level of competitive depth in LMP1.

Name the same level of competitive depth in F1.

In 2012 we had 7 different winners in the first 7 races. When has LMP ever had that?

That was as much to do with the crazy tire lottery.

By that logic you can say F1 has almost no competitive depth among the drivers, because only 2 can win unless they have difficulties.

[FoxHound]

Whom other than Audi won championships in LMP1 over the last ten years?
And how many races?

Compare the gap between the fastest Cars to the slowest.

Then compare that to F1.

[wesley123]

What does that have got to do with Lotterers driving ability?

[Richard]

We closed the previous Lotterer discussion for good reason, let's see the results first. So far he seems to be doing a decent job.

[FoxHound]

Richard,

My response was in relation to a comment purporting to sack Kobayashi. Yea it descended somewhat from there, but I see no merit in the decision, and nor do former Caterham notables.

[FW17]

Kobayashi hopes for three-car top teams in 2015

This guy wants F1 destroyed and a 1000 people loose their jobs so that he can drive a f1 car next year. Cant believe people gave him money and supports him.

[skoop]

caterham wants to keep ericsson

[stefan_]

caterham wants to keep ericsson's money

Fixed.