2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Jonnycraig
Jonnycraig
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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dren wrote:
Juzh wrote:
turbof1 wrote: Very interesting comment from Matthew Carter (Lotus). When asked about Power Unit parity between works team and costumer team, he said that "I can confirm that, having had last year a contract with Renault and this year with Mercedes, it's stipulated in the Mercedes contract that we have complete parity. In the Mercedes contract." He's clearly trying to state there, without actually saying it explicitly, that he did not have parity in the Renault contract.
Was no secret RB (and TR do a degree) had better support from renault compared to other customers.
Support is one thing, but parity is different. He is basically saying the PU package they got wasn't the same as what RB got.
Not sure what the issue is here. McLaren didn't get the same package as Williams & Merc last season, so as it was known that Lotus were leaving Renault pretty early last season, of course they wouldn't have gotten all the updates.

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Artur Craft
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Vasconia wrote:Wow! I was expecting dozens of comments due to the FP1 and FP2 but it seems tha you lazy guys are still sleeping. :mrgreen:

Hamilton on the top again, he has a trully great confidence in the car, after some issues in FP1 he has needed only a few laps to make the best time of the day. Rosberg has been strong in the FP1 but not so good in the second one.

Ferrari quite strong here, the second team with a stellar Raikkonen beating Vettel by half of a second.

Williams behind and the the rest with Lotus and RB having some reliabiliy issues, AGAIN. :roll:

Mclaren has made an important step forward, no realiabily issues, good amount of laps and better lap times. Long is the path but at least they have started to complete it!.
Don't take the laptimes as the real picture. Rosberg made a mistake on T7 during his first lap on Mediums, then on the second he was doing alright(faster than Lewis, who also sandbagged imo, on S1/S2) until the last corner where he missed the braking point. His FP1 time on a greener track and Hard compound was 1 tenth faster than his best FP2. Vettel spun during his lap on Mediums and ruined it completely so that he had to go back to only the Hard compound.

Overall, the Mercedeses sandbagged much more than the others and that's why everybody is not that far away. It was a very hot afternoon and times are still too high.

What really caught my attention, though, were two other things: 1- how painfully slow the cars look on the onboards(and are actually. Alonso did 1.32.5 on 2005 Q1) 2- how difficult it is to improve laptime after the first fast lap, even on the Hard tyre. If Pirelli had brought Softs and SuperSofts, people would run out of tyres during the race
turbof1 wrote: Very interesting comment from Matthew Carter (Lotus). When asked about Power Unit parity between works team and costumer team, he said that "I can confirm that, having had last year a contract with Renault and this year with Mercedes, it's stipulated in the Mercedes contract that we have complete parity. In the Mercedes contract." He's clearly trying to state there, without actually saying it explicitly, that he did not have parity in the Renault contract.
How would Lotus be able to confirm that? I mean, how would they know the PU on their car produce the same power(for instance) as that on the Mercedes?

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SectorOne
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Jonnycraig wrote:Not sure what the issue is here. McLaren didn't get the same package as Williams & Merc last season, so as it was known that Lotus were leaving Renault pretty early last season, of course they wouldn't have gotten all the updates.
Really? What was different on the engines?
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FoxHound
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Jonnycraig wrote:Not sure what the issue is here. McLaren didn't get the same package as Williams & Merc last season, so as it was known that Lotus were leaving Renault pretty early last season, of course they wouldn't have gotten all the updates.
They got exactly the same hardware. Software varies to each clients needs, but not by much.
The problem is Mclaren are contracted to Mobil, and are contractually obliged to use Mobil lubrication.
The Mercedes V6 was designed and built to use Petronas lubrication.

The difference here can be massive.

So really, the problem lies with McLaren's contractual obligations and not with the supplier.
JET set

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FoxHound
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Artur Craft wrote:How would Lotus be able to confirm that? I mean, how would they know the PU on their car produce the same power(for instance) as that on the Mercedes?
Contractually if there is a parity clause, it means Lotus will have some means of being able to check. Be that someone from Lotus at Brixworth, Or through Dyno numbers which can be verified and not manipulated.
Absolutely pointless otherwise.
JET set

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dren
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Joined: 03 Mar 2010, 14:14

Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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FoxHound wrote:
Jonnycraig wrote:Not sure what the issue is here. McLaren didn't get the same package as Williams & Merc last season, so as it was known that Lotus were leaving Renault pretty early last season, of course they wouldn't have gotten all the updates.
They got exactly the same hardware. Software varies to each clients needs, but not by much.
The problem is Mclaren are contracted to Mobil, and are contractually obliged to use Mobil lubrication.
The Mercedes V6 was designed and built to use Petronas lubrication.

The difference here can be massive.

So really, the problem lies with McLaren's contractual obligations and not with the supplier.
I figured any large deviations would be more to do with the fuel used than the lubrication.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Ferrari will still be 7 tenths off in qualifying. It is only free practice people.
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Vasconia
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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George-Jung wrote:
Alexgtt wrote: Possible Ros/Ham race.
Rain.
Ferrari battle.
Rain.
Maybe Williams snapping at Ferrair heals and scooping up scraps.
Rain.
Keeping eye out for possible Mclaren progress and Alonso/Button racing.
Rain.
Last year Williams was not that good during rain-races..
But they improved this aspect during the season. Anyway being a low downforce car I dont expect them to have a superb race if it rains.

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Vasconia
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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PlatinumZealot wrote:Ferrari will still be 7 tenths off in qualifying. It is only free practice people.
Still an improvement from what we have seen so far.

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FoxHound
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Joined: 23 Aug 2012, 16:50

Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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dren wrote:
FoxHound wrote:
Jonnycraig wrote:Not sure what the issue is here. McLaren didn't get the same package as Williams & Merc last season, so as it was known that Lotus were leaving Renault pretty early last season, of course they wouldn't have gotten all the updates.
They got exactly the same hardware. Software varies to each clients needs, but not by much.
The problem is Mclaren are contracted to Mobil, and are contractually obliged to use Mobil lubrication.
The Mercedes V6 was designed and built to use Petronas lubrication.

The difference here can be massive.

So really, the problem lies with McLaren's contractual obligations and not with the supplier.
I figured any large deviations would be more to do with the fuel used than the lubrication.
Correct! I completely forgot to add that :|
JET set

simieski
simieski
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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FoxHound wrote:
dren wrote:
FoxHound wrote:
So really, the problem lies with McLaren's contractual obligations and not with the supplier.
I figured any large deviations would be more to do with the fuel used than the lubrication.
Correct! I completely forgot to add that :|
With ref to http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/118220

"Felipe Massa believes Williams has lost its key advantages of straight-line speed and fuel consumption this year, as it faces a tough fight against Ferrari."

So are these problems likely caused by switching fuel supplier to Petrobas this year?
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Vasconia
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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I think he could also refer to Ferrari´s improvement. The Italian team has improved its engine in both aspets, and it seems more than Williams.

f1316
f1316
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Joined: 22 Feb 2012, 18:36

Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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Vasconia wrote:
PlatinumZealot wrote:Ferrari will still be 7 tenths off in qualifying. It is only free practice people.
Still an improvement from what we have seen so far.
Yes, but what is also key is race pace. We saw impressive lack of drop off for Ferrari in Melbourne practice but that factor is not really much of a help in an easy one stop race. For a predicted three stop, it suddenly becomes a massive asset.

Let's see how it progresses, but I wouldn't be completely surprised to see kimi try a two stopper - wouldn't be the first time he'd done that in recent years and then you have a real interest as it would entail the Mercedes passing him at some stage, with Ferrari very quick in a straight line.

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atanatizante
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Joined: 10 Mar 2011, 15:33

Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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simieski wrote:
FoxHound wrote:
dren wrote:
I figured any large deviations would be more to do with the fuel used than the lubrication.
Correct! I completely forgot to add that :|
With ref to http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/118220

"Felipe Massa believes Williams has lost its key advantages of straight-line speed and fuel consumption this year, as it faces a tough fight against Ferrari."

So are these problems likely caused by switching fuel supplier to Petrobas this year?
Yeah, like FoxHound and dren said before, it`s down to the fuel formula coz I`ve read somewhere in December 2014 a statement coming out from an official Macca team member saying the Merc team`s ICE having (track related) on average 20-25 more HP than they have had all season due to their fuel supplier, in their case Mobil 1 ...

And I think Williams didn`t changed their fuel/lubricants supplier from last year - being the same Petrobras company - and their problem are actually two issues in fact : one is their fuel formula and the second issue is related to a more powerful hence thirstier 2015 Merc PU ...
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f1316
f1316
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Re: 2015 Malaysian Grand Prix - Sepang

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I think last year, despite having an association with petrobras, they still used petronas; this year they've switched to petrobras.

But what massa is also undoubtedly saying is that Ferrari have eroded that advantage by improving. According to the on screen figures the Williams and Ferrari consumption looked much the same and even if it's as a result of running less downforce (which would also aid consumption), the fact is still that Ferrari powered cars are right at the top of the speed traps, meaning that Williams don't have that any more.