2018 French Grand Prix, Le Castellet, June 22-24

[Sieper]

I'm definitely not a Vettel fan, but that penalty was harsh, it was a first lap incident - they happen.

I was wondering why Danny was so slow at the end but the RedBull topic has some shots of Dan Ric's front wing, it was missing half the cascades on both sides! Quite bizarre!

So what I think is that RBR tried to find the absolute limit in producing the frontwing in such a way that the upper elements flex backwards under load (wind pressure when on the straights) reducing drag as much as possible and that they went a step too far and the elements broke off. Both sides on the exact same place, can't be a coincidence.

It happened at the worst possible moment for Danny as it was not fully discovered before he pitted (I think) otherwise they could have replaced the nose, takes like 3/4 secs extra or so and he would have then successfully been able to fend off Kimi.

I even read a theory somewhere that as DannyRic was riding with the higher downforce rearwing (as opposed to Max) that they (probably) also went for more downforce (making the pressure on the FW higher, and it just a tad more likely to fail) on the front wing to keep understeer at bay.

Either that or they simply goofed up with producing this one front wing. In any case, RBR should do well to investigate their manufacturing process for the FW, this shouldn't happen again, cost Ricciardo a podium.

[Sieper]

On Sky interview after the race Lewis said at least 2 interesting facts:

1. He was turning down the PU almost all the time and make up the difference with his driver's skills ... and even admitted quietly halve mouth when Brundle said that he was just coasting all race ...
2. He should have won even with a fresh 1.0 spec PU, so superior was Merc chassis (or should I say tyres ) on this track

Whilst at the same time implying everybody else behind him (Verstappen most notably as he was runner up) lacks (t)his driving skill. You see, this is how it works with Hamilton, always playing subtle mind games. I truly believe he is much better then anybody else (the now retired Rosberg included) on the grid at that.

[siskue2005]

On Sky interview after the race Lewis said at least 2 interesting facts:

1. He was turning down the PU almost all the time and make up the difference with his driver's skills ... and even admitted quietly halve mouth when Brundle said that he was just coasting all race ...
2. He should have won even with a fresh 1.0 spec PU, so superior was Merc chassis (or should I say tyres ) on this track

Whilst at the same time implying everybody else behind him (Verstappen most notably as he was runner up) lacks (t)his driving skill. You see, this is how it works with Hamilton, always playing subtle mind games. I truly believe he is much better then anybody else (the now retired Rosberg included) on the grid at that.

Hmm...you got that from his interview?

[Sieper]

Yes, that is at least how I always see Hamilton (see previous page if you will, I gave some input on how I read him). That is what is so smart about it, you don't need to read it that way at all, 100%plausible if you don't, but you can feel it that way (if you so chose) and I think that is on purpose. Hamilton is a very smart guy that knows what he says.

[dans79]

Whilst at the same time implying everybody else behind him (Verstappen most notably as he was runner up) lacks (t)his driving skill. You see, this is how it works with Hamilton, always playing subtle mind games. I truly believe he is much better then anybody else (the now retired Rosberg included) on the grid at that.

It's not surprising, his two most likely championship antagonists seem to more susceptible to it than others. Vettel has a red mist problem as Mexico 2016 and Baku 2017 has shown, as well as a recent tendency to make poor decisions when under pressure. Max, seems down right childish at times when put under pressure by other drivers and the press.

[sAx]

Yes, that is at least how I always see Hamilton (see previous page if you will, I gave some input on how I read him). That is what is so smart about it, you don't need to read it that way at all, 100%plausible if you don't, but you can feel it that way (if you so chose) and I think that is on purpose. Hamilton is a very smart guy that knows what he says.

Or another way to read it is that so little can be garnered from so little!

[siskue2005]

Yes, that is at least how I always see Hamilton (see previous page if you will, I gave some input on how I read him). That is what is so smart about it, you don't need to read it that way at all, 100%plausible if you don't, but you can feel it that way (if you so chose) and I think that is on purpose. Hamilton is a very smart guy that knows what he says.

Or another way to read it is that so little can be garnered from so little!

Exactly

[roon]

"I prefer to be here last than watching television," he said. "We are 20 drivers doing the best job in the world."

When asked how he can stay so upbeat, Alonso responded: "I'm surprised how negative you are because, as I say, we are the 20 top drivers in the world and the questions are how I manage to be positive, how I manage to smile, how I manage to breathe, to eat.

"I manage quite well, you know, and I feel very privileged."

http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433/ ... is-one-off

[Edax]

I'm definitely not a Vettel fan, but that penalty was harsh, it was a first lap incident - they happen.

I was wondering why Danny was so slow at the end but the RedBull topic has some shots of Dan Ric's front wing, it was missing half the cascades on both sides! Quite bizarre!

So what I think is that RBR tried to find the absolute limit in producing the frontwing in such a way that the upper elements flex backwards under load (wind pressure when on the straights) reducing drag as much as possible and that they went a step too far and the elements broke off. Both sides on the exact same place, can't be a coincidence.

It happened at the worst possible moment for Danny as it was not fully discovered before he pitted (I think) otherwise they could have replaced the nose, takes like 3/4 secs extra or so and he would have then successfully been able to fend off Kimi.

I even read a theory somewhere that as DannyRic was riding with the higher downforce rearwing (as opposed to Max) that they (probably) also went for more downforce (making the pressure on the FW higher, and it just a tad more likely to fail) on the front wing to keep understeer at bay.

Either that or they simply goofed up with producing this one front wing. In any case, RBR should do well to investigate their manufacturing process for the FW, this shouldn't happen again, cost Ricciardo a podium.

I was thinking the same. VES was running much less wing than RIC. He turned up the wing a notch during the race. RIC said in an interview that they were already completely maxed out on FW at the beginning of the race. Probably they went a bit too far with him.

[ClarkBT11]

I'm quick to bash Vettel, but it could of easily of been called a racing incident. When you look at all of the angles it wasn't a huge misjudgement considering it was the start, Bottas could have left more room, I know he was in front but he didn't leave a cars width when he knew Vettel was on the inside.

Sainz should of won driver of the day. Shame he had mechanical problem.

[Shrieker]

Vettel basically outbraked himself and understeered his front wing into the back of Valtteri's rear tire. It was a driving error reminiscent of last year. Imho, it more like deserved a 10 second penalty instead of a 5, if there is such a penalty. Not that it would've made any difference for him in the end, but anyway that's what I thought his infringement deserved at the time (and now too).

[Just_a_fan]

Vettel 'fessed up to it and didn't try to claim Bottas was at fault. Looking at the on-board from Vettel, there is plenty of room (more than a car's width) inside of Bottas at the moment of contact. Seb was just too quick at the point when he should have been braking. It happens. Seb's moved on, so should we.

[Shrieker]

Of course. It was just the first and last time I said anything about it.

[dans79]

I see it as follows.

They are supposed to be the best drivers in the world, and the FIA is supposedly all about safety. Thus in my opinion a free pass or a decrease in penalty because it's a given corner or lap is hypocritical at best.

IMO, penalties should work more like this.

• when none of the drivers involved can be blamed, or they are equally to blame, it should be deemed a racing incident.
• If you gained an advantage by leaving the track limits, forcing someone off the track, spinning them out etc then you should be given a 5 or 10 second time penalty.
• If you are deemed at fault for an incident that requires another car to pit because of significant damage, then you should get a drive though or 5 or 10 second stop go penalty.
• If you are deemed to have done something egregious (think spa 2012), then you should be black flagged, or receive a race ban.

[sAx]

I'm definitely not a Vettel fan, but that penalty was harsh, it was a first lap incident - they happen.

I was wondering why Danny was so slow at the end but the RedBull topic has some shots of Dan Ric's front wing, it was missing half the cascades on both sides! Quite bizarre!

Even more bizzarely Horner suggesting probable cause as debris on the track being responsible for 'debonding' the cascade wings on both sides.....sort of conflating impact damage with sub-optimal FW bonding assembly!