2018 Brazilian Grand Prix - Interlagos, 9-11 November

[TwanV]

Thanks for this Turbo, shows some perspective. Seems I am alone here apparently, but I wouldn't have shown the same restraint as Verstappen today I believe. I'm truly upset Haha, what a sport. Come on people, if you have Hamilton on your tail for the race win you don't want to get sidetracked by Ocon as race leader, there's no sense letting him by, I don't think max for a moment thought he would really try (badly) to unlap himself too.

Your thinking is flawed, Ocon would have gotten a blue flag if Max would reclose the gap later on. No reason not to let Ocon pass.

Max is just in puberty.

So, let's talk about your reasoning. give me one reason then why Ocon tried to pass at all? Sorry mate, I can totally get into the Mercedes conspiracy theory here.

[AnthonyG]

Thanks for this Turbo, shows some perspective. Seems I am alone here apparently, but I wouldn't have shown the same restraint as Verstappen today I believe. I'm truly upset Haha, what a sport. Come on people, if you have Hamilton on your tail for the race win you don't want to get sidetracked by Ocon as race leader, there's no sense letting him by, I don't think max for a moment thought he would really try (badly) to unlap himself too.

Your thinking is flawed, Ocon would have gotten a blue flag if Max would reclose the gap later on. No reason not to let Ocon pass.

Max is just in puberty.

So, let's talk about your reasoning. give me one reason then why Ocon tried to pass at all? Sorry mate, I can totally get into the Mercedes conspiracy theory here.

Your one reason: Ocon was faster.

[TwanV]

Being one lap down you mean? Edit : signing off today, I'm getting a little toxic. Sorry

[AnthonyG]

Being one lap down you mean? Edit : signing off today, I'm getting a little toxic. Sorry

At that stage Ocon was faster.

Unlapping normaly isn’t a problem normaly, because one can expect a race leader to use his brain.

[turbof1]

Being one lap down you mean? Edit : signing off today, I'm getting a little toxic. Sorry

Yeah that's the feeling I have too. I unfortunaly can't given I somehow against the tide, against all odds have to propagate reason and the middle ground .

Common people, it's not hard to see emotions are running high. Let's keep our heads at it.

[Just_a_fan]

Do you believe Ocon was on the inside?

Yes. He was on the right in a right turn that makes him on the inside.

Was he in front there?

By the rules of F1, yes, as he was sufficiently alongside.

Could he have pulled out?

Don't know but Max could have left him room and then been on the inside of the next corner.

Edit: that corner has a big sausage kerb inside the normal kerb. Ocon couldn't move further right without running over that lump. Doing that would likely have launched him into Max anyway.

Was his advantage permanent or just for 2/3 laps?

Doesn't matter. At that point he was faster and the safe option, as explained by the guy with 72 wins and 5 World Championships, was to let him go. Make life easy for him and then when you eventually catch him later, maybe he'll return the favour.

Max wasn't racing Ocon at that point so why did he fight him?

Opinions here are so "Haha I love to see Verstappen suffer" that I'm seriously considering never to return here.

Ok, bye.

[Just_a_fan]

Common people

Who are you calling common?!

[Morteza]

To change the mood of the thread. This was before the race

[LM10]

Having watched the onboard, Ocon had a massive speed advantage against Verstappen who was looking after the tyres. Instead of trying to overtake him where he did, he could have waited for the next straight and easily passed with DRS open and a clear engine advantage.

Remember that this argument was being used a few times this season when we were discussing Vettel's risky moves to overtake instead of being more patient. I know that these are two different scenarios and Ocon didn't have anything to lose in comparison, but he also didn't have anything significant to win, if any. So he could have shown a bit more respect and taken into consideration that it was the race leader who he was trying to unlap in a risky fashion.

To make it clear, though, in no way am I defending Verstappen's behaviour afterwards.

[dans79]

You are quick to act judgemental over his personality here.

I'm basing my opinions on multiple incidents that have occurred across multiple seasons.

[TAG]

Oh for the record, I dug up this jewel:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xTBHrMqLD3o
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/feat ... uzuka.html

This is a gem, I agree. I guess the only difference here is that it was Senna a three time WDC and arguably the best driver in the sport at the time. A lot of people see the talent in Verstappen it's just that that's the ONLY thing some people see in him. As Hamilton said, he sees quite a bit of his young self in Verstappen. Regardless of how the blame is apportioned, Verstappen threw a way a certain win today. In the end we learn more from our failures than we do from our successes and next year he'll have the black T bar in the Red Bull.

[i70q7m7ghw]

That's easily taken care of. If they lose weight on track, then that loss would be picked up when they next roll into the garage - scales can also be mandated at the pits.

Aside literately chucking things over the side, the only other way a car can lose weight would be to evaporate/burn fluids or solids. Neither of these methods is reversible.

Sometimes the car is backed in to the garage on a trolly, so would circumvent your scales. It's a cute idea, but it's not going to work., keep trying though Go look up what Tyrrell were doing with lead shot to get an idea of the sort of things teams have done the past to break the rules.

On the race. Silly of Max to get involved with a back marker, as Hamilton said "you had more to lose than he did". Max had some retort after "yeah it's easy to say from second". Overall his arrogant side was on full display again, the guy genuinely believes he can do no wrong, and that is NOT the quality of a future champion. He made some comments about being champion this year if RB had a good engine, but I guess he easily forgets all the mistakes he made at the start of the year?

[Wynters]

Video of Ocon hunting down Verstappen

https://streamable.com/0bynn

I'd forgotten that Max had gone defensive at the end of the straight. I thought he was taken by surprise. So, he knew Ocon was there and he knew Ocon was fast enough to overtake him but he didn't speed up himself and decided to actively race someone he shouldn't have been racing. It would've been easy to let Ocon go down the inside (saving Max from dirtying his own tyres on the inside line) and then pick up the tow and DRS through S1. He'd probably even have gained time on Hamilton. I suspect Ocon had no idea Max would first block him then try to squeeze him off the track.

Why block Ocon on the straight? Why squeeze him off the track? What possible reason did he have? What was he thinking he'd gain? Anyone?

It...it just makes no sense.

Another bundle of points thrown away. Max could've been Hamilton's main title contender this year if he'd only avoided all these senseless errors

[i70q7m7ghw]

Where is Ocon meant to go from here? That video tells all really, Ocon was massively faster, Max just turned across him like he wasn't there. If lapped cars aren't allowed to overtake maybe they should just retire?

[Phil]

I have to admit, i was a little fast in blaming Ocon. I now fully take it back. Excellent sum up Wynters, right on the money.

Verstappen was battling, he was defending and that (unnecessary) defending caused the incident.

I find it quite frankly bizarre that he (Ocon) got punished and made out to be the instigator.

Like it or not, the guys in the midfield, regardless if a lap down or not, are fighting just as much for every tenth. Most unfortunate that circumstance brought this incident about, but Max can only grow as he learns from them. And given how he reacted to it and how he kind of deals with every position he fights for... well, he still has a long road ahead of him.

Bless him for the entertainment he brings us though.