Scuderia Ferrari SF90

[garygph]

Someone have mentioned that Ferrari's front is ducking visibly too much under the breaks and on corner entry. Could this be to mitigate the lack of front-end downforce? Probably this is the reason why they don't have understeering issues like Mercs.

I assume that you do not mean that it is wrong for how much it "is ducking visibly too much" but just that it is noticeably more than the other cars? I say this as it would not make sense to say that the ( arguably) fastest car at this test had a visible handling problem compared to the others. If it works it should not be considered wrong I would have thought.

[F1Krof]

Someone have mentioned that Ferrari's front is ducking visibly too much under the breaks and on corner entry. Could this be to mitigate the lack of front-end downforce? Probably this is the reason why they don't have understeering issues like Mercs.

I assume that you do not mean that it is wrong for how much it "is ducking visibly too much" but just that it is noticeably more than the other cars? I say this as it would not make sense to say that the ( arguably) fastest car at this test had a visible handling problem compared to the others. If it works it should not be considered wrong I would have thought.

No no, in no way I'm saying it's wrong, to the contrary I think it's genius. I'm just wondering if it's true, how did they make it work?

[Tzk]

The rear suspension on the ferrari seems very soft and additionally squats on the straights. This results in a ducking front on corner entry amd should give them extra downforce through the frontwing sitting lower above the ground.

[paddyf1]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0zc7NcXgAAkI_P.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0zc7NaWoAAm7CP.jpg

Its interesting why ferrari is not using the ducted mirror? Was it used last to feed the upper inlet? like many thought?

[BwajSF]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0zc7NcXgAAkI_P.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/D0zc7NaWoAAm7CP.jpg

Its interesting why ferrari is not using the ducted mirror? Was it used last to feed the upper inlet? like many thought?

Nope,
To feel the upper inlet the mirrors must have been placed further ahead. It was done is order to mitigate the turbulence caused to the air by the mirror to the rear wing end plate. If you get a view of SF71H from the front you can see that the mirror position lies straight in the path of Rear wing end plate... hence to improve end plate efficiency the slotted mirrors were placed.
For SF90 it is clearly visible that the rear view mirror is well outside the path of the end plates so no slots...
P.s. Correct me if i am wrong.. Happy to learn....

[SiLo]

The rear suspension on the ferrari seems very soft and additionally squats on the straights. This results in a ducking front on corner entry amd should give them extra downforce through the frontwing sitting lower above the ground.

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

[garygph]

The rear suspension on the ferrari seems very soft and additionally squats on the straights. This results in a ducking front on corner entry amd should give them extra downforce through the frontwing sitting lower above the ground.

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

There are some suspension specialists that visit here that I am surprised have not said anything (yet). Maybe they have just not read this so here is my unqualified possible explanation.

Maybe they have now allowed more weight transfer via softer suspension and slow speed bump and rebound settings on the shocks but keep roll in check with the a stiff anti roll bar? Nothing special about what I have just said at all but would do what is being discussed I think.

[TNTHead]

The rear suspension on the ferrari seems very soft and additionally squats on the straights. This results in a ducking front on corner entry amd should give them extra downforce through the frontwing sitting lower above the ground.

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

This might point to a suspension system which is somehow adaptive. At the beginning of the winter testing I read somewhere that Ferrari finally has hydraulic suspension working on their car, but I forgot where. I found this link https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... the_third/

Does anyone know more of this?

[Polite]

The rear suspension on the ferrari seems very soft and additionally squats on the straights. This results in a ducking front on corner entry amd should give them extra downforce through the frontwing sitting lower above the ground.

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

This might point to a suspension system which is somehow adaptive. At the beginning of the winter testing I read somewhere that Ferrari finally has hydraulic suspension working on their car, but I forgot where. I found this link https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... the_third/

Does anyone know more of this?

This is correct: 3rd rear element is idraulic.. copy&paste from Rbr 2018.
Claimed weeks ago by motorsport.it and the Turrini'sBlog

[BassVirolla]

The rear suspension on the ferrari seems very soft and additionally squats on the straights. This results in a ducking front on corner entry amd should give them extra downforce through the frontwing sitting lower above the ground.

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

This might point to a suspension system which is somehow adaptive. At the beginning of the winter testing I read somewhere that Ferrari finally has hydraulic suspension working on their car, but I forgot where. I found this link https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... the_third/

Does anyone know more of this?

With a logic "&" hydraulic valve (not electrovalve) you can achieve this in a passive mode.
It will only allow the pass of the fluid when it comes simultaneously from both sides of the car.
It's so simple and inexpensive that I seriously doubt that it's the case.

[miguelalvesreis]

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

This might point to a suspension system which is somehow adaptive. At the beginning of the winter testing I read somewhere that Ferrari finally has hydraulic suspension working on their car, but I forgot where. I found this link https://www.reddit.com/r/formula1/comme ... the_third/

Does anyone know more of this?

With a logic "&" hydraulic valve (not electrovalve) you can achieve this in a passive mode.
It will only allow the pass of the fluid when it comes simultaneously from both sides of the car.
It's so simple and inexpensive that I seriously doubt that it's the case.

And if you add some pressure control valves you can set a threshold for on/off behaviour

Enviado do meu SM-T820 através do Tapatalk

[PhillipM]

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

An anti roll bar

[matteosc]

I'm wondering what setup they run so that whilst both sides are compressed (straight) the suspension is very soft but during corner is stiff. Like the opposite of running a connect spring between the two that would stop squat but allow softer rear settings for cornering.

An anti roll bar

Exactly. I do not understand why do people think there is something exotic going on while it is a "device" that any car in the world has...

[ian_s]

I thought they don't even run individual springs each side on the rear, its just the heave spring to take the load, and the anti roll bar to keep the car level. There would be a damper each side, and on the heave spring, but no springs.

for years I have wondered why the pushrod on the rear suspension is angled forward the way they are, and that got me thinking that there might be an advantage in having slightly flexible mounts on the control arms, so that when the brakes are applied the upright actually rotates slightly, pushes against the pushrod, and jacks the rear of the car up, just like we are seeing with the Ferrari here. Without closeup shots of the suspension in action from a fixed point on the car, I would not say this is what is happening, it's much easier explained with a very carefully selected multi rate heave spring.
The way that the rake change under braking was sometimes present and sometimes not suggests that it is simply a different spring, and they are testing to see if it really makes any difference to lap times.
It could be that keeping the rake keeps the airflow more stable when the brakes are applied, similar to closing the DRS before hitting the brakes, whereas the diffuser could stall as its volume suddenly gets much greater.

[wuzak]

for years I have wondered why the pushrod on the rear suspension is angled forward the way they are, and that got me thinking that there might be an advantage in having slightly flexible mounts on the control arms, so that when the brakes are applied the upright actually rotates slightly, pushes against the pushrod, and jacks the rear of the car up, just like we are seeing with the Ferrari here.

They're using pull rods.