2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

[Fulcrum]

Gasly's performance was clearly below the lower limit of what Red Bull would tolerate. For Albon's sake, I hope he can cope with the situation.

Also, I wonder which of Gasly and Albon will finish the season with more points; Albon (12 races in TR and 9 in RB) or Gasly (12 races in RB, 9 in TR)?

[GPR-A]

What amuses me the most on this forum is how a lot of folks deliver what is clearly their opinion, as fact. Saying why Ricciardo did this, why Max did that. They even know what colour of socks Ricciardo was wearing when he called Horner to say he was leaving. For me, I feel Gasly disappointed himself, he should have been more consistent and closer to Max. But Red Bull brought this on themselves, they are a bit too political and play games with the drivers that they like less. They are anything but transparent in their dealings. Perhaps this time they took the decision for the right reasons, but they have a worrisome past. Max is a phenomenal driver, a once in a generation talent, so there was eagerness to put him in a Red Bull, or risk loosing him in the near future. But was Kvyat doing so badly? How many mistakes did he make before being demoted? He had secured a podium in China, had a bad race in Russia, and that was it. Let's remember, which ever way you look at it, Kvyat finished ahead of Ricciardo in the 2015 Championship. He secured Red Bull's first podium of 2016, but a bad race weekend gave Red Bull the opportunity and excuse to do what they had wanted to do for a while. I can't imagine a Toto Wolff or most other team bosses saying a driver won't be replaced mid season and turning around and replacing him.
The biggest looser in all this for me is Toro Rosso, once again, it appears they have 2 disappointed drivers. Kvyat may be disappointed for not being prompted, Gasly for being demoted. This could affect their points haul.

And how many of the young drivers did Merc and Ferrari put in their car? I can only think of Leclerc which is a recent move. I would say they treat their drivers worse. You can't make everyone happy but RBR does more.
Maybe look in the mirror and repeat the first line of your post.

Schumacher and Hamilton, both are Mercedes sponsored young drivers! Mercedes never had a team of their own when Schumacher and Hamilton made their debut, but they sponsored and pushed them enough to get into F1. They placed Ocon in Force India and had cracked two deals for Ocon for 2019, both of which fell away in the last moment. Russell is driving at Williams. Unlike RB and Ferrari, they don't have their junior team, like most other traditional constructors have been through the time. RB was unconventional and Ferrari, while don't own a junior team, but manage it through financial assistance with their engines to their partners.

[Pyrone89]

Remember when hamilton moved to merc? A lot of posters had to swallow hard after the first year. Ric's move to renault is a story that's just unfolding. Lots can happen yet.

Big difference. Going to a manufacturer who had almost unlimited resources and a personnel count way higher than the competition with a team boss considered the best of the last 10 years (Brawn) versus a team openly admitting trying to do this on a midfield budget with a team boss notoriously for overpromising and underdelivering which he could already have know from his dealings with Renault as an PU supplier.

[Big Tea]

The 'worst' thing with Gasly is that he has shown he can perform. If it was a matter of him developing step by step he would probably have been given time to progress.
He seemed to have a good weekend when he was put on Max settings and given a good talking too but slipped back soon after. Being unable to do it, or do it now, is one thing, but being inconsistent for some reason they can not find has to be a concern

[etusch]

If Albon can not do it now big probably he could not do later too

[epo]

The behavior on this particular thread is amusing to say the least. No different to how some folks on Ferrari team thread behaves with regards to their ex-drivers. When Ricciardo was driving for Red Bull, all hail he was a great driver and now that he isn't, there is every reason to criticize him. If and When Verstappen leaves, I wouldn't be surprised to see some people here trying to kill his reputation with some or the other reason that he was never fit for Red Bull. Some people did that to Alonso when he left Ferrari, blaming him to be responsible for everything that was wrong at Ferrari. This is just bad behavior to ridicule Ricciardo, who gave so much joy for Red Bull.

That's weird, I'm Dutch and on the Dutch forums we would welcome Ricciardo back anytime.

[Pyrone89]

If Albon can not do it now big probably he could not do later too

Bit harsh. Not everyone can be Max Verstappen, Schumacher, Vettel, Senna or Prost. Some need time to grow.

[Ground Effect]

What amuses me the most on this forum is how a lot of folks deliver what is clearly their opinion, as fact. Saying why Ricciardo did this, why Max did that. They even know what colour of socks Ricciardo was wearing when he called Horner to say he was leaving. For me, I feel Gasly disappointed himself, he should have been more consistent and closer to Max. But Red Bull brought this on themselves, they are a bit too political and play games with the drivers that they like less. They are anything but transparent in their dealings. Perhaps this time they took the decision for the right reasons, but they have a worrisome past. Max is a phenomenal driver, a once in a generation talent, so there was eagerness to put him in a Red Bull, or risk loosing him in the near future. But was Kvyat doing so badly? How many mistakes did he make before being demoted? He had secured a podium in China, had a bad race in Russia, and that was it. Let's remember, which ever way you look at it, Kvyat finished ahead of Ricciardo in the 2015 Championship. He secured Red Bull's first podium of 2016, but a bad race weekend gave Red Bull the opportunity and excuse to do what they had wanted to do for a while. I can't imagine a Toto Wolff or most other team bosses saying a driver won't be replaced mid season and turning around and replacing him.
The biggest looser in all this for me is Toro Rosso, once again, it appears they have 2 disappointed drivers. Kvyat may be disappointed for not being prompted, Gasly for being demoted. This could affect their points haul.

You spent the first two sentences chastising others for giving their opinion (everybody knows that, just opinion, this is an opne forum we don't need to type imho, imho, imho imho after every sentence to make that clear, do we? I feel that Imho that is not needed. Even going as far as to ridicule that (what colour socks) and then you simply continue onwards to give YOUR own opinion. I for one highly disagree with your opinion that RB is highly political and plays games with drivers. They are highly about talent. But they have just two seats in the main team. Their young drivers program is always more then 2 seats. But look at how many ex RBR youth program talents are now in F1.

Obviously, I have no issues with Anyone giving an opinion, we do that everyday, like you said, I just gave my opinion. But when someone comes on hear and says Ricciardo left Red Bull because he wanted more money, that doesn't sound like an opinion.
The reason why I tend to believe there's politics in Red Bull is that if it was all about talent and performance, it would have been Max and Carlos in Red Bull at the start of 2019. There wasn't anything to suggest Gasly would be better, though Christian claimed they believed Gasly had a higher ceiling than Carlos, looked how that turned out.

[Marti_EF3]

I feel sad for Gasly, but well, you've to perform at some min levels on a top team. Hope he stays at STR next year to keep growing.

For Albon, I'm really happy. He deserves it, he always have worked hard to be where he is. And he has talent, and I think he have the fighting spirit Gasly doesn't have right now. I only hope that he can adapt and not fall under self pressure to be with Max. But I think he is stronger enough to deliver. Same as he impressed me during the tests and first races. Adapting and being fast very quickly to a F1 car. So he will be fine I think, and more young blood on a top car to bring excitement on the races

[Datco]

What amuses me the most on this forum is how a lot of folks deliver what is clearly their opinion, as fact. Saying why Ricciardo did this, why Max did that. They even know what colour of socks Ricciardo was wearing when he called Horner to say he was leaving. For me, I feel Gasly disappointed himself, he should have been more consistent and closer to Max. But Red Bull brought this on themselves, they are a bit too political and play games with the drivers that they like less. They are anything but transparent in their dealings. Perhaps this time they took the decision for the right reasons, but they have a worrisome past. Max is a phenomenal driver, a once in a generation talent, so there was eagerness to put him in a Red Bull, or risk loosing him in the near future. But was Kvyat doing so badly? How many mistakes did he make before being demoted? He had secured a podium in China, had a bad race in Russia, and that was it. Let's remember, which ever way you look at it, Kvyat finished ahead of Ricciardo in the 2015 Championship. He secured Red Bull's first podium of 2016, but a bad race weekend gave Red Bull the opportunity and excuse to do what they had wanted to do for a while. I can't imagine a Toto Wolff or most other team bosses saying a driver won't be replaced mid season and turning around and replacing him.
The biggest looser in all this for me is Toro Rosso, once again, it appears they have 2 disappointed drivers. Kvyat may be disappointed for not being prompted, Gasly for being demoted. This could affect their points haul.

And how many of the young drivers did Merc and Ferrari put in their car? I can only think of Leclerc which is a recent move. I would say they treat their drivers worse. You can't make everyone happy but RBR does more.
Maybe look in the mirror and repeat the first line of your post.

Schumacher and Hamilton, both are Mercedes sponsored young drivers! Mercedes never had a team of their own when Schumacher and Hamilton made their debut, but they sponsored and pushed them enough to get into F1. They placed Ocon in Force India and had cracked two deals for Ocon for 2019, both of which fell away in the last moment. Russell is driving at Williams. Unlike RB and Ferrari, they don't have their junior team, like most other traditional constructors have been through the time. RB was unconventional and Ferrari, while don't own a junior team, but manage it through financial assistance with their engines to their partners.

LOL. Schumacher and Lewis. really. Dating back 2007 and 2010. Schumacher was brought out of retirement and had never had contract with Merc for decades. Lewis was a McLaren driver. That is really clutching at straws.
As for the rest of your post it just proves that RBR is more committed in investing in another team to develop their drivers more than any other team.

[GPR-A]

LOL. Schumacher and Lewis. really. Dating back 2007 and 2010. Schumacher was brought out of retirement and had never had contract with Merc for decades. Lewis was a McLaren driver. That is really clutching at straws.
As for the rest of your post it just proves that RBR is more committed in investing in another team to develop their drivers more than any other team.

Please read how Schumacher started his F1 career in the early 90s and his non F1 racing career prior to F1. Also read Mercedes sponsorship to Lewis prior to F1.

[KelsO]

Thank you for this information @KelsO. I didn't know that.

And here is the information from them.
https://www.f1analisitecnica.com/2019/0 ... honda.html

Briefly.

- Ferrari upgrade aims to increase fuel efficiency. Ferrari has consumption problems due to the hybrid, not the internal combustion engine. The article states that Ferrari tried to solve the problem by finalizing the internal combustion engine, and not ERS. The update will not bring a significant increase in power (no 20hp), but should help in the race. They do not expect miracles, because they are close to the limit.

-Ferrari has an advantage of Mercedes over 15 hp, then Honda and Renault are pretty close, but Honda is the first in the text. (Close to Mercedes or to each other or taken together)

- Mercedes, too, should present an updated version aimed at increasing cooling efficiency (nothing big).

- Mercedes is testing a new single-cylinder prototype for 2020. According to information, this is the largest Mercedes update since 2014.

Translation from Italian may be inaccurate, I may be mistaken in something.

[etusch]

If Albon can not do it now big probably he could not do later too

Bit harsh. Not everyone can be Max Verstappen, Schumacher, Vettel, Senna or Prost. Some need time to grow.

Ok. It is what I am saying. He will show what he made of.

[Wouter]

Thank you for this information @KelsO. I didn't know that.

And here is the information from them.
https://www.f1analisitecnica.com/2019/0 ... honda.html

Briefly.

- Ferrari upgrade aims to increase fuel efficiency. Ferrari has consumption problems due to the hybrid, not the internal combustion engine. The article states that Ferrari tried to solve the problem by finalizing the internal combustion engine, and not ERS. The update will not bring a significant increase in power (no 20hp), but should help in the race. They do not expect miracles, because they are close to the limit.

-Ferrari has an advantage of Mercedes over 15 hp, then Honda and Renault are pretty close, but Honda is the first in the text. (Close to Mercedes or to each other or taken together)

- Mercedes, too, should present an updated version aimed at increasing cooling efficiency (nothing big).

- Mercedes is testing a new single-cylinder prototype for 2020. According to information, this is the largest Mercedes update since 2014.

Translation from Italian may be inaccurate, I may be mistaken in something.

Thank you also for this great information @KelsO.

[Pyrone89]

And how many of the young drivers did Merc and Ferrari put in their car? I can only think of Leclerc which is a recent move. I would say they treat their drivers worse. You can't make everyone happy but RBR does more.
Maybe look in the mirror and repeat the first line of your post.

Schumacher and Hamilton, both are Mercedes sponsored young drivers! Mercedes never had a team of their own when Schumacher and Hamilton made their debut, but they sponsored and pushed them enough to get into F1. They placed Ocon in Force India and had cracked two deals for Ocon for 2019, both of which fell away in the last moment. Russell is driving at Williams. Unlike RB and Ferrari, they don't have their junior team, like most other traditional constructors have been through the time. RB was unconventional and Ferrari, while don't own a junior team, but manage it through financial assistance with their engines to their partners.

LOL. Schumacher and Lewis. really. Dating back 2007 and 2010. Schumacher was brought out of retirement and had never had contract with Merc for decades. Lewis was a McLaren driver. That is really clutching at straws.
As for the rest of your post it just proves that RBR is more committed in investing in another team to develop their drivers more than any other team.

Yes and no, GPDRA is half right.

Mercedes did indeed fund Schumacher, but Hamilton was 100% Ron Dennis if I am correct. Mercedes just happened to be one of the partners paying the bills for McLaren as a whole.