2019 Russian Grand Prix - Sochi Autodrom, 27 - 29 September

[NathanOlder]

Can we ban engine failures and punctures too.

you will never remove the luck aspect of sport, today Mercedes got lucky. As someone pointed out, they lost a race in Australia last season for this exact reason. So maybe its just evened itself out.

well engine failures aren't luck, strictly speaking. They could reduce the luck element by giving corner workers a long rope, simple as! and arranging the gaps in the barriers a bit better. it's ridiculous having a VSC and giving random DriverA 10s just because some other car stops,when they struggle like mad to find each 1/10th. I mean it's a prototype racing series, a car breaking down isn't exactly a stunning surprise

I know, its this crazy quest to make it as safe as possible. Double waved yellows should be used instead of the VSC or just VSC conditions in that mini sector. If someone is judged to be going to fast or out of control, ban that driver for 3 races. The drivers wouldn't do it.

[Restomaniac]

I say ban pitting under vsc. Then again, it removes a tactical element from the race. On the other hand, remaining as it is, it is very unfair for racing, and the outcome decided by a vsc/sc is never good. On another note, it would be unfair to someone about to pit, but still.

So a driver gets a puncture in the incident and he has to go around and around the track dropping rubber and carbon fibre everywhere because he can’t enter the pits?

[NathanOlder]

Exactly, not saying this in reply to Shrieker, but aimed at DiResta, saying what he did about the VSC today is just sour grapes.

[LM10]

That it wasn’t done to give LeClerc the lead.

LeClerc still looked awfully unhappy in interviews though. Clearly he is happy with his team and has tons of confidence in them

In this case, yes, I don't believe in those words. Clearly an attempt to not heat things up medially. It was obvious that they waited for the gap to be big enough to pit Vettel. He was losing big chunks of time to Hamilton, but they still waited until the gap between Vettel and Leclerc was at about 24.5 seconds.

So the Ferrari team principle IS lying as was Vettel’s chief engineer over the radio or did you miss that too? LeClerc wasn’t peed off before hand though!

I wouldn’t really call that lying. Toto also isn’t lying when he tells that they’re underdogs or others are strong. He just wants to avoid pressure.

[Restomaniac]

In this case, yes, I don't believe in those words. Clearly an attempt to not heat things up medially. It was obvious that they waited for the gap to be big enough to pit Vettel. He was losing big chunks of time to Hamilton, but they still waited until the gap between Vettel and Leclerc was at about 24.5 seconds.

So the Ferrari team principle IS lying as was Vettel’s chief engineer over the radio or did you miss that too? LeClerc wasn’t peed off before hand though!

I wouldn’t really call that lying. Toto also isn’t lying when he tells that they’re underdogs or others are strong. He just wants to avoid pressure.

Sorry but that is exactly what it is.

[Restomaniac]

Exactly, not saying this in reply to Shrieker, but aimed at DiResta, saying what he did about the VSC today is just sour grapes.

Yep.

I’m amazed Sky haven’t dragged him over the coals for it either. The rest at least try and seem impartial Di Resta clearly just doesn’t have it in him..

Look at Anthony Davidson as a polar opposite. He actually works for Mercedes but has no problem in correctly critiquing them and giving praise towards others.

[Zarathustra]

Is it possible for someone to post a clip with an example of Di Resta bing ‘sour’- Thanks in advance.

[LM10]

I say ban pitting under vsc. Then again, it removes a tactical element from the race. On the other hand, remaining as it is, it is very unfair for racing, and the outcome decided by a vsc/sc is never good. On another note, it would be unfair to someone about to pit, but still.

So a driver gets a puncture in the incident and he has to go around and around the track dropping rubber and carbon fibre everywhere because he can’t enter the pits?

Not saying that should be the case. But it would not be hard to have a rule that would prevent cars without a puncture to pit under VSC/SC.
Pitting under VSC/SC only to gain a massive amount of time, even though all the tyres are in a fine condition, somehow is unfair. No matter which team it is. Today it was Mercedes who got extremely lucky and Leclerc was penalized with his third place - he should have won.

[Sieper]

Ok, maybe it was too difficult for you to grasp. If you are in a team and your team mate disobeys a teamorder. Would you do it a bit later? I think 90% of the people would not even consider it. That is my point, the multi21 is a result of normal human behaviour.

So that came back to bite Webber in the ass, So this will come back to bite Vettel in the ass.

we will see.

I only see this behaviour from Vettel when his team mate doesnt honor another deal. Like Monza, as of then he also doesnt do Leclerc favours. So actually it is biting Leclerc in the ass.

This. But I don’t even belief Any wrong doing was happening today to Leclerc. It is just himself that constantly seems to think so. As we say over here (Losely translated) the landlords Trusts his renters as he himself is.

[DChemTech]

I say ban pitting under vsc. Then again, it removes a tactical element from the race. On the other hand, remaining as it is, it is very unfair for racing, and the outcome decided by a vsc/sc is never good. On another note, it would be unfair to someone about to pit, but still.

So a driver gets a puncture in the incident and he has to go around and around the track dropping rubber and carbon fibre everywhere because he can’t enter the pits?

Not saying that should be the case. But it would not be hard to have a rule that would prevent cars without a puncture to pit under VSC/SC.
Pitting under VSC/SC only to gain a massive amount of time, even though all the tyres are in a fine condition, somehow is unfair. No matter which team it is. Today it was Mercedes who got extremely lucky and Leclerc was penalized with his third place - he should have won.

Then you can shift the discussion to front wings. Is a missing wing enough reason to be allowed to pit? What about a missing endplate? Or a damaged one?

If this is the way you wish to go, then sure, you could instate a default 10s or so time penalty at a pitstop under SC, such that it would only be done out of necessity. However, to me that would feel immensely contrived and boring for the viewer. I'd prefer the strategic challenge of proper pitstop planning, including the odds at safety cars.

[Phil]

I say ban pitting under vsc. Then again, it removes a tactical element from the race. On the other hand, remaining as it is, it is very unfair for racing, and the outcome decided by a vsc/sc is never good. On another note, it would be unfair to someone about to pit, but still.

So yeah, lets change the rules every time someone wins out of position, ey?

Counter question: what stopped Ferrari from using the medium tires in Q2 and mirroring what Mercedes banked on today?

[Mattchu]

I think this will be Leclercs toughest race after the summer break, he can hope that Vettel quickly gets past Hamilton.

Don't worry, it will the their easiest race for Ferrari's. There is little to no degradation on this track. Even though it has two long straights it is very hard to overtake as the last sector is very twisty, a good traction out of the last corner will suffice to cover the position.

And as for Mercedes' strategy starting on Meds is no feat of advantageous strategy, its just they're desperately trying something different as they have no alternative. The tires will not play any role here, even if they do, going Soft - Medium towards the end its better because you can push the Meds without worry. So yeah, its gonna be a Ferrari one two, it's just a shame that my bookie doesn't have F1 quotes

Saved yourself a few quid...

[Just_a_fan]

Re: the VSC thing. S'funny how it put the guy in the fastest car behind slower cars which should have resulted in exciting overtaking / racing. But it didn't. People then annoyed because the VSC "robbed" a driver of a win. And yet people want to have races effectively decided by just this type of fast-behind-slow situation.

[Jolle]

SC and VSC are just like track limits and engine penalties part of the race and therefore strategy. You always need a bit of luck, but when you go for an early pit stop you know you’re taking a risk if anything happens on track.

Mercedes took the risk the other way around. They knew on pure speed they would finish behind Ferrari and in front of RedBull, even on the medium tires so they had a solid strategy. Starting on the mediums was part of this gamble.

Somehow some here want a spec race sprint race to sort out the best driver. F1 is about being the best team. At this race, Mercedes maximised.

[zibby43]

I felt all season that Ferrari have been pushing their components harder than Mercedes. I assume, they don't want to take pu related penalties, because that would cast doubt on what their true pace is!

I had to record the race today. How was Merc’s race pace?

Very hard to give a definitive answer to that.

Lewis was catching Vettel at the end of the first stint, as the softs where done and the mediums still had life in them. When Charles pitted Lewis was 6.338 behind Vettel. When Vettel Pitted 3 laps later, Lewis was only 4.127 seconds behind, so he was gaining at 0.737 per lap.

If it hadn't been for the VSC and safety car, I assume Mercedes would have had Bottas block the Ferrari's as long as he could. Either giving Lewis the chance to come out clearly ahead, or come out right on leading Ferrari's gearbox, with a nice tire life and performance advantage.

Thanks for the detailed answer with timing/gap information. Very helpful.