Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

[izzy]

In the UK they've just taken company car tax to zero on EV's for a year...

That must be a big boost for all the UK EV manufacturers!

yes, lemme see... Nissan!

[izzy]

Off-topic alert! Or sketchy at best, but we're in limbo aren't we. This is how Greta got across the Atlantic when they moved the climate conference from Chile to Spain. With no fossil fuel! Or hardly any, Two awesome globe-sailing Aussies! It's a great channel generally

[Just_a_fan]

In the UK they've just taken company car tax to zero on EV's for a year...

That must be a big boost for all the UK EV manufacturers!

yes, lemme see... Nissan!

Who will leave the UK if a decent deal isn't done with the EU...

[Andres125sx]

Anycase I think this is a debate to discuss in some decades, not now when manufacturing pollution is just a fraction of pollution produced in use. First solve the big problem, then the rest

This immediate discussion about the viability of EVs (accounting for energy expenditure across their life), and electricity generation mix, is the closest this thread has been to on-topic in 50 pages!!!!!!!!!!

Please dear god let us stay on this particular point and not descend into another climate change "is it happening/is it bad/is it our fault" nightmare thread!

Agree, sorry for my part

... but it´s so easy to start a post with an EV... and few lines later you´re writing about climate without noticing...

[izzy]

78 pages and have we answered the question? Yes we have, they are viable the world is going mad for them!

So let's just let talk about what we wanna adjacent, up to what the mods think. Reading the thread's not actually compulsory

[Andres125sx]

I must say climate, pollution or CO2 emisions are not the reason I like EV, those are just (for me) another reason to switch to EV, but to me the real reason I like EVs is because they´re a step forward, next step in technology. They reach same results with literally thousands pieces less, increasing reliability and reducing maintenance drastically. And perfomance is even better, with a flat torque curve. Better perfomance, more reliability, less maintenance if any, quiet, smooth (no vibrations at all)... They´re almost too good to be real sincerely

Size and price of the battery is the only problem, once EV can provide similar range but with a more reasonable battery size (all projects promise at least 2x energy density and much cheaper manufacturing costs), weight will also come down, and I can´t wait to test a sports car or bike, lighter than now with ICEs, and with electric torque and reactions...

Then the electric is greener debate is fun but to me that´s secondary, electric is the way to go anycase

[izzy]

That must be a big boost for all the UK EV manufacturers!

yes, lemme see... Nissan!

Who will leave the UK if a decent deal isn't done with the EU...

The story i read is they'll go the other way and move 100% into the UK if there are tariffs. Tho they instantly denied it

[izzy]

I must say climate, pollution or CO2 emisions are not the reason I like EV,

Then the electric is greener debate is fun but to me that´s secondary, electric is the way to go anycase

they are fantastic to drive aren't they, or just be in. That's so open and shut that once the range / charging thing's been done there's only the green aspect left to argue about

I saw Italy has closed some cities like Milan and Florence to cars because the smog is out of control...

[Tim.Wright]

78 pages and have we answered the question? Yes we have, they are viable the world is going mad for them!

2% market share isn't what I'd call "going mad". Granted it's double what it was a year ago, but It means they aren't meeting the requirements of 98% of the new car buying population.

[strad]

Anycase I think this is a debate to discuss in some decades,

I have questions about in some decades. Like how are y'all and the U.N. gonna handle it in a couple of decades when the predictions of disaster don't come true. As soon as N.Y. subways are flooded or Seattle actually needs a bigger sea wall or Hawaii disappears under the waves, I will be first in line to say I was wrong. How about y'all? I think sooner or later the IPCC will have to come clean about costing the world trillions of dollars and upsetting the worlds apple cart.

[Greg Locock]

We'll see how much 'going mad' there is as the subsidies drop away. More than half of the sales of EVs are in China, or as we might say, coal powered cars.

[djos]

We'll see how much 'going mad' there is as the subsidies drop away. More than half of the sales of EVs are in China, or as we might say, coal powered cars.

What about all the fossil fuel subsidies? As I'm sure you know, we give the coal and gas industry huge subsidies here in Aus and most don't even pay much tax or even their full royalties.

[nzjrs]

Anycase I think this is a debate to discuss in some decades,

I have questions about in some decades. Like how are y'all and the U.N. gonna handle it in a couple of decades when the predictions of disaster don't come true. As soon as N.Y. subways are flooded or Seattle actually needs a bigger sea wall or Hawaii disappears under the waves, I will be first in line to say I was wrong. How about y'all? I think sooner or later the IPCC will have to come clean about costing the world trillions of dollars and upsetting the worlds apple cart.

Just so we are clear, where are you on path that i take no pleasure in watching so many people follow...

"it's not happening" -> "its happening but not our fault" -> "it's happening and partly our fault but there is nothing we can do about it" -> "its happening but won't be bad" -> "OK maybe if those pesky greenies had argued better I would have believed them earlier, it's too late now"

[izzy]

2% market share isn't what I'd call "going mad". Granted it's double what it was a year ago, but It means they aren't meeting the requirements of 98% of the new car buying population.

it doesn't mean that, it means they're extremely slow and expensive to start making so they're not available to buy. They really need a whole new platform to do it properly. Put in an order for one and see how long you have to wait! Kia instantly sold out of the e-Niro. Teslas have all kinds of problems with the paint and build quality and buyers don't care they just want EV, that's why the value of Elon's shareholding went up BY $4.5 BILLION, ON TUESDAY How mad is that???

[Greg Locock]

"What about all the fossil fuel subsidies? As I'm sure you know, we give the coal and gas industry huge subsidies here in Aus and most don't even pay much tax or even their full royalties."

Whatever you are on about, I was talking about the fact that 57% of EV sales are in China, and China gets (and will continue to get) the vast majority of its electrical power from coal.