[ 2020 ] Scuderia Ferrari - Ferrari

[Zynerji]

I'm sure Charles is a fine fellow. But his best results so far came in a car of questionable legality.

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

[LM10]

I'm sure Charles is a fine fellow. But his best results so far came in a car of questionable legality.

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

Leclerc not only has driven well in a questionably legal car in his career.

[Moore77]

I'm sure Charles is a fine fellow. But his best results so far came in a car of questionable legality.

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

[Zynerji]

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

And he has zero WDC trophies

[tnajner]

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

And he has zero WDC trophies

... Take your time and read some Leclerc bio about his achievements in the junior categories. His achievements were previously managed only by the drivers like Lewis Hamilton

[Moore77]

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

And he has zero WDC trophies

So is Max Verstappen. Based on your logic, they both will remain unproven talents until they win WDC.

[raymondu999]

I'm sure Charles is a fine fellow. But his best results so far came in a car of questionable legality.

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

The SF90 is probably faster than it would have been if it was legal. That is correct. But your traction control example, IMO — is not valid. Traction control is a driver aid, straight up. It removes the need for smooth application. But having a more powerful engine, is a completely different story. Having a more powerful engine does not make the car easier to drive. H

[Wouter]

Seb lost by 3 votes.... 3 votes!!

[selvam_e2002]

"Zynerji wrote: ↑19 Nov 2020, 17:12
[Leclerc] can still turn out to be another Hulk/Perez/Grosjean/Bottas."

I feel the same. Lecrec does not shows anything. He got team support so he is doing better than Vettel. in 2019, even with support from Binotto he matched Vettel.

Team support is important in F1. take an example of 2007, Alo Vs Ham. Ham got team support so Alo left the team.

Binotto have 2022 dead line, if he could not bring Ferrari to Front row, he will be gone by 2023 and Lecrec influence also disappear. Then Lecrec will be next Barichello or Massa in the team.

wait and watch...

[mika vs michael]

Bottas is the next Barrichello.

[SiLo]

"Zynerji wrote: ↑19 Nov 2020, 17:12
[Leclerc] can still turn out to be another Hulk/Perez/Grosjean/Bottas."

I feel the same. Lecrec does not shows anything. He got team support so he is doing better than Vettel. in 2019, even with support from Binotto he matched Vettel.

Team support is important in F1. take an example of 2007, Alo Vs Ham. Ham got team support so Alo left the team.

Binotto have 2022 dead line, if he could not bring Ferrari to Front row, he will be gone by 2023 and Lecrec influence also disappear. Then Lecrec will be next Barichello or Massa in the team.

wait and watch...

Hamilton didn't get team support. Initially Alonso got support and then McLaren gave both of them equal support.

[selvam_e2002]

Ron knows Ham at the time of Hamilton's Karting age. It clears everything who got the support

[ferkan]

I'm sure Charles is a fine fellow. But his best results so far came in a car of questionable legality.

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

So why did he have 7 poles in his rookie season vs 4xWDC that is Vettel who had 2? Vettel drove legal car, or? They are driving one right now and Vettel is getting beaten badly (worse then pretty much any other driver on grid).

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

To be precise, in his rookie season Charles dominated Ericsson, a 4 year F1 veteran, by scoring 84% of Sauber points and by having 0.5s advantage on average in pace. He also beat him 16 v 3 in qualifying (having lost first 2 at beginning of season).

Just for comparison sake, Werhlein barely beat Ericsson by 1 point to 0 in his rookie season, but lost more races to Ericsson then he won against him. That puts things in perspective IMO.

[Zynerji]

While this is true; I don't think the legality of the car affected the quality of his driving skill. He was given, in an algebraic analogy, "Equipment X" - but what results he pulled out would be seen relative to Equipment X. It's like an equation where both sides are divided by the same denominator. It cancels out, IMO.

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

So why did he have 7 poles in his rookie season vs 4xWDC that is Vettel who had 2? Vettel drove legal car, or? They are driving one right now and Vettel is getting beaten badly (worse then pretty much any other driver on grid).

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

To be precise, in his rookie season Charles dominated Ericsson, a 4 year F1 veteran, by scoring 84% of Sauber points and by having 0.5s advantage on average in pace. He also beat him 16 v 3 in qualifying (having lost first 2 at beginning of season).

Just for comparison sake, Werhlein barely beat Ericsson by 1 point to 0 in his rookie season, but lost more races to Ericsson then he won against him. That puts things in perspective IMO.

I mean, its fine. Charles will suffer the same Ferrari Frustration that both Seb and Fernando were subjected to.

All while Seb takes Aston Martin to 3rd in the construction championship next year while Charles is stuck in Q2.

We will see who has the better plan over the next 2 years

[ferkan]

Meh...

A "better than legal" car will be easier to drive... Thats why traction control was such an attractive thing.

My 6 year old daughter could lap within 1 second of me on rFactor (2010 F1 cars, Monaco circuit). Turning on traction control, she became 2 seconds faster. I can see how the clock made her look like the best driver, but the hidden illegality of her car was truly the differentiator. Not her skill and experience.

I feel very similar with Charles.

Time will tell a more complete story, and I'm a patient one!

So why did he have 7 poles in his rookie season vs 4xWDC that is Vettel who had 2? Vettel drove legal car, or? They are driving one right now and Vettel is getting beaten badly (worse then pretty much any other driver on grid).

I see you are getting it all mixed up. First off, explain precisely how SF90 was "better than legal car" and why it was easier to drive.

Your daughter's example here is irrelevant. I would be happy to know, what exactly in SF90 that helped Leclerc perform better than Seb.

In his rookie season of 2018, he outperformed a more experienced driver who was his team mate and got some really good results in a Sauber. He then outperformed his more pro team mate in 2019 and he continues to do that in 2020 with a couple of podiums and some near podium results in what is occasionally, a 6th best car.

To be precise, in his rookie season Charles dominated Ericsson, a 4 year F1 veteran, by scoring 84% of Sauber points and by having 0.5s advantage on average in pace. He also beat him 16 v 3 in qualifying (having lost first 2 at beginning of season).

Just for comparison sake, Werhlein barely beat Ericsson by 1 point to 0 in his rookie season, but lost more races to Ericsson then he won against him. That puts things in perspective IMO.

I mean, its fine. Charles will suffer the same Ferrari Frustration that both Seb and Fernando were subjected to.

All while Seb takes Aston Martin to 3rd in the construction championship next year while Charles is stuck in Q2.

We will see who has the better plan over the next 2 years

This is similar line of thinking as one back in 2014 with Williams and F14T. I think Aston Martin took big leap duo to obvious copy paste job of 2019 winning car and best engine (not - "Hey, maybe we should try same approach to aero philosophy", literally copying which won't be legal next year), while Ferrari is lost duo to situation they got themselves into with last years engine and late ban, resulting in racing with drag heavy car and 50hp less then RP.

Next year, I have hard time imagining they won't be easy 3rd team on the grid. If you think Ferrari will be stuck in Q2, while even this year they are not always stuck in Q2, then I have a friendly advise - don't bet on it.