Ferrari's carbon rim ring

Tp · Post 23 Apr 2006, 20:10

Since its introduction in Bahrain, the protruding outer lip on Ferrari's wheel rims has been the subject of much discussion, with rivals questioning whether it constitutes an illegal moveable aerodynamic device - the movement being the wheel's rotation. Ferrari say the lip is a functional part of the air intake system for brake cooling and that its profile remains the same, regardless of whether the wheel is moving - hence it is not effectively 'moveable'.

Sawtooth-spike · Post 23 Apr 2006, 20:34

but it does spin. so i guess somebody could make ones that are more like a fan? (i think we talk about that befor).

It is interesting that ferrari have exploited alot of grey areas this year. maybe they have a department who make things that could be illegal, then hand them to a bunch of lawyers who come up with a justification in the rules.

well if ferrari are doing it maybe everybody else should add the rims.

scarbs · Post 24 Apr 2006, 09:48

The ferrari carbon wheel rim is classed as a brake duct, the TWG and the FIA eased the rules on brake ducts for this year. it basically said withhin the confines of the wheel and usual area for the scoops (between the wheel and chassis you can do what you like. This is becauseteams like toyota last put a aerodynamic fin and no inlet then tried to pass it off as a brake duct. now bodywork in these areas do not need to be proven as ducts.
So the teams agreed it (via the TWG) the FIA agreed and theother teams have yet to cotton on the benefits.

zac510 · Post 24 Apr 2006, 10:55

scarbs wrote: BTW the ferrari carbon wheel rim is classed as a brake duct, the TWG and the FIA eased the rules on brake ducts for this year. it basically said withhin the confines of the wheel and usual area for the scoops (between the wheel and chassis you can do what you like. This is becauseteams like toyota last put a aerodynamic fin and no inlet then tried to pass it off as a brake duct. now bodywork in these areas do not need to be proven as ducts.
So the teams agreed it (via the TWG) the FIA agreed and theother teams have yet to cotton on the benefits.

I don't recall this fin Toyota used. Was it last year?

It would be interesting if this device still exists at Canada. It sounds like they are trying to retain heat in the tyre but aren't very concerned with the brakes overheating.

zac510 · Post 24 Apr 2006, 13:31

Its profile is not moving. It is perfectly symmetrical therefore is legal. It sounds like the other teams have accepted this ruling in order to get the benefits of having the 'open' space around the inside of the wheel that scarbs referred to.

A wheel cover is a piece of bodywork that goes OVER or COVERS the tyre/tarmac contact area or extends past the wheel track, like the fairings seen on Lotus 7 and the replicas.

The rear flipup is getting very close to being a wheel cover these days. If it were any wider (ie wider than the wheel track) it would probably constitute a cover.

Sawtooth-spike · Post 24 Apr 2006, 13:59

here something about the rims

http://www.formula1.com/insight/technic ... 4/267.html

kilcoo316 · Post 24 Apr 2006, 14:16

manchild wrote:Since wheels must not have any cover, can someone explain me than were the ring begins and where the illegal cover begins. FIA regs say "no cover" so it doesn't matter if you put cover that covers 5%, 50% or 100% - cover is cover and as such outlawed in all FIA championships first of all for safety reasons just as movable aero which this "rotating duct" also is.

Its rotating with the wheel, so cannot be a cover.

manchild · Post 24 Apr 2006, 16:13

I wasn't refeering on bodywork covering the wheel but on hub caps that are banned in all championships organised undr FIA regulations. What Ferrari has is a glued hub cap.

If everything was so as scarbs said (11 teams holding hands with FIA and singing "Ode to joy") why would than formula 1.com wrote

www.formula1.com wrote:Since its introduction in Bahrain, the protruding outer lip (in red) on Ferrari's wheel rims has been the subject of much discussion, with rivals questioning whether it constitutes an illegal moveable aerodynamic device - the movement being the wheel's rotation. Ferrari say the lip is a functional part of the air intake system for brake cooling and that its profile remains the same, regardless of whether the wheel is moving - hence it is not effectively 'moveable'. Ferrari's brake cooling system has two main parts - an inner drum (in yellow) where cool air (blue arrows) enters, and an outer part where heat from the brakes (red arrows) is expelled.

So, it's not just me and my animosity towards Schuey afterall.

Thanks for the link Sawtooth

Tp · Post 24 Apr 2006, 16:28

hmmm I'm pretty sure I quoted that a page back...

As far as I'm concerned if the FIA have not raised the matter themselves it is legal.

I agree with Tom

manchild · Post 24 Apr 2006, 16:34

Tp wrote:hmmm I'm pretty sure I quoted that a page back...

As far as I'm concerned if the FIA have not raised the matter themselves it is legal.
I agree with Tom

Basic checkups done after the race are not as detailed as those after offical protest made by some other team. Just like front wing was found legal after first 2 races but still changed for 3rd race because teams threatened with official protest that includes detail analysis.

Tp · Post 24 Apr 2006, 16:44

F1 Racing wrote:"Ferrari successfully argued, however, that the attachment was designed to be part of the brake duct assembly and was sited on the wheel to improve brake cooling."

Therefore the wing is legal

manchild · Post 24 Apr 2006, 17:02

Tp wrote:Therefore the wing is legal

Why did they change it than? They implemented changes that prevent basic functioning of wing that was subject of arguments. If it was legal I'm sure they'd kept it and ignore "rumours" if "rumors" were just rumors.

Anyway, that was another thread.

chapmanlung · Post 24 Apr 2006, 17:06

you really do hate Ferrari!!
whats your problem with ferrari??

manchild · Post 24 Apr 2006, 17:12

chapmanlung wrote:you really do hate Ferrari!!
whats your problem with ferrari??

Constant cheating, dishonesty, disrespect for rivals and ruining of Enzo's heritage that goes on since 1996. I love Ferrari from 1947 to 1995 but hate this thing they call Ferrari nowadays.

TryHard · Post 24 Apr 2006, 17:30

Just want to comment on something about the ferrari aero... no not the rims...

The aero stabilisers mention in the very first pic (the little upward protruding bits on the gearbox cover) look very much like covers for Torsion bars...
Maybe there is some revisions to the suspension setup, nescitating the bars protruding up, and hence the aero covers.

Regards
Ed