Driver performance science

[hollus]

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Changing the subject slightly, where is Giblet?! "Last visited: Sun Aug 12, 2012 1:54 pm"

He was my favorite moderator... even before he became a moderator!

[Shrieker]

I was wondering the same thing for a while...

[raymondu999]

The Thai version of Krating Daeng (not sure about the Indonesian version) is a LOT stronger.

Due to the MoH regulation in different country? It is originated from Thai too right?

Not sure - but if it was the ministries of health being the issue, why make the stronger version for the freer regulations? They'd just centralise on the less concentrated version and leverage on more economies of scale, surely.

[Nando]

There is no "thai version"
It originated from Thailand and is sold even in my country, Sweden.
It´s basically Red Bull without the carbon in it. (no bubbles)

It´s a bit stronger as it say on the bottle you should not drink more then two a day.
Much smaller bottle as well, probably 25cl or even 20cl.

[illario]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85JJw8kS-zM
Something like this wold be very helpful:)
I'm editing because, i posted this, only as a part of the possible 'real' tests that can be done to an F1 driver for determining some specific physical abilities. Otherwise, forget about ever having the possibility of measuring mental strength:) Maybe some concentration measuring is possible.
If i would would to test them, i would use a simulator, 16 laps race, the last lap driven blind-folded. This, just as an example.
Sorry for my bad grammar.

[godlameroso]

The thing is drivers and the team have more telemetry that we could possibly imagine. You don't think that drivers will go through their telemetry along with the engineers at the track, and the factory? The driver will be able to see all his driving mistakes, and the engineers will see all the flaws in the setup. Between FP2 and 3 teams usually find about a second of performance from simply optimizing the car.

It's interesting how we as humans instinctively generate feedback loops with what we perceive, in fact PCT, or perceptual control theory is a relatively new development(last 50 or so years) that I believe is starting gaining traction. I was recently introduced to this theory and it's potential, and from a human perspective it's very exciting; especially as it shows high correlation with theoretical models used in physics.

Once augmented reality devices like google glass become more common, I think there's going to be a huge market for bio-feedback app developers. Might be something to invest in.

[raymondu999]

Between FP2 and 3 teams usually find about a second of performance from simply optimizing the car.

For new circuits, I'd agree. Perhaps I'd go far as to say that I think they gain even more time. But are you implying that even for circuits such as Sepang or Albert Park, which they practically know all about - their computer simulations (on which they probably run iterative tests to obtain the optimum theoretical laptime) is so inaccurate that it would still produce a setup that's 1 second off the pace?

[godlameroso]

You can do a lot with simulations, the technology has come a long way, the thing is that there are still variables that will affect performance that can't be simulated in any current way. Bumps and things like that piece of cake, getting the aero balance right so that it suits the driver as well as the conditions takes some tweaking(sometimes suspension sometimes aero). Things like wind, temperature, the radiation of the asphalt, cloud cover, barometric pressure,(and a driver's mental state) all of these things affect car performance, and it has to be accounted for at the track. It's not in our abilities to predict the weather through a simulation, if we could, tornadoes and hurricanes would not kill people because we could prepare for them with ample time.

[Ciro Pabón]

Oh, puhleeze. Caffeine? Blessing from heaven.

Café de Colombia: I can't conceive the nucleus of all/ Begins inside a tiny seed/ And what we think as insignificant/ Provides the purest air we breathe


I apologize in advance if I'm offending someone here, but you cannot compare plant natural products with bull skin. I have tasted Red Bull once and frankly, it made me shiver. As the old joke goes, Cantonese will eat anything with four legs except tables.

As for Johnny Walker in a bottle, well... what can I say? I was raised where wine and culture go hand in hand. People that brew things made of grains are barbarians since the Roman Empire. Where I live, if you go into brewing potatoes you are not only a barbarian, you're incomprehensible. So much for whiskey and vodka.

Even British sailors know that rum is the best alternative to wine (they drank Sherry, the most unpalatable of wines, but you have to forgive them after drinking barley juice for all of their life). Old rum, that is. A sugarcane is made for humans, barley is made for horses.

Of course, rum and driving do NOT go hand in hand, it's good for dancing, because you have someone you can cling to. Wine is good for pasta, olives and opera, a perfect combination, not for racing and much less for getting drunk. So, alcohol and racing, no... but I'm digressing.

Many days I have enjoyed "Oh, mio babbino caro" and a Tarragona wine here in Cali: some tifosi may get the knack of this, some Scots may have a harder time with it
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DOOyTzY3Z4A[/youtube]

Now, on thread.

"You had to have quick reflexes: in effect you lived—or possibly died—on them." -- Jack Brabham --

Most people is not aware that the brain does not control your body: your brain simply asks the cerebellum to do the work for you. So, you are not training your brain (except for "the mood", so important to get "the swing" or inspiration) but your cerebellum. That's why it takes two years to learn a sport.

You do not control your body directly, but through a relay. That's a key to sports: repetition for actual physical changes inside your neurons, and not in your brain, lemme tell you. Dreaming about racing won't take you there, and neither simulation (at least current simulators, which only simulate visual input)


You're actually kind of controlling a robot. Ask yourself: do I know how I walk? Well, no, you don't. You have no idea what muscles you move nor in what sequence. Your cerebellum knows.

Batak
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=olKrV6auurw[/youtube]

Now, the most important muscle in racing (besides the neural pathways that make a pilot different from a driver) are those in the neck and waist.

Do NOT try this at home
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qgufVvEgVNQ[/youtube]

However, what good it to hold your head high if you cannot keep your body from moving?

You have to run as much as for a marathon's time, but against lateral forces. Your ribs will hurt...

Core strength: you do the pushups to get strength in your waist, believe it or not. Seventy five pushups in one minute for Lewis, not bad
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lpAgBwIgOI[/youtube]

However, in the end, it's a mind game.

Huge discrepancies in memories! Lewis is the best, more than 2 seconds away. Button seems lost in the end, if you ask me
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StqJ40ro56g[/youtube]

... and, perhaps ¿only one artist in the grid? What a memory! They bet 20 euros Alonso won't get the Catalunya lap with a three seconds margin of error. He was aiming for 1:21 and got 1:22.1 (in spanish, of course, the language of racers)
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Hl_NO4Acyo[/youtube]

[godlameroso]

There are things you can do to train your cerebellum to be more flexible, believe it or not swimming is probably the best, skydiving has a better effect and even better weightlessness but those experiences are not readily available to the common person. Things like yoga or tai chi, or any martial art for that matter are somewhat helpful, cooking, cooking is great for your cerebellum, plus you can impress your friends with your great/terrible cooking, also sex.

[turbof1]

There are people who can control freely their adrenaline reserves. Over one lap that can give a huge advantage as reaction speed and preciseness up. There are drivers who even find time move much slower when in the cockpit; while we see something lightning fast, they perceive like having al the time of the world.

[Nando]

I doubt Adrenaline is to any advantage. It´s a fight or flight system, not a precision system.
In fact i think most crashes in T1 and on the first lap is because of Adrenaline interfering.
After the first lap people start settling down and focusing on the job at hand.

[turbof1]

I doubt Adrenaline is to any advantage. It´s a fight or flight system, not a precision system.
In fact i think most crashes in T1 and on the first lap is because of Adrenaline interfering.
After the first lap people start settling down and focusing on the job at hand.

That is exactly it: you are describing adrenaline in a fight or flight situation, not at will. When you can push adrenaline conciously, you can channel it. This is something we try to achieve at our training programme: we first push spirit and body to the breaking point, effectively inducing the fight or flight system. After a few weeks of this people slowly start to induce the adrenaline surge by their own, by remembering the feeling, only they are not in a fight or fly situation. They are absolutely calm.
Mind you this is more about qualifying. You cannot keep that up fot a long time.

[beelsebob]

I doubt Adrenaline is to any advantage. It´s a fight or flight system, not a precision system.
In fact i think most crashes in T1 and on the first lap is because of Adrenaline interfering.
After the first lap people start settling down and focusing on the job at hand.

We produce adrenaline for a reason – it's evolutionary advantageous. We survive more often when operating on adrenaline, than when operating not on it, thus the fitness function plus evolution says we make it.

While it's easy to produce anecdotes where it causes us to act in the wrong way, overall, adrenaline has a positive effect on our snap decision making.

[flynfrog]

I know in Motocross racing you are pushing your heart so hard for most of the race that a mistake that gives you a shot of adrenaline will result in a your heart not being able so supply the blood demanded. This results in a visible slowing down as your body cant process at the rate you were a few seconds ago. When you see a pro rider mess up a jump and slow down for a few corners its not that he is scared its that his heart cant supply enough blood.

http://www.racerxvt.com/virtual_trainer ... _rate.html