The curious case of Sebastian Vettel

[Zarathustra]

Of course its important to put the right people in the right place. Todt did great putting Michael in the car, and putting all the other employees in there roles. Its more Todts Ferrari than it ever will be Michaels

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

[Big Tea]

Of course its important to put the right people in the right place. Todt did great putting Michael in the car, and putting all the other employees in there roles. Its more Todts Ferrari than it ever will be Michaels

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

Todt?

[NathanOlder]

Of course its important to put the right people in the right place. Todt did great putting Michael in the car, and putting all the other employees in there roles. Its more Todts Ferrari than it ever will be Michaels

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

Next you will tell me Michael took Brawn to Mercedes too, as all the Mercedes cars are Michaels cars , including the W10

[Just_a_fan]

Of course its important to put the right people in the right place. Todt did great putting Michael in the car, and putting all the other employees in there roles. Its more Todts Ferrari than it ever will be Michaels

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

No one took them with them. Those two joined Ferrari a year after Schumacher. If he'd "taken them with him" then they'd have gone there when he did. Todt joined Ferrari in 93, got Schumacher to go there, and then got Byrne and Brawn to follow. Brawn's tactics, driven by Schumacher in Byrne's cars, built under Todt's team management was what won the titles.

Todt had been very successful leading the Peugeot rally team so had the management skills. Brawn had designed a championship winning car in the past (XJR-14). Byrne had also designed competitive cars before he got the finances required to build a title winner. Schumacher was driver that made the most of the tools given to him by the excellent team built up by Todt. Schumacher's records are as much a testament to Todt as they are to anyone else. Likewise, Vettel / Newey, Hamilton / Costa.

Of course this massively simplifies the reality that it's a team of several hundred working long hours year-round that give the drivers the tools to succeed. The driver is just the last link in the chain.

[GPR-A]

Of course its important to put the right people in the right place. Todt did great putting Michael in the car, and putting all the other employees in there roles. Its more Todts Ferrari than it ever will be Michaels

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

Next you will tell me Michael took Brawn to Mercedes too, as all the Mercedes cars are Michaels cars , including the W10

Twist it however you want it. The fact remains that, it was Michael who convinced both Brawn and Byrne to join Ferrari, after Michael had joined Ferrari in 1996. Those two joined for 1997. Nobody else on the grid would have been ready to join Ferrari at that stage, other than Michael and it was his trust due to which those two followed. Todt didn't do much in there in terms of bringing these guys. It was Monty who brought Michael and then the other two. Todt wasn't a popular figure back then, as he is now after that successful era. There was no credibility for Todt back then in F1, to have held power to attract a two time champion, while the likes of Prost and Nigel had ditched Ferrari.

[NathanOlder]

Im not twisting anything, I'm just saying Michael didn't design and build the bloody car like Zarathustra was saying. Michaels car blah blah blah.

[Zarathustra]

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

Next you will tell me Michael took Brawn to Mercedes too, as all the Mercedes cars are Michaels cars , including the W10

Twist it however you want it. The fact remains that, it was Michael who convinced both Brawn and Byrne to join Ferrari, after Michael had joined Ferrari in 1996. Those two joined for 1997. Nobody else on the grid would have been ready to join Ferrari at that stage, other than Michael and it was his trust due to which those two followed. Todt didn't do much in there in terms of bringing these guys. It was Monty who brought Michael and then the other two. Todt wasn't a popular figure back then, as he is now after that successful era. There was no credibility for Todt back then in F1, to have held power to attract a two time champion, while the likes of Prost and Nigel had ditched Ferrari.

Amen ‘brother, Amen!

[Zarathustra]

Of course its important to put the right people in the right place. Todt did great putting Michael in the car, and putting all the other employees in there roles. Its more Todts Ferrari than it ever will be Michaels

So who took Brawn and Byrne with him?

Next you will tell me Michael took Brawn to Mercedes too, as all the Mercedes cars are Michaels cars , including the W10

No- Brawn confinced Schumacher to get out of his retirement and help built up a Mercedes backed team.

But, you didn’t answer my question.

[Zarathustra]

Im not twisting anything, I'm just saying Michael didn't design and build the bloody car like Zarathustra was saying. Michaels car blah blah blah.

Well- Elvis, I think you’re ‘twisting’ my comment- I never said Michael designed or built the car ‘himself’, have a look yourself.

[NathanOlder]

You said it was Michaels car, and to answer your question, Todt took Brawn and Bryne, he was the top guy in charge of hiring and firing. Schumacher may well have recommended them, but thats not him hiring. I dont remember it being Team Schumacher, pretty sure it was Ferrari.

[FrukostScones]

You said it was Michaels car, and to answer your question, Todt took Brawn and Bryne, he was the top guy in charge of hiring and firing. Schumacher may well have recommended them, but thats not him hiring. I dont remember it being Team Schumacher, pretty sure it was Ferrari.

why do you actually care?

[Zarathustra]

why do you actually care?

Because that’s what friends do.

[izzy]

Seb wanted to emulate Schumi didn't he, but he doesn't quite have that extreme level. Schumi was the best of his generation, and Lewis not Seb is the best of the next generation.

But Schumi didn't build the team, it was a lot of people wanted to be in his team, so the best people could get picked. Same with Lewis: he didn't build Mercedes, but a lot of people want to be in his team, because they know he'll maximise with the car. Having the best driver is a virtuous circle that makes the whole team work better, because the closer you are to winning the more motivated you are, and in that way Schumi and Lewis are on the same level. Across generations Lewis imo is a vastly better sportsman than Schumi, because he sees the difference between being the best and just accumulating wins any which way. But they both had/have that maximising effect.

With poor Seb the opposite has applied obviously, wasting an amazing car with mistakes year after year, must have been driving Ferrari people mad! Hence Charles not Kimi now.

[Jolle]

When Philip Morris lost faith in McLaren, they wanted the best of the best. Just like they did a decade before, they got the best driver, best and brightest people on every postion, no money spared. First they wanted Prost next to Schumacher! Good chance, they choose Schumacher because their best star, Senna, died two year earlier.

With not one but four "money is no problem" teams around (Ferrari/PM, Mercedes, RedBull and Renault), the market for personal is also more diverse. If this was 1996, Newey, Hamilton and Allison would be at the Philip Morris team right now.

[NathanOlder]

Seb wanted to emulate Schumi didn't he, but he doesn't quite have that extreme level. Schumi was the best of his generation, and Lewis not Seb is the best of the next generation.

But Schumi didn't build the team, it was a lot of people wanted to be in his team, so the best people could get picked. Same with Lewis: he didn't build Mercedes, but a lot of people want to be in his team, because they know he'll maximise with the car. Having the best driver is a virtuous circle that makes the whole team work better, because the closer you are to winning the more motivated you are, and in that way Schumi and Lewis are on the same level. Across generations Lewis imo is a vastly better sportsman than Schumi, because he sees the difference between being the best and just accumulating wins any which way. But they both had/have that maximising effect.

With poor Seb the opposite has applied obviously, wasting an amazing car with mistakes year after year, must have been driving Ferrari people mad! Hence Charles not Kimi now.

Totally agree with this. spot on mate.