FIA-Ferrari PU Statement Controversy

[dren]

I think it'd be great if part of the settlement ends up being Ferrari advertising the FIA on the side of their car.

[turbof1]

I think it'd be great if part of the settlement ends up being Ferrari advertising the FIA on the side of their car.

Dear lord no, spare a poor moderator that horror

[Fer.Fan]

Ferrari PU now have ”FIA” mode in quali.


Same as Mercedes ”Party mode”...

[RZS10]

"Today's Ferrari qualifying performance is brought to you by the FIA ACTION FOR ROAD SAFETY, the FIA's initiative supporting the UN in promoting road safety around the globe."

[hollus]

Be constructive, please. F1bashing.com is over there.

[izzy]

The Seven's ultimatum expires on Wednesday and Jean isn't suddenly going to roll over to have his tummy tickled is he, so what happens then??

[MachineCo.]

On the edge? They were over the fuel flow limit or they weren’t it’s really that simple.

You seem to be making this far more complicated than it is.

But if the given test of fuel flow, the sensor mandated by the FIA, says that they weren't over the fuel flow limit. Can they really be punished because a separate measurement suggests they were all along? To use the flexi-wing analogy again, would it not be like the FIA subjecting the wings to a different sort of test after the event rather than the one specified before the event. Is it not incumbent on all teams to look for these grey areas and cheat their way around the regs? Genuine question? I'm in two minds, on the one hand we expect a fair contest but on the other hand we celebrate clever innovations and work arounds.

If they are managing to give their ICE over the fuel amount limit no matter how they are pulling it off then they are outside the rules.

That's an assumption. By adding a second fuel flow meter, perhaps they could be trying to detect a fuel source from somewhere other than the tank where the original sensor was. In reality, what Merc was doing by introducing oil into the ICE through the crank vent system could be seen as bypassing the fuel flow meter.
If Ferrari have found a way to get more power, and the FIA can't conclusively say it's illegal then it's not illegal, even if the suspicion is there.
As for deliberately cheating, if Ferrari can justify to the FIA their interpretation of the rules are legal then it's taking advantage of the grey areas, much like the double diffuser and the flexi wings. When both Ferrari's were disqualified in the Malaysian grand prix for a barge board infringement, it was outside spec by 7mm or something, Ferrari proved to the FIA, by using measuring rigs that their interpretation of the rules and how they measured the boards was legal.

[Restomaniac]

But if the given test of fuel flow, the sensor mandated by the FIA, says that they weren't over the fuel flow limit. Can they really be punished because a separate measurement suggests they were all along? To use the flexi-wing analogy again, would it not be like the FIA subjecting the wings to a different sort of test after the event rather than the one specified before the event. Is it not incumbent on all teams to look for these grey areas and cheat their way around the regs? Genuine question? I'm in two minds, on the one hand we expect a fair contest but on the other hand we celebrate clever innovations and work arounds.

If they are managing to give their ICE over the fuel amount limit no matter how they are pulling it off then they are outside the rules.

That's an assumption. By adding a second fuel flow meter, perhaps they could be trying to detect a fuel source from somewhere other than the tank where the original sensor was. In reality, what Merc was doing by introducing oil into the ICE through the crank vent system could be seen as bypassing the fuel flow meter.
If Ferrari have found a way to get more power, and the FIA can't conclusively say it's illegal then it's not illegal, even if the suspicion is there.
As for deliberately cheating, if Ferrari can justify to the FIA their interpretation of the rules are legal then it's taking advantage of the grey areas, much like the double diffuser and the flexi wings. When both Ferrari's were disqualified in the Malaysian grand prix for a barge board infringement, it was outside spec by 7mm or something, Ferrari proved to the FIA, by using measuring rigs that their interpretation of the rules and how they measured the boards was legal.

I used the word ‘If’.

[marmer]

The Seven's ultimatum expires on Wednesday and Jean isn't suddenly going to roll over to have his tummy tickled is he, so what happens then??

Teams qualify out of the 107% and don't ask to to be allowed to take part. That way they can't be punished for not attending a gp. Only for one race pull the pants down in front of everyone

[Jolle]

The Seven's ultimatum expires on Wednesday and Jean isn't suddenly going to roll over to have his tummy tickled is he, so what happens then??

Teams qualify out of the 107% and don't ask to to be allowed to take part. That way they can't be punished for not attending a gp. Only for one race pull the pants down in front of everyone

or, bit less radical, stay in for Friday morning practice to start with.

[djones]

"In reality, what Merc was doing by introducing oil into the ICE through the crank vent system could be seen as bypassing
the fuel flow meter."

Is there any evidence of this at all? I have never seen any that Mercedes burned oil and indeed the only team that I can find evidence of oil-related shenanigans is Ferrari with their extra oil tanks which they were asked to remove by the FIA.

I know LM10 will have his email alert for any post I make and be replying. But the truth is unless you can find me evidence or an FIA clarification (like there was for Ferraris oil tank) then it's all just make-believe that Mercedes (or Renault/Honda) ever burned oil.

Every engine clarification or controversy of note in the hybrid era that I can think of has been directed at Ferrari.

I'm a big Ferrari fan and have been since the MS days, but I have no time for cheating so feel myself defending the other teams more and more these days.

[santos]

Is there any evidence of this at all? I have never seen any that Mercedes burned oil and indeed the only team that I can find evidence of oil-related shenanigans is Ferrari with their extra oil tanks which they were asked to remove by the FIA.

If you don't remember, try to search on the internet. Mercedes even changed the engine one race before the FIA stipulated the maximum of oil that could be burned.

[SiLo]

"In reality, what Merc was doing by introducing oil into the ICE through the crank vent system could be seen as bypassing
the fuel flow meter."

Is there any evidence of this at all? I have never seen any that Mercedes burned oil and indeed the only team that I can find evidence of oil-related shenanigans is Ferrari with their extra oil tanks which they were asked to remove by the FIA.

I know LM10 will have his email alert for any post I make and be replying. But the truth is unless you can find me evidence or an FIA clarification (like there was for Ferraris oil tank) then it's all just make-believe that Mercedes (or Renault/Honda) ever burned oil.

Every engine clarification or controversy of note in the hybrid era that I can think of has been directed at Ferrari.

I'm a big Ferrari fan and have been since the MS days, but I have no time for cheating so feel myself defending the other teams more and more these days.

Mercedes had an extra bladder for oil hidden in their tea tray area of the car.

[RZS10]

According to F1-Insider .com the FIA has replied to the teams and supposedly insisted on their right not to make any details of the deal public.
https://f1-insider.com/f1/formel-1-news ... testbrief/

[enri_the_red]

The Seven's ultimatum expires on Wednesday and Jean isn't suddenly going to roll over to have his tummy tickled is he, so what happens then??

Teams qualify out of the 107% and don't ask to to be allowed to take part. That way they can't be punished for not attending a gp. Only for one race pull the pants down in front of everyone

purposely fail to qualify is a risky idea
https://www.iol.co.za/motoring/f1-grand ... rce-515194