2018 Azerbaijan Grand Prix - Baku, April 27-29

[LM10]

lol this thread cannot have any discussion outside of max vs ric

Vettel, I disagree about the bad luck, it was his mistake what prevented his victory, not the luck.

Are you kidding? He made ONE mistake and it's even arguable it was a real mistake. He saw the gap and went for it. A bit of gambling because he didn't know the temperature of the tyres.
Without Safety Car all these things would have not happened in the first place.

How ignorant to tell that it was all Vettel's fault.

[ferkan]

lol this thread cannot have any discussion outside of max vs ric

Vettel, I disagree about the bad luck, it was his mistake what prevented his victory, not the luck.

Are you kidding? He made ONE mistake and it's even arguable it was a real mistake. He saw the gap and went for it. A bit of gambling because he didn't know the temperature of the tyres.
Without Safety Car all these things would have not happened in the first place.

How ignorant to tell that it was all Vettel's fault.

He is Alonso fan.

In Bahrain he got pole and drove fantastic race finishing on 39 laps softs.

In China he got pole and drove well until Ferrari pit call and SC/Max ruined his race.

In Baku he got pole, had 9s on Ham (with pit included) and 10s on Bottas before Ferrari pitted him and SC ereased all good he did. He went for gap because only 2 laps have remained and no DRS would be available. He went for a gap, as Senna would say, like a real racer. One milisecond less on breaks he would have pulled it of.

Expect alot of disscrediting to come this seaons.

[J.A.W.]

I swear that stupid Senna quote is the Godwin's Law of F1 internet forums.

Yeah, Zac510 - you do of course realize - that 'Godwin's law' thing - is solely sardonic, right?

Senna's comment is a racing truism..

Do try & grasp the essential difference, esp' in this context..

[zac510]

I swear that stupid Senna quote is the Godwin's Law of F1 internet forums.

Yeah, Zac510 - you do of course realize - that 'Godwin's law' thing - is solely sardonic, right?

Senna's comment is a racing truism..

Do try & grasp the essential difference, esp' in this context..

I suppose you are right that it has been named sardonically, but in the way Godwin's Law is applied is always to try and squash an internet discussion by comparing the forum poster to some aspect of Nazi-ism with an association fallacy. This user is using the Senna quote in the same way. If you disagree with the quote, you disagree with Senna and then you mustn't either be a true racer [or racing fan and shame on you], which is also an association fallacy.

[J.A.W.]

I swear that stupid Senna quote is the Godwin's Law of F1 internet forums.

Yeah, Zac510 - you do of course realize - that 'Godwin's law' thing - is solely sardonic, right?

Senna's comment is a racing truism..

Do try & grasp the essential difference, esp' in this context..

I suppose you are right that it has been named sardonically, but in the way Godwin's Law is applied is always to try and squash an internet discussion by comparing the forum poster to some aspect of Nazi-ism with an association fallacy. This user is using the Senna quote in the same way. If you disagree with the quote, you disagree with Senna and then you mustn't either be a true racer [or racing fan and shame on you], which is also an association fallacy.

Actually, it is rather - a matter of validity.

Senna's remark is 100% valid, & stands as - an exemplar of - racing lore..

But 'Godwin's law' is merely an ironic, if nowadays, hackneyed - joke..
..which some (sarcastically perhaps), trot out - (as a 'cock-blocking' ploy) to assert a spurious 'moral authority'..

[George-Jung]

How do you know what the "moment in time" is when "you could make 'moves'"? What are these 'moves' you refer to? Where are these defined of mentioned in the regulations?

What I meant is that the line a driver chooses to take, is his racing line at that moment of time- from where onwards he is allowed to make one defensive move ánd back..

There is no separate rule for defending the ‘off-line’..

Verstappen had committed himself long before the apex to the left side of the track, so theoretically making that *his racing line at that moment of time- you’d call it the off-line.. but in the end it doesn’t really matter

*) not to be mistaken with the normal racing line.

everybody is allowed 1 defensive move, which he made to the right- ánd move back, which he did to the left.

[djos]

Wow?!! The video is just there?!!
Please show me where I see things as I want them to see..

The whole back straight Max drove on the left.. so that was his racing line, he moves a bit to the middle and moves back to his racing line, which was the left side at the time.

How hard can it be?

What part of one move only don't you understand?

I think it's pretty clear that GJ can't see clearly due to the heavy orange tint of his glasses which are distorting his vision!

[bill shoe]

Interesting situation with Max and Daniel. I didn't watch the race. I read about the collision afterwards where the consensus was both-at-fault but maybe-more-Max's-fault. Then I saw it fresh for the first time just now. Seems simple case of Max swerving repeatedly to block. I mean, does the following car have to let the guy in front swerve-to-block twice at the time & place of their choosing, and only then does the following car have permission to pass without getting hit? Obviously no overtaking would be possible if that approach was enforced.

Also saw Sergey Sirotkin's collision with Alonso for the first time. Seems simple case of Renault on Sirotkin's right coming across where there wasn't room. Forced the chain reaction with Sirotkin and Alonso. Nothing the Williams could have done in that situation.

I tell you, I am looking forward to seeing races live again (come on F1 OTT broadcast!), but it's interesting how straight-forward all these argy-bargy situations are when they are removed from the heat of the moment.

[dans79]

I tell you, I am looking forward to seeing races live again (come on F1 OTT broadcast!), but it's interesting how straight-forward all these argy-bargy situations are when they are removed from the heat of the moment.

The #1 issue is the the FIA is full of cowards who are incapable or unwilling of enforcing the rules consistently regardless of context. The teams and drivers aren't afraid of the FIA like they should be because the FIA is all bark and no bite.

[gshevlin]

The danger in all of this is that we are heading for a move back towards the "anything is OK" style of defense and attack that began when Ayrton Senna drove Alain Prost off the track in Suzuka. The failure by the FIA to punish that move by stripping Senna of his driver's championship led to the entire "my road or the barrier" era dominated by Michael Schumacher. The Rascasse-gate incident moved the pendulum back, but incidents like this are not only difficult to explain to people not involved in motor racing, they simply look bad on television, all the more so when people read the rules and then wonder why the stewards are declining to enforce them consistently or properly.
Drivers are privileged to be driving in Formula 1, and occasionally they are going to need to be reminded of that.

[Sevach]

lol this thread cannot have any discussion outside of max vs ric

The drama...

It was a fun race, Bottas must be so frustrated, he deserved this

Vettel, I disagree about the bad luck, it was his mistake what prevented his victory, not the luck. Similar to Kimi, he´s making too many mistakes

What other mistake has he made this season? Not waving Verstappen by?

Vettel dominated 80% of the race, bad luck put him in a bad position instead of the dominant position he was in before.
After that yes, he made a mistake.

[PlatinumZealot]

On a side note, Bottas drove extremely well both in China and here. I was watching the race with my brother, and dad, and as soon as Bottas went over that debris i pointed it out saying why he didn t avoid it. Obviously i overlooked the fact that it s nigh on impossible to spot debris smaller than a certain size from distance while traveling @ roughly 90 meters a second.

This was just plain bad luck. And it was such a lucky win for Lewis. He did pretty much nothing apart from his stint 1 push which had no effect. Can any1 recall a luckier win for him? I can t off the top of my head. Bottas simply overshadowed HAM these last 2 races, and if hee keeps this up, than he s clearly made a step from last year, putting him firmly in wdc contention.

Bottas was lucky to be there. You forgot he was getting dusted by 7 seconds before HAM locked up from the tail wind? Haha. Bottas is much improved no doubt, but he has a ways to go before i see any "step from him. " he can start by regularly outpacing Lewis in the races.

[Fulcrum]

One can defend Verstappen's defence endlessly but, if he continues to drive like this, he'll struggle to win championships in an era where finishing is more important than ever. He gave away at least 10 points this weekend. He should learn to play the long game.

[JonoNic]

+1. He will loose out on top opportunities (drives) too

One can defend Verstappen's defence endlessly but, if he continues to drive like this, he'll struggle to win championships in an era where finishing is more important than ever. He gave away at least 10 points this weekend. He should learn to play the long game.

[J.A.W.]

One can defend Verstappen's defence endlessly but, if he continues to drive like this, he'll struggle to win championships in an era where finishing is more important than ever. He gave away at least 10 points this weekend. He should learn to play the long game.

"He should learn..."!

Do try & be serious!

Little Maxie came to F1 with his sublime race-driving talent already practically perfectly formed!

Its those mean, jealous, older boys, ah.. sorry, I mean.. drivers.. who must "learn" their place,
& "learn" to show due respect for the superior being & "learn" to give him proper 'racing room'...

Its quite obviously a conspiracy by those other clowns to 'haze the kid' & make young Max look bad,
at well as cruel his rightful & inevitable rise - to be F1 Champion!

I state these matters as fact, & refute in advance, any suggestion of pro-Max bias, too!


(Then again, maybe I did drink the 'Blue Max' Coolaid, & may seem a little OTT/pro-Max, as a result..).