Red Bull RB8 Renault

[scarlet]

Looks to be the same type of mesh as that which covers the brake ducts? Which is used to protect them from marbles etc.

[Rikhart]

To prevent junk clogging it, would be the most simple explanation.

[Timstr]

Why do people think that blowing hot air onto a tiny brake-duct fin or on a suspension member will in itself create any meaningful downforce? None I think.
I think blowing in the area between the rear wheel and gearbox is to clean up and accelerate the airflow over the top of the diffuser so that air is extracted faster from underneath the diffuser. And that is the actual downforce creation.

yes but you are missing Tims point that amount is much less than pulling more through the diffuser and beam wing area.

I don't dispute at all the idea that energizing the flow over the top of the diffuser can help extract more air from under the floor. I have a bit of trouble with the concept that it cleans up the airflow though.

Also, I have a lot of trouble believing that a team like red bull went to the trouble of placing the upper wishbone in such a way that the exhaust flows directly under it for "no meaningful downforce" unless you're arguing that this is simply to redirect the air at the diffuser. Something tells me it doesn't redirect the air that dramatically. My interpretation of what I see on the rb8 says it acts on both wishbones and the beam wing.

Also, I think the wishbone is a good choice because it can be placed so close to the exhaust, where there is the most energy. By the time it gets to the beam wing/diffuser area, much of that energy is dissipated.

The high speed exhaust is angled upwards. Blowing under the wishbone is merely a way to help deflect that airflow downwards. Not for getting downforce from the upper wishbone.

[Nickel]

The high speed exhaust is angled upwards. Blowing under the wishbone is merely a way to help deflect that airflow downwards. Not for getting downforce from the upper wishbone.

I agree that it deflects the exhaust stream downwards. Until someone is kind enough to run some CFD simulation, we will have to agree to disagree as far as downforce generated upon the wishbone.

[flynfrog]

getting the wishbone high is simply to get it out of the way.

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/airplane/foil2.html
play with a neutral body with angle off attack if you want to see with your own eyes.

[Nickel]

getting the wishbone high is simply to get it out of the way.

http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/k-12/airplane/foil2.html
play with a neutral body with angle off attack if you want to see with your own eyes.

Thanks for the link to a neat program. There's a flaw though. This is a neutral body in the free stream. Run the exhaust at 350m/s over the underside of a neutral body and then what happens? The key to what I and others are saying is primarily the underside

[hardingfv32]

The screen looks like junk. Not to F1 standards.

Brian

[PlatinumZealot]

The screen looks like junk. Not to F1 standards.

Brian

[img]http://www.formula1.com/wi/sutton/2011/ ... 76.jpg[img]

The screen implies that there is no special aerodynamics required inside there?

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Checking out the "driver cooling"

[Pup]

I'm sure the airflow could be channeled around those components and coupled to nozzles in the cockpit. With that in mind, do any of the teams actually connect cooling hoses to the driver's suits themselves or would the firesuit regs prevent that?

[f1nut]

The shape of the letterbox interests me; the way it ramps up. It looks like a scramjet inlet. In this theory the air is 'shocked' rapidly slows and increases in pressure. The air could then be heated and delivered to the rear of the car. Just a thought.

[Owen.C93]

The shape of the letterbox interests me; the way it ramps up. It looks like a scramjet inlet. In this theory the air is 'shocked' rapidly slows and increases in pressure. The air could then be heated and delivered to the rear of the car. Just a thought.

That's quite far fetched and unnecesary.


I'm sure we'll see them without the nose cone in Melbourne and all will become clear.

[flynfrog]

The shape of the letterbox interests me; the way it ramps up. It looks like a scramjet inlet. In this theory the air is 'shocked' rapidly slows and increases in pressure. The air could then be heated and delivered to the rear of the car. Just a thought.

no.

[Gridlock]

Well, maybe at around Mach 4, yes.

[ringo]

that the exhaust flows directly under it for "no meaningful downforce" unless you're arguing that this is simply to redirect the air at the diffuser.

The control arm is aero neutral per the rules. If that is the case how do you get down-force?

Brian

You sure the rules say that?
The rules say no angle of attach greater than 5 degrees, and section of arm must be symeterical about the major axis.
That doesn't really declare aero neutrality.