2024 Aston Martin | Aramco F1 Team

[OnEcRiTiCaL]

I question myself: Aston had the worst degradation in China, so. WHY? the Japan upgrades is not working and we start to lose the progress like the same issues from second semester in last year? Mercedes Wind Tunnel is joking with us? Or maybe was situational? its to early for lose my hope to a big step foward in this year?

I also mentioned not at once , that very possible in Mercedes wind tunnel not right something. I think even if Redbull would give to them their car, and could put in Mercedes wind tunnel still would show them 1sec slower as in real life.

[SSJ4]

yeah they were losing 6-7 tenths from qualy to sunday. now its around 3-4 tenths

qualifying so high up is detrimental. fernando definitely pushed harder at the beginning since he overtook checo which killed the tyres. compared to japan where he couldnt overtake anyone so settled in a consistent rhythm.

but i'm more akin to believe it was setup changes that made it worse on sunday. cos i remember fernando saying it's more front limited during the race

[xReVo]

I question myself: Aston had the worst degradation in China, so. WHY? the Japan upgrades is not working and we start to lose the progress like the same issues from second semester in last year? Mercedes Wind Tunnel is joking with us? Or maybe was situational? its to early for lose my hope to a big step foward in this year?

the updates I think have actually worked, and I'm one of the first to say that they don't always work (sometimes they're literally worse). I don't have great confidence for Imola, where all the teams will bring a large package of updates (Mercedes already seems to be in Miami), so we hope at least to keep the gaps unchanged

[diffuser]

I question myself: Aston had the worst degradation in China, so. WHY? the Japan upgrades is not working and we start to lose the progress like the same issues from second semester in last year? Mercedes Wind Tunnel is joking with us? Or maybe was situational? its to early for lose my hope to a big step foward in this year?

I also mentioned not at once , that very possible in Mercedes wind tunnel not right something. I think even if Redbull would give to them their car, and could put in Mercedes wind tunnel still would show them 1sec slower as in real life.

I think blaming the wind tunnel is like blaming a pencil for an ugly drawing. Merc, let you use the pencil but they don't supply the artists or the knowledge. The Artists are AMR employees and the knowledge is aero software models that they have built up over time of how flows work that they plug into the wind tunnel. I believe those 2 ingredients lead to how successful a team is in the windtunnel.

Remember there is nothing but the user's knowledge to tell them if what they're doing is correct or wrong. Sometimes you only figure out a month in that you've gone down the wrong path.

[-wkst-]

Agree, RBR has one of the oldest wind tunnels and nonetheless they build by far the best cars...

As Fallows said, an own wind tunnels gives you time and freedom for experiments and tests you want to do at a certain time (currently they can only go into the Merc tunnel at weekends). But overall the engineers are responsible to read the data they got from the wind tunnel. They are also the ones who have to set up the new wind tunnel in Silverstone that it works correctly...

But I don't think they have a wind tunnel problem, they have a strong 1-lap-car. They have to sort out their problems in race pace. Let's wait for Imola.

[Jambier]

Somehow being fast on saturday show that you have a fast car, a real fast car, a good aero.

And I believe it is easier then to progress on race pace, last year Ferrari struggled but the second half of season they fixed the sunday issues.

So I kinda believe that this AMR24 is a faster car than AMR23

[Joseki]

In the Pirelli-era there have been more fast cars fixing their tyre issues than slow cars getting much faster.
Hopefully the AMR24 will join the first group.

[OnEcRiTiCaL]

Agree, RBR has one of the oldest wind tunnels and nonetheless they build by far the best cars...

As Fallows said, an own wind tunnels gives you time and freedom for experiments and tests you want to do at a certain time (currently they can only go into the Merc tunnel at weekends). But overall the engineers are responsible to read the data they got from the wind tunnel. They are also the ones who have to set up the new wind tunnel in Silverstone that it works correctly...

But I don't think they have a wind tunnel problem, they have a strong 1-lap-car. They have to sort out their problems in race pace. Let's wait for Imola.

I didn't mean the problem is with the wind tunnel technologie. The Redbull wind tunnel older but everything works like as should. The Mercedes wind tunnel maybe have better technologie ,but more problematic . I hope not this the case, but a bit strange that last year Mercedes and Aston also had the same problem with correlation.

[Farnborough]

In the Pirelli-era there have been more fast cars fixing their tyre issues than slow cars getting much faster.
Hopefully the AMR24 will join the first group.

Seems a lot of truth in this. In approaching the change to 18" there was extensive view that they would need to very carefully design to exploit the far reaches of the tire performance .... the 13" era being a much more malleable one ... but few teams appear to have fully taken that on board ..... except Newey with his indicated application being responsible for this aspect SPECIFICALLY on their chassis.

Slowly, very slowly in reality, the other teams are beginning to understand the importance of this.

[xReVo]

How is it possible that Newey doesn't miss a car, he has won everywhere he has been (Williams, McLaren and now Redbull). It's not just a wind tunnel problem, many also underestimate CFD. In any case, with the new gallery you don't magically solve problems, the Mercedes gallery is already very sophisticated and the comfort stuff matters up to a certain point.

[PinkFloydPulse]

Maybe that’s exactly what will push them that little bit they need… you never know… plus, it cannot be a good and efficient process and workflow in their design and test department if they have to work only over weekends in someone elses windtunnel… basically, they have a handicap in this regard…

[Farnborough]

Maybe that’s exactly what will push them that little bit they need… you never know… plus, it cannot be a good and efficient process and workflow in their design and test department if they have to work only over weekends in someone elses windtunnel… basically, they have a handicap in this regard…

It's, absolutely, knowledge and how the design is approached.

Look at McL, still the development has ultimately come from their Cologne wind tunnel usage, not yet from the new facility.

The capability to leverage what you've got is fundamental, and would likely be amplified with dedicated facility .... not the excuse its often used for.

Its just too easy to "blame" something for poor performance, rather than really appreciate it's the thinking.

Good ideas cost exactly the same in gestation as poor one's

This 2024 AMR chassis does give the projection of a good platform though, pulled back from the hole they entered last year in development. This in itself showing they understand why that misstep took them away from target.

Ideas, design, application etc all get more brutall analysis when running at the front though, literally nowhere to hide.

Looks promising for some good front end battles in this years car.

[Nikosar]

Is that true that Aston Martin has the slower engine compared to McLaren and Merc ? do we have data that show it ?

The engine lacks straight-line speed, as expressed by all drivers.

For Miami : Andrea Stella Anticipating Big Jump by McLaren With Significant Update Right at the Doorstep

It will be another painful Grand Prix to watch....

[SSJ4]

Im not expect on the technical side of f1. But don’t McLaren and red bull run the longest gear ratios. Maybe that makes a difference?!

[-wkst-]

How is it possible that Newey doesn't miss a car, he has won everywhere he has been (Williams, McLaren and now Redbull). It's not just a wind tunnel problem, many also underestimate CFD. In any case, with the new gallery you don't magically solve problems, the Mercedes gallery is already very sophisticated and the comfort stuff matters up to a certain point.

Newey also needed time at RBR, only with the new rules 2009 (his 4th year) they started to be successfull.