2023 - McLaren Formula 1 Team

[CMSMJ1]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

[Lucky]

In Baku McLaren had given important signs of recovery, but in Miami things went much worse than expected. 17th place for Lando Norris, even 19th for Oscar Piastri, also plagued by a problem at the brake-by
The MCL60 continues to show all its limits, although the fund introduced in Azerbaian
The team headed by Andrea Stella will bring to Enzo and Dino Ferrari in Imola, home of the Grand Prix of Emilia Romagna, some small news. These should not have a decisive impact on the performance of the single-seaters color papa.
"At Imola there will be small developments, in reality, but only minor compared to the step we have to take to be constantly on points, which is our goal," said Stella.
"What will arrive at Imola was approved and started production one or two months ago, depending on the delivery time. So it's not that if you have a tuning problem you can react in the period between now and Imola".
"At the moment we have more problems related to the specifications of the car, the package, and the parts have their own design times, production, and so on. So what will happen at Imola is what we decided a month ago".
The most substantial package of news will arrive, but the team and drivers will have to wait for the months of June and July, ie the tour de force that Formula 1 will face before the summer break in August. For this everyone will have to grit their teeth and optimize the difficult package available tooking
"The next sizable package of updates will come before the summer break. "We are planning to distribute the updates between the Canadian Grand Prix and the British Grand Prix.
"We will definitely avoid bringing news to Austria, because that will be a weekend of Shootout Sprint and Sprint Race. And given the amount of updates we will bring we are not confident in bringing them to an event that will be very similar to that of Baku".
"In Baku we brought the new fund. But in those races... we will bring bigger things and the fund will be introduced in Britain, " Stella concluded.

[Lucky]

Savard
There are whispers too that McLaren might have some more reshuffles soon if things do not improve, as the shareholders are not happy with the way things are going. Rumours are rumours, so we will have to wait to see what actually happens…

[mwillems]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

I think it's important to note that having other interests doesn't necessarily hold back the F1 aspect and that this is an opinion.

In some ways they are the apprenticeship for F1 and a supply and evaluation of talent that can be brought into F1.

Do you have some inside knowledge? How do these other racing series or interests affect F1?

[CMSMJ1]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

I think it's important to note that having other interests doesn't necessarily hold back the F1 aspect and that this is an opinion.

In some ways they are the apprenticeship for F1 and a supply and evaluation of talent that can be brought into F1.

Do you have some inside knowledge? How do these other racing series or interests affect F1?

I have no inside knowledge. However when McLaren deposed Ron Dennis it started the decline and with the spreading of focus is has become a weaker F1 racing team.

Extreme E / Formula E - these, in my view, are advertising series - they don't really "compete" do they?
Indycar is different and it does maek sense to advertise in the US - but again, they bought into the SP team and it is not, again, my view, delivering a technical benefit to the F1 team.

F1 was the sole focus - they used to win* (or show consistent form to be able to win - was the last pukka win in 2012? probably with Lewis?) 10 years without winning is not good for the team.



*yes, I remember DR3 winning in Monza - but no-one is going to say that was due to the team bringing a car capable. it was as (nearly as ) much a fluke as was Gasly the year before or Ocon in Hungary

[Bill]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

Cmon dont be salty i know the Mclaren thing of past didn't workout but time to move on.for some perspective renault has six pu related failures with alonso last year so do you think Max would have won a champion with that.it's already race 5 Honda are the only manufacture to had yet blown an engine.the last time Max retired from a race due to a pu failure was 2019 in monza such is the level of excellence that other manufacture can dream off.in 2021 only Honda can better merc pu .so the long and short of it is that Max wouldn't be champion if not for Honda .no pu can match the power ,reliability ,efficiency and deployment of the Honda.

[eurwynf1]

In Baku McLaren had given important signs of recovery, but in Miami things went much worse than expected. 17th place for Lando Norris, even 19th for Oscar Piastri, also plagued by a problem at the brake-by
The MCL60 continues to show all its limits, although the fund introduced in Azerbaian
The team headed by Andrea Stella will bring to Enzo and Dino Ferrari in Imola, home of the Grand Prix of Emilia Romagna, some small news. These should not have a decisive impact on the performance of the single-seaters color papa.
"At Imola there will be small developments, in reality, but only minor compared to the step we have to take to be constantly on points, which is our goal," said Stella.
"What will arrive at Imola was approved and started production one or two months ago, depending on the delivery time. So it's not that if you have a tuning problem you can react in the period between now and Imola".
"At the moment we have more problems related to the specifications of the car, the package, and the parts have their own design times, production, and so on. So what will happen at Imola is what we decided a month ago".
The most substantial package of news will arrive, but the team and drivers will have to wait for the months of June and July, ie the tour de force that Formula 1 will face before the summer break in August. For this everyone will have to grit their teeth and optimize the difficult package available tooking
"The next sizable package of updates will come before the summer break. "We are planning to distribute the updates between the Canadian Grand Prix and the British Grand Prix.
"We will definitely avoid bringing news to Austria, because that will be a weekend of Shootout Sprint and Sprint Race. And given the amount of updates we will bring we are not confident in bringing them to an event that will be very similar to that of Baku".
"In Baku we brought the new fund. But in those races... we will bring bigger things and the fund will be introduced in Britain, " Stella concluded.

Where did you get this interview? Thanks for the update

[mwillems]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

I think it's important to note that having other interests doesn't necessarily hold back the F1 aspect and that this is an opinion.

In some ways they are the apprenticeship for F1 and a supply and evaluation of talent that can be brought into F1.

Do you have some inside knowledge? How do these other racing series or interests affect F1?

I have no inside knowledge. However when McLaren deposed Ron Dennis it started the decline and with the spreading of focus is has become a weaker F1 racing team.

Extreme E / Formula E - these, in my view, are advertising series - they don't really "compete" do they?
Indycar is different and it does maek sense to advertise in the US - but again, they bought into the SP team and it is not, again, my view, delivering a technical benefit to the F1 team.

F1 was the sole focus - they used to win* (or show consistent form to be able to win - was the last pukka win in 2012? probably with Lewis?) 10 years without winning is not good for the team.



*yes, I remember DR3 winning in Monza - but no-one is going to say that was due to the team bringing a car capable. it was as (nearly as ) much a fluke as was Gasly the year before or Ocon in Hungary

It's not that I want to say you're wrong, it's just that there were so many issues with the team whether they be organisational, in the leadership, ownership, facilities etc that I struggle to be able to say that yes, this is/was an issue. I mean if you look at it, if there are potential downsides, there are also potential upsides?

Extreme E and Formula E, I don't fully get the business case other than unless Mclaren are going electric. I recall seeing an article this month from some Mclaren Automotive bigwig saying that electric cars are making supercars boring, so who knows what is the next direction for the automotive.

Plus, if they start winning these championships then it does start to become a winning brand again. I get your point, not sure I agree but that's life eh!

[continuum16]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

I think it's important to note that having other interests doesn't necessarily hold back the F1 aspect and that this is an opinion.

In some ways they are the apprenticeship for F1 and a supply and evaluation of talent that can be brought into F1.

Do you have some inside knowledge? How do these other racing series or interests affect F1?

I have no inside knowledge. However when McLaren deposed Ron Dennis it started the decline and with the spreading of focus is has become a weaker F1 racing team.

Extreme E / Formula E - these, in my view, are advertising series - they don't really "compete" do they?
Indycar is different and it does maek sense to advertise in the US - but again, they bought into the SP team and it is not, again, my view, delivering a technical benefit to the F1 team.

F1 was the sole focus - they used to win* (or show consistent form to be able to win - was the last pukka win in 2012? probably with Lewis?) 10 years without winning is not good for the team.



*yes, I remember DR3 winning in Monza - but no-one is going to say that was due to the team bringing a car capable. it was as (nearly as ) much a fluke as was Gasly the year before or Ocon in Hungary

I see your point but realistically the decline began long before the deposition of Ron Dennis. Realistically the F1 team’s current trajectory began with the development of the MP4-28, which was a good couple of years before Whitmarsh, Dennis & Co. were run out of town. Even the automotive arm began with them in charge.

They did not buy into/start any full-time non-F1 teams until 2019 with Indycar, which they have only taken a majority stake in this year. IMO, the “diversifying the racing portfolio has been a distraction” argument doesn’t really explain anything that happened between 2013 and 2018, and there’s no real evidence that it has been a negative post-2018. Or any influence, positive or negative for that matter. If anything I see it as a way to keep staff on the greater McLaren Group payroll in the cost cap era.

[Mostlyeels]

They did not buy into/start any full-time non-F1 teams until 2019 with Indycar, which they have only taken a majority stake in this year. IMO, the “diversifying the racing portfolio has been a distraction” argument doesn’t really explain anything that happened between 2013 and 2018, and there’s no real evidence that it has been a negative post-2018. Or any influence, positive or negative for that matter. If anything I see it as a way to keep staff on the greater McLaren Group payroll in the cost cap era.

Quite a few talented engineers went over to Indy, due to the cost cap I assume (e.g. Ivan Roldan and Jarv). Seemed like a smart way to not lose them from the company.

[Lucky]

In Baku McLaren had given important signs of recovery, but in Miami things went much worse than expected. 17th place for Lando Norris, even 19th for Oscar Piastri, also plagued by a problem at the brake-by
The MCL60 continues to show all its limits, although the fund introduced in Azerbaian
The team headed by Andrea Stella will bring to Enzo and Dino Ferrari in Imola, home of the Grand Prix of Emilia Romagna, some small news. These should not have a decisive impact on the performance of the single-seaters color papa.
"At Imola there will be small developments, in reality, but only minor compared to the step we have to take to be constantly on points, which is our goal," said Stella.
"What will arrive at Imola was approved and started production one or two months ago, depending on the delivery time. So it's not that if you have a tuning problem you can react in the period between now and Imola".
"At the moment we have more problems related to the specifications of the car, the package, and the parts have their own design times, production, and so on. So what will happen at Imola is what we decided a month ago".
The most substantial package of news will arrive, but the team and drivers will have to wait for the months of June and July, ie the tour de force that Formula 1 will face before the summer break in August. For this everyone will have to grit their teeth and optimize the difficult package available tooking
"The next sizable package of updates will come before the summer break. "We are planning to distribute the updates between the Canadian Grand Prix and the British Grand Prix.
"We will definitely avoid bringing news to Austria, because that will be a weekend of Shootout Sprint and Sprint Race. And given the amount of updates we will bring we are not confident in bringing them to an event that will be very similar to that of Baku".
"In Baku we brought the new fund. But in those races... we will bring bigger things and the fund will be introduced in Britain, " Stella concluded.

Where did you get this interview? Thanks for the update

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-mc ... /10467586/

[McG]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

Totally agree about Red Bull would be winning with any engine in there. Red Bull have flattered their engine suppliers nearly forever. For a simple comparison we just need to look at Apha Tauri.

I think McLaren will stick with Mercedes. Unless there's something going on we don't know about like a massive change a Mercedes that is scaring customers, it's a no brainer to stick.

[AR3-GP]

delete: off topic

[mwillems]

I was glad to see the v2 Honda partnership and it was a massive failure from both parties. now that HRC have provided WCC/WDC level engines (to the team that could probably win with any engine in that chassis) I can see that it is Honda in demand, and not the pull of McLaren to bring them to the table.

What can McLaren offer Honda that, for example, Aston Martin can't?

Aston have a hunger right now and cannot rest on their laurels as there is no history of winning. McLaren have lost that laser focus on winning and it is a racing brand at the moment.

It needs to decide whether F1 and winning in F1 is the target and drop all the extraneous crap or it will go the way of the last garagiste teams - Tyrell, Brabham, Lotus (and Williams of late)

A Saudi buyout will kill it - and what remains won't be the same..a la Williams - but you see Williams is focussed on winning (or at least trying really bloody hard to be better)

Totally agree about Red Bull would be winning with any engine in there. Red Bull have flattered their engine suppliers nearly forever. For a simple comparison we just need to look at Apha Tauri.

Manor had a Mercedes engine in 2016 and scored 1 point all year. Does that mean the Merc engine was nothing special?

He made no such assertion, you're taking a reasonable answer to an extreme.

The RB was known to have a splendid chassis that for some time was held back by Renault power, this was demonstrated by the relative performance of the other Renault powered teams, such as Torro Rosso (AT), Renault and Mclaren through the years. The RB was almost always the highest performing car with any specific engine.

The chassis has been the piece that made the whole package look top notch, the engine was not able to do that. But if you'd have put that chassis with any other engine (forget the packaging practicalities) then that car would still have been a top package, or with the Merc engines of the day, possibly had a chance to win a few championships, although we don't know how much Merc were holding back to avoid the FIA trying to reign them in through regulation.

[McL-H]

10 years without winning is not good for the team.

*yes, I remember DR3 winning in Monza - but no-one is going to say that was due to the team bringing a car capable. it was as (nearly as ) much a fluke as was Gasly the year before or Ocon in Hungary

I am sorry, but I have to disagree. McLaren won Monza on merit. They were already leading without mayhem happening around them. They managed to get good starting positions for the sprint, did well to get even better starting positions for the main race and led the race from start to finish, with no one able to overtake Daniel or Lando. Comparing that 1-2 to lucky Ocon or lucky Gasly is just nonsense and very unfair imo.

It was a good car that was well suited to Monza and was very well capable of winning, as we’ve all seen.