2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[AR3-GP]

It was a crap weekend, just like RB last year here. There's not really anything more to say. It was wild to see it in real time however....Merc have not had deg that bad since 2013?

[Spoutnik]

It was a crap weekend, just like RB last year here. There's not really anything more to say. It was wild to see it in real time however....Merc have not had deg that bad since 2013?

RB finished 6th & 7th
They were not outraced by an AT and making Gasly looking like he's driving the RB19
In fact, as I said earlier without the issues for Ricciardo, Piastri and Leclerc (and we could add Tsunoda's mistake) Im not sure both cars would be in the points. Hamilton probably P10 and Russell P13/14

The cherry on the cake is the top speed issue which become embarassing

This radio was funny

[Luscion]

I do wonder if Vegas is going to be as bad for Merc as seems like it will be, looking back at the Monza GP which is probably the closest comparison to vegas, they didnt do too bad on the low downforce setup, actually managed to pass the upgraded Mclaren of Norris on the straight and finished 6th and 7th after starting 4th and 8th, Vegas does have longer straights though

[chrisc90]

They should have definitely started 1 car from the pits to try and learn what went wrong.
I don’t think it was all ride height related. Brazil isn’t a specifically bumpy track I don’t think.
If it was ride height related, there is probably decent problems when the car needs to be raised a fraction on some tracks. The floor should be designed to work at a range of levels - like other cars on the grid.

Does anyone have any pics showing ride height in comparison to others?

[Sieper]

You can’t really tell from pictures imho. They could indeed have maybe started one car from the pitlane, especially as they were now in eachothers way for a big part of the race.

[organic]

I do wonder if Vegas is going to be as bad for Merc as seems like it will be, looking back at the Monza GP which is probably the closest comparison to vegas, they didnt do too bad on the low downforce setup, actually managed to pass the upgraded Mclaren of Norris on the straight and finished 6th and 7th after starting 4th and 8th, Vegas does have longer straights though

The more critical aspect of Vegas will be tyre temps. Warmup specifically to achieve any 1-lap pace and to prevent graining in the race

[Bill_Kar]

While I get that starting from the pit lane was a risk, the team surely should know that with this setup is going to be a disaster, right? I mean it was clear as day.

Mercedes is really a conservative team in its heart when it comes to strategy affairs.

[Luscion]

They should have definitely started 1 car from the pits to try and learn what went wrong.
I don’t think it was all ride height related. Brazil isn’t a specifically bumpy track I don’t think.
If it was ride height related, there is probably decent problems when the car needs to be raised a fraction on some tracks. The floor should be designed to work at a range of levels - like other cars on the grid.

Does anyone have any pics showing ride height in comparison to others?

found some ride height pics from the front during quali, looking for other angles. But looking at it from the front Merc has the highest right height out of themselves, Ferrari, Mclaren and RB, with RB having the lowest.

from top to bottom - George, Sainz, Leclerc, Norris, Piastri, Perez

https://imgur.com/a/qAsJWyb

[Luscion]

Shovlin also seems to confirm it was setup issue yet again

We were very limited in what we could change on the car between the sprint and the Grand Prix today. Effectively, it's just the front wing angle and any electronic settings the driver can make from the cockpit. As such, we knew it would be difficult to make much of a step in performance, but we were always going to give it a go.

https://www.mercedesamgf1.com/reports/r ... o-paulo-gp

[Big Tea]

Makes me think that not only do Merc not know what the problem is, but they do not have a clue how to go about finding out.

there wasn't much to do about it between the sprint and the race.

I feel like they could've scored more points from the pitlane, but it's hard to give up p5/p8 on the grid.

Maybe they just did not know what to do. They had no known good start point that was different from the way the car had been run in practice. I suspect the sim would have been running full time, but if it was giving no different information than they were getting from the track it would not help. Start from the pitlane with a new engine and anything else needed may have been a good plan .

[SSScoffee]

They should have definitely started 1 car from the pits to try and learn what went wrong.
I don’t think it was all ride height related. Brazil isn’t a specifically bumpy track I don’t think.
If it was ride height related, there is probably decent problems when the car needs to be raised a fraction on some tracks. The floor should be designed to work at a range of levels - like other cars on the grid.

Does anyone have any pics showing ride height in comparison to others?

found some ride height pics from the front during quali, looking for other angles. But looking at it from the front Merc has the highest right height out of themselves, Ferrari, Mclaren and RB, with RB having the lowest.

from top to bottom - George, Sainz, Leclerc, Norris, Piastri, Perez

https://imgur.com/a/qAsJWyb

Were these taken in similar circumstances? It's like Austin Reversed. Red Bull lowest Merc Monster Truck

[Luscion]

They should have definitely started 1 car from the pits to try and learn what went wrong.
I don’t think it was all ride height related. Brazil isn’t a specifically bumpy track I don’t think.
If it was ride height related, there is probably decent problems when the car needs to be raised a fraction on some tracks. The floor should be designed to work at a range of levels - like other cars on the grid.

Does anyone have any pics showing ride height in comparison to others?

found some ride height pics from the front during quali, looking for other angles. But looking at it from the front Merc has the highest right height out of themselves, Ferrari, Mclaren and RB, with RB having the lowest.

from top to bottom - George, Sainz, Leclerc, Norris, Piastri, Perez

https://imgur.com/a/qAsJWyb

Were these taken in similar circumstances? It's like Austin Reversed. Red Bull lowest Merc Monster Truck

according to racefans these were all pics from the sprint race, could be at different times but everyone's tire deg looks about the same

My bad not the sprint, sprint quali

https://www.racefans.net/2023/11/04/202 ... -pictures/

[SuperCNJ]

If the W14's recent improvements in performance are based upon running the ride height lower than they thought they could get away with, this does not bode well for the W15 if they are only discovering this at the end of the season - unless of course they just ran the car far too conservatively, to pass the plank wear test.

[AR3-GP]

1 swallow does not make a summer and that applies to the result in Brazil. Merc is not slower than Alpha Tauri and Alpine. Just like last year, Brazil is an anomaly. They were supposed to be good here.

I don't think they will be as competitive in Vegas/AD but that is expected based on the car characteristics.

[Rodak]

I do wonder if Vegas is going to be as bad for Merc as seems like it will be, looking back at the Monza GP which is probably the closest comparison to vegas, they didnt do too bad on the low downforce setup, actually managed to pass the upgraded Mclaren of Norris on the straight and finished 6th and 7th after starting 4th and 8th, Vegas does have longer straights though

The more critical aspect of Vegas will be tyre temps. Warmup specifically to achieve any 1-lap pace and to prevent graining in the race

Looking at the 10 day weather forecast for Vegas reveals low temperatures in the 47°F (8°C) range midweek before the race, with lows of 42° a few days earlier. High temps during the day of 67°F and qualifying is at midnight local time. Twill be interesting.