2021 Belgian Grand Prix - Spa-Francorchamps, Aug 27 - 29

[sosic2121]

By your logic, wouldn't it mean Lewis wasn't lucky to avoid any contact in turn 1 in Hungary. Lewis did the job on saturday so he deserved to be away from any contact. it was Max's fault for only qualifying P2 that weekend. So Max wasn't unlucky. He was just not good enough to qualify further up.

We all know the reality in Hungary, Max was unlucky, Lewis was lucky to not be inviolved in the incident. Like is Spa Max had more luck on sunday than every other driver.

IIRC Max was the only driver that said he wanted to race.
Lewis said he doesn't want to!
If he was a bit braver maybe he would have had a race and maybe he would have won. But he didn't want to.
And he, and all his fans, think this isn't fair, and because of that rules shouldn't be followed.

Or he preferes that they haven't even tried to race, so race could be cancelled.

And all this because he wasn't fast enough.

At bigger speed with not that bad conditions as sunday, George Russell aquaplanned on the straight. It would probably be similar if not worse had they started. Also Max wanted to race because heck, he's got clear road ahed of him and needs every point to catch up on Lewis. Ofc he would want to race. He even said post race that he couldn't see safety car because of spray.

Similar thing happened in Korea 2010. Leaders in the championship didn't want for race to go ahead while Lewis who was behind in championship wanted to go racing.

It just stupid to think that conditions were good for racing. They were not.

I think that at first start they should have stayed on the track for maybe 30 minutes to try to clear the water, maybe without sc, but with VSC so cars can go faster.
I think that would be best chance for racing.
Some fans said rain wasn't that bad.

[Starscreamer]

At least I was witness shortest race in history

[Ryar]

Even Verstappen acknowledged he was gifted the win. And I admire him for it. Not his fault, but there are no mental gymnastics that can spin it any other way. There wasn’t a race.

Officially, there was a race and the result was announced, whether you like it or not. The guy who earned the position to be at the front, was the winner of it. I agree, there should be no Mental gymnastics on this.

By your logic, wouldn't it mean Lewis wasn't lucky to avoid any contact in turn 1 in Hungary. Lewis did the job on saturday so he deserved to be away from any contact. it was Max's fault for only qualifying P2 that weekend. So Max wasn't unlucky. He was just not good enough to qualify further up.

We all know the reality in Hungary, Max was unlucky, Lewis was lucky to not be inviolved in the incident. Like is Spa Max had more luck on sunday than every other driver.

Sorry I have no clue what you are trying to say.

[NathanOlder]

Officially, there was a race and the result was announced, whether you like it or not. The guy who earned the position to be at the front, was the winner of it. I agree, there should be no Mental gymnastics on this.

By your logic, wouldn't it mean Lewis wasn't lucky to avoid any contact in turn 1 in Hungary. Lewis did the job on saturday so he deserved to be away from any contact. it was Max's fault for only qualifying P2 that weekend. So Max wasn't unlucky. He was just not good enough to qualify further up.

We all know the reality in Hungary, Max was unlucky, Lewis was lucky to not be inviolved in the incident. Like is Spa Max had more luck on sunday than every other driver.

Sorry I have no clue what you are trying to say.

Sorry I was replying to this part

"Gifted? There is a reason for having a qualifying session and the driver that did the best job, deserved to get the win in the circumstances. What stopped Lewis from taking pole and be that person? It's not like Verstappen beached his car and someone created a red flag to rescue him and then got the win or that Verstappen took out the faster driver ahead of him and took the win."

[Wouter]

[WaikeCU]

We could look back to this event and see how much impact it had on the standings. Williams had a double point finish + one of'em ended on the podium as well. I can't see Haas or even Alfa Romeo able to fight back in the remainder of the season tbf. All because of running 2-3 official laps behind the SC so points could be awarded. None of em should be awarded points imo. Qualifying is qualifying and the race is the race.

[SiLo]

We could look back to this event and see how much impact it had on the standings. Williams had a double point finish + one of'em ended on the podium as well. I can't see Haas or even Alfa Romeo able to fight back in the remainder of the season tbf. All because of running 2-3 official laps behind the SC so points could be awarded. None of em should be awarded points imo. Qualifying is qualifying and the race is the race.

I believe the rules should be amended to allow points to be awarded at 50% race distance, and then 75% race distance (half, and full points respectively).

[piast9]

We could look back to this event and see how much impact it had on the standings. Williams had a double point finish + one of'em ended on the podium as well. I can't see Haas or even Alfa Romeo able to fight back in the remainder of the season tbf. All because of running 2-3 official laps behind the SC so points could be awarded. None of em should be awarded points imo. Qualifying is qualifying and the race is the race.

I completely agree. I think the regulations have to be changed. Scoring half points for races from 2 laps to 75% laps is not a good solution. There's a huge difference between the race that was red flagged after an hour of racing and that farce that took place on Sunday.

In my opinion half points should be awarded after a race which had, let's say 20% to 60% of laps "under green". That eliminates making rounds behind the SC as the point scoring activity. If that was not the case another solution has to be written in the rulebook. My ideas are:
- Some tiny points, like 5, 3, 1 for 1st, 2nd and 3rd, respectively.
- The sprint race instead of one of the free practice sessions (FP3 for example) at the next race with the grid order from the previous race standings with half points awarded, except from the last race in the calendar.
- Or any other idea - everything would be better than what we have witnessed last Sunday.

[sosic2121]

By your logic, wouldn't it mean Lewis wasn't lucky to avoid any contact in turn 1 in Hungary. Lewis did the job on saturday so he deserved to be away from any contact. it was Max's fault for only qualifying P2 that weekend. So Max wasn't unlucky. He was just not good enough to qualify further up.

We all know the reality in Hungary, Max was unlucky, Lewis was lucky to not be inviolved in the incident. Like is Spa Max had more luck on sunday than every other driver.

Sorry I have no clue what you are trying to say.

Yup. Max fully well known the risks, and should have qualified on pole if he wanted to avoid highly likely carnage from turn one at Hungary in the WET. He stayed on the outside too, just like he did at Silverstone and we know how that ended up! Also at Baku, RedBull skirted the tyre pressure rules, deliberately beating the system and running below prescribed pressures and again boom - into the wall. That's not bad luck, that's putting yourself into a position to get hurt. Just give it up Ryar.

I agree!
He should have known by now that Mercedes guys will play dirty and cause collisions to win.

And that tire pressure argument is false.
Their tires were never below prescribed pressure.

[PlatinumZealot]

It came back and bite them in the bocht. Because of their exploded tyre, these new stiffer sidewalls were introduced and guess what? They suit the Mercedes better. Damn lucky Mercedes!

[Sieper]

By your logic, wouldn't it mean Lewis wasn't lucky to avoid any contact in turn 1 in Hungary. Lewis did the job on saturday so he deserved to be away from any contact. it was Max's fault for only qualifying P2 that weekend. So Max wasn't unlucky. He was just not good enough to qualify further up.

We all know the reality in Hungary, Max was unlucky, Lewis was lucky to not be inviolved in the incident. Like is Spa Max had more luck on sunday than every other driver.

Sorry I have no clue what you are trying to say.

Yup. Max fully well known the risks, and should have qualified on pole if he wanted to avoid highly likely carnage from turn one at Hungary in the WET. He stayed on the outside too, just like he did at Silverstone and we know how that ended up! Also at Baku, RedBull skirted the tyre pressure rules, deliberately beating the system and running below prescribed pressures and again boom - into the wall. That's not bad luck, that's putting yourself into a position to get hurt. Just give it up Ryar.

Ah, we have now also found a way to blame Hungary on Max. Creative work. Bocht.

[flmkane]

Sorry I have no clue what you are trying to say.

Yup. Max fully well known the risks, and should have qualified on pole if he wanted to avoid highly likely carnage from turn one at Hungary in the WET. He stayed on the outside too, just like he did at Silverstone and we know how that ended up! Also at Baku, RedBull skirted the tyre pressure rules, deliberately beating the system and running below prescribed pressures and again boom - into the wall. That's not bad luck, that's putting yourself into a position to get hurt. Just give it up Ryar.

Ah, we have now also found a way to blame Hungary on Max. Creative work. Bocht.

Look, PZ is obviously biased but he's not blaming Hungary on max, he's just carrying out a thought experiment by applying Ryar's logical deduction analysis to a driver other than Hamilton.

It's neither fair nor rational to claim that he's blaming max for Hungary.

[flmkane]

We could look back to this event and see how much impact it had on the standings. Williams had a double point finish + one of'em ended on the podium as well. I can't see Haas or even Alfa Romeo able to fight back in the remainder of the season tbf. All because of running 2-3 official laps behind the SC so points could be awarded. None of em should be awarded points imo. Qualifying is qualifying and the race is the race.

I completely agree. I think the regulations have to be changed. Scoring half points for races from 2 laps to 75% laps is not a good solution. There's a huge difference between the race that was red flagged after an hour of racing and that farce that took place on Sunday.

In my opinion half points should be awarded after a race which had, let's say 20% to 60% of laps "under green". That eliminates making rounds behind the SC as the point scoring activity. If that was not the case another solution has to be written in the rulebook. My ideas are:
- Some tiny points, like 5, 3, 1 for 1st, 2nd and 3rd, respectively.
- The sprint race instead of one of the free practice sessions (FP3 for example) at the next race with the grid order from the previous race standings with half points awarded, except from the last race in the calendar.
- Or any other idea - everything would be better than what we have witnessed last Sunday.

How about just give points proportional proportional to race distance completed?

That means the winner of a two lap race at spa would have about 1.14 points and that would barely affect the championship. More so for the other guys, since they'd have even less points.

That means that if a farcical race live Spa 2021 happens again, at least the drivers will be able to put the event behind them and focus on the rest of the year.

[NathanOlder]

Sorry I have no clue what you are trying to say.

Yup. Max fully well known the risks, and should have qualified on pole if he wanted to avoid highly likely carnage from turn one at Hungary in the WET. He stayed on the outside too, just like he did at Silverstone and we know how that ended up! Also at Baku, RedBull skirted the tyre pressure rules, deliberately beating the system and running below prescribed pressures and again boom - into the wall. That's not bad luck, that's putting yourself into a position to get hurt. Just give it up Ryar.

Ah, we have now also found a way to blame Hungary on Max. Creative work. Bocht.

No its Ryar doing that.

Ryar Logic its called.

As my point earlier stated, according to Ryar Max did the work on Saturday in Belgium to deserve the points on Sunday with the non race. If this is the case, Lewis did the work on Saturday in Hungary to make sure he was out of the firing line on Sunday. So if Max didn't get lucky on sunday in Belgium, it would mean he didn't get unlucky in Hungary on Sunday. As both were set up from sunday.

Now I know he certainly was unlucky on Sunday in Hungary, and I know he was the most lucky in Belgium on sunday. But Ryar wants it both ways. Max was unlucky in Hungary and NOT lucky in Belgium.

[WaikeCU]

Well tbf, I'd say being on pole in Hungary is far more important than at Spa.

A) Hungary is not a track famous for overtaking
B) Spa leading out lap 1, you can actually tow around the cars behind you onto Raidillon and be overtaken at the end of it

Hungary was bad luck Max and too an extent it was also bad luck Lewis. Spa is just utter bullshit from management point of view. 10 drivers got lucky on Sunday. I'll bet all my savings, if we actually had a race, the top 10 wouldn't have been like the final result we got on Sunday. Can't just do 3 pretend race laps and call it a race. That's an absolute joke last Sunday.