2024 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

[Rootsap]

http://www.silverarrows.net/news/merced ... 15-issues/

they know they're missing something, they just don't know what...

[Farnborough]

Systemic, meaning .....

"Systemic describes what relates to or affects an entire system. For example, a systemic disease affects the entire body or organism, and systemic changes to an organization have an impact on the entire organization, including its most basic operations."

Or .....

"Some near synonyms to systemic are structural, comprehensive, inherent, pervasive, ingrained, and extensive."

They've eve taken some people out of the loop, ME for example, still it's the same. Even after drafting in JA now with very similar results and, using their OWN description ..... they don't understand it.

Thats not progress.

Their engine, gearbox, rear suspension is often working better in AM .... wind tunnel too. Something embedded is wrong there, within their operating sphere.

[TeamKoolGreen]

Mercedes will figure it out at some point in the next few races and they will be right there with Ferrari. Just as McLaren did.

Like they did in 2022 and 2023?

Won a race in 2022 and got 2nd in constructors in 23. He doom talk is overblown

[dia6olo]

Mercedes will figure it out at some point in the next few races and they will be right there with Ferrari. Just as McLaren did.

Like they did in 2022 and 2023?

Won a race in 2022 and got 2nd in constructors in 23. He doom talk is overblown

While they finished 2023 second in the constructors, by the time we got to the second half of the 2023 season Mercedes were fourth best and a good distance adrift of both 2nd & 3rd best Ferrari and McLaren.
Their second place finish owed a lot to Ferrari starting terribly not Mercedes doing well, even then let's not forget the Vegas grid incident which likely cost Ferrari second in the constructors.
Then there was McLaren who only addressed their car 10 races into that campaign.

Let's not kid ourselves here, Mercedes were dreadful in 2023 and the second place finish flattered them.
As for them wining a race in 2022, any of the top 4 or 5 teams are capable of wining a race if the circumstances play out, Ferrari did it in 2023 but they were still very poor in the grand scheme of things.

[venkyhere]

Someone help me understand what James Allison is saying https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-w ... /10587033/

I can only see "we can't get this right, how RedBull, Ferrari and McLaren have managed, so please make changes to chassis rules for 2026, so that we can be back in the game" said in a more tech-winded, beating-around-the-bush, manner.

[zibby43]

Someone help me understand what James Allison is saying https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-w ... /10587033/

I can only see "we can't get this right, how RedBull, Ferrari and McLaren have managed, so please make changes to chassis rules for 2026, so that we can be back in the game" said in a more tech-winded, beating-around-the-bush, manner.

Did you see where both George Russell and Max Verstappen said that the cars are too low and their spines are being destroyed by bumps? These ground effect cars derive performance from being as low to the ground and as stiffly sprung as possible. Did you also see where the drivers are all saying dirty air is worse?

Allison is basically saying you can achieve closer racing by other means, not just ground effect regs that aren't proving to be the greatest thing since sliced bread (for a variety of reasons).

Ferrari and McLaren have got it so right that they'll each finish 250+ points (minimum) behind RB in the WDC and WCC.

[CaribouBread]

Someone help me understand what James Allison is saying https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-w ... /10587033/

I can only see "we can't get this right, how RedBull, Ferrari and McLaren have managed, so please make changes to chassis rules for 2026, so that we can be back in the game" said in a more tech-winded, beating-around-the-bush, manner.

Even taken at face value and good faith, I wonder if he's reconsidering his team's insistence on TD039 that basically made the problem of "ground hugging aero" worse.

[Vanja #66]

Did you see where both George Russell and Max Verstappen said that the cars are too low and their spines are being destroyed by bumps? These ground effect cars derive performance from being as low to the ground and as stiffly sprung as possible. Did you also see where the drivers are all saying dirty air is worse?

The solution is quite simple - raise the rear and use softer springs...

[Cassius]

Did you see where both George Russell and Max Verstappen said that the cars are too low and their spines are being destroyed by bumps? These ground effect cars derive performance from being as low to the ground and as stiffly sprung as possible. Did you also see where the drivers are all saying dirty air is worse?

The solution is quite simple - raise the rear and use softer springs...

Which teams will never implement without FIA intervention.

[Sevach]

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... /10587338/

For the record Ferrari was also grounding/bouncing violently in turn 8 during qualifying causing instability for Charles and Bearman.

He also confirms the theory that the cars ride higher in the race, and even with that high ride height(or maybe specially with this high ride height) they had no performance.

[214270]

News for nxt year.

[venkyhere]

Someone help me understand what James Allison is saying https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-w ... /10587033/

I can only see "we can't get this right, how RedBull, Ferrari and McLaren have managed, so please make changes to chassis rules for 2026, so that we can be back in the game" said in a more tech-winded, beating-around-the-bush, manner.

Did you see where both George Russell and Max Verstappen said that the cars are too low and their spines are being destroyed by bumps? These ground effect cars derive performance from being as low to the ground and as stiffly sprung as possible. Did you also see where the drivers are all saying dirty air is worse?

Allison is basically saying you can achieve closer racing by other means, not just ground effect regs that aren't proving to be the greatest thing since sliced bread (for a variety of reasons).

Ferrari and McLaren have got it so right that they'll each finish 250+ points (minimum) behind RB in the WDC and WCC.

Did you see 2022 season ? How close the fight was for P1 for the first half of the season ? And how cars were able to follow very close ? Just because one team did a good job 'developing' the car from a 'first time right' concept , and others are lagging behind, doesn't make the regulation a failure. The fact that the wake is again dirty now, is because teams have found clever ways to exploit loopholes in the rules and make their cars faster, fallout being following closely is not as easy as 2022.
Allisons rant is classic sour grapes.

[venkyhere]

Someone help me understand what James Allison is saying https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-w ... /10587033/

I can only see "we can't get this right, how RedBull, Ferrari and McLaren have managed, so please make changes to chassis rules for 2026, so that we can be back in the game" said in a more tech-winded, beating-around-the-bush, manner.

Did you see where both George Russell and Max Verstappen said that the cars are too low and their spines are being destroyed by bumps? These ground effect cars derive performance from being as low to the ground and as stiffly sprung as possible. Did you also see where the drivers are all saying dirty air is worse?

Allison is basically saying you can achieve closer racing by other means, not just ground effect regs that aren't proving to be the greatest thing since sliced bread (for a variety of reasons).

Ferrari and McLaren have got it so right that they'll each finish 250+ points (minimum) behind RB in the WDC and WCC.

Did you see 2022 season ? How close the fight was for P1 for the first half of the season ? And how cars were able to follow very close ? Just because one team did a good job 'developing' the car from a 'first time right' concept , and others are lagging behind, doesn't make the regulation a failure. The fact that the wake is again dirty now, is because teams have found clever ways to exploit loopholes in the rules and make their cars faster, fallout being driving in the wake of the car ahead is not as easy as 2022.
Allisons rant is classic sour grapes.

[Hammerfist]

Someone help me understand what James Allison is saying https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/f1-w ... /10587033/

I can only see "we can't get this right, how RedBull, Ferrari and McLaren have managed, so please make changes to chassis rules for 2026, so that we can be back in the game" said in a more tech-winded, beating-around-the-bush, manner.

Did you see where both George Russell and Max Verstappen said that the cars are too low and their spines are being destroyed by bumps? These ground effect cars derive performance from being as low to the ground and as stiffly sprung as possible. Did you also see where the drivers are all saying dirty air is worse?

Allison is basically saying you can achieve closer racing by other means, not just ground effect regs that aren't proving to be the greatest thing since sliced bread (for a variety of reasons).

Ferrari and McLaren have got it so right that they'll each finish 250+ points (minimum) behind RB in the WDC and WCC.

Did you see 2022 season ? How close the fight was for P1 for the first half of the season ? And how cars were able to follow very close ? Just because one team did a good job 'developing' the car from a 'first time right' concept , and others are lagging behind, doesn't make the regulation a failure. The fact that the wake is again dirty now, is because teams have found clever ways to exploit loopholes in the rules and make their cars faster, fallout being following closely is not as easy as 2022.
Allisons rant is classic sour grapes.

Maybe Allison has an ulterior motive with his comments but I can’t disagree. These current cars concepts are not what f1 should be about. I even heard Perez complain about bouncing last weekend. So including the best car they all have ride/bouncing issues. Whenever you ride onboard with any driver you can hear the car hitting the ground and the sound it makes is reminiscent of a --- box road car that rattles a lot. This is supposed to be the pinnacle of motor sports ffs.

[cplchanb]

News for nxt year.

well nothing is stopping bono from getting an epiphany and deciding to join ferrari on his own accord. it would be a massive coincidence tho...