Double Points @ Final Race

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Phil
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Sure, but if you make the last events more important by 'adding a playoff style event' - you're effectively minimizing the impact on all the previous events. In essence, all you are doing is shifting your viewers from one event to another. If you're doubling the event - the people who in previous years perhaps didn't watch the last race because the WDC was already a 'done deal' might skip on the second last event now if they know it's the last one that will ultimately count and all is decided. In this scenario, all you've done is shift the focus and upsetting the other countries event by limiting their appeal.

Not that I believe that the majority of serious racing enthusiasts watch the sport this way. If numbers are droping due to a boring fest - they should be thinking up solutions to make the races more interesting / more dramatic. They could start for example by taking a good look at the tyres (and what they want to achieve with them), the points system (perhaps decrease the gap between win and the rest of the field to narrow the gap) and as they're already doing, find a way to create a more 'level playing field' by setting up rules to maintain a cost limit for all teams that works.

It would also be good if we had tracks that distinguish itself more from the rest - so that teams might have an advantage on some tracks, but less on others, so that we would have more teams fighting for wins, and not a singular team racking up win after win. This would create far more excitement and a larger audience than adding a double-points system for the last event.
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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First driver to speak out against it?

http://www.gpupdate.net/en/f1-news/3043 ... pt-absurd/

CHT
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Abu dhabi must have paid fia handsomely for this.

donskar
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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timbo wrote:
donskar wrote:no, No, NO, NO. Respectfully, you are wrong.

The "sport" exists because of the advertisers and the media they use to push their brands through exposure before, during, and after the races. They do NOT care about fans, when "fans" means enthusiasts like us. What they care about are "eyeballs," total number of TV viewers, internet impressions, etc. Some demographic groups are more important than others, but racing geeks like us is NOT one of those groups

We should have seen some sort of artifical interest-builder coming some weeks ago. That was when Red Bull sponsor Infiniti's CMO (Chief Marketing Officer) expressed his concern that Red Bull's domination would dilute the impact and value of Infiniti's sponsorship. Alarm bells sounded. That is why this abortion of a rules change took place: to maintain audience numbers in a series that, frankly, has become a series of boring processions to the average viewer (none of whom read this forum). F1 is a marketing vehicle. Remember:
It's not a sport, it's a business.
It's not a sport, it's a business.
It's not a sport, it's a business.
It's not a sport, it's a business.
It's not a sport, it's a business.
While you are correct on the motivation behind that decision you miss the problem. The question is, will the double points rule win more viewers?
I highly double. Maybe it will get some occasional watcher for one GP but if it's p!sses off the core audience, you may end up loosing on the grand scheme. And if casual viewer may know that all is decided in the final race he will most likely skip others. What's next? If some more GPs are awarded additional points we will end up with a system like non-championship races from 70s-80s.
Right now it doesn't seem like a well thought out idea.
Respectfully, we are not the "core audience." We are, to overstate for effect, the lunatic fringe. F1 sponsors in general, like all sponsors in general, are after masses. They do not care about a relative handful of fans who wait with baited breath for the newest 5 millimeter change to a gurney flap. Their goal, and I agree they may fail to achieve it, is to avoid the situation where the championship is decided well before the last race. And let's be honest: in practical (not mathematical) terms, the driver's championship was decided well before the final race.
Enzo Ferrari was a great man. But he was not a good man. -- Phil Hill

donskar
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Long ago and far away I had the mere dumb luck to be at the right place at the right time TWICE -- at two Fortune 25 companies that sponsored F1 teams. We NEVER discussed "F1 fans" as a desirable target demographic. Frankly, we did not think people like me were an important demographic at all. We weren't out to sell supercomputers or advanced engineering software -- we were pushing PCs and printers. To the masses. When I spoke up for what we would probably call "core fans" I was taken aside and told, gently, to shut up. This specific experience (and 20 years in high tech marketing) is the background to my comments in this thread.
Enzo Ferrari was a great man. But he was not a good man. -- Phil Hill

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SectorOne
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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“At first it was planned to be awarded double points for the last four races,” revealed Red Bull advisor Helmut Marko, which would have meant that races Russia, the United States, Brazil and Abu Dhabi would be double points events. But this has not transpired.
http://grandprix247.com/2013/12/10/vett ... le-season/
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astracrazy
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Helmut Marko - this man. He has never said anything sensible, god knows what he advises at red bull i guess they just don't listen to him

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Sebp
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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astracrazy wrote:Helmut Marko - this man. He has never said anything sensible, god knows what he advises at red bull i guess they just don't listen to him
May I suggest you read this article before you claim that nobody listens to Helmut Marko:
http://joesaward.wordpress.com/2010/06/ ... it-matter/

As much as I would like it to be true...
No smartphone was involved in creating this message.

timbo
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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donskar wrote:Respectfully, we are not the "core audience." We are, to overstate for effect, the lunatic fringe. F1 sponsors in general, like all sponsors in general, are after masses. They do not care about a relative handful of fans who wait with baited breath for the newest 5 millimeter change to a gurney flap. Their goal, and I agree they may fail to achieve it, is to avoid the situation where the championship is decided well before the last race. And let's be honest: in practical (not mathematical) terms, the driver's championship was decided well before the final race.
I think you underestimate the the demographics of F1 fans. Sure, not everybody is that interested in technical side of F1, but many have relatively good knowledge of the sport.
Here's a thread from autosport.com forum with a poll
http://forums.autosport.com/topic/19125 ... 14-season/
Over 90% is against the new rules.


PS, to put question otherwise -- how many "casual" fans F1 has?
I don't think that many.

xpensive
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Sadly enough, I think Don's perfectly right on this one, the majority of the spectators, let alone the television audience, are not into technical details. What I have noticed at the few F1 races I have attended though, is wannabees and weekend-xperts.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

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Sebp
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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No smartphone was involved in creating this message.

timbo
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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xpensive wrote:Sadly enough, I think Don's perfectly right on this one, the majority of the spectators, let alone the television audience, are not into technical details. What I have noticed at the few F1 races I have attended though, is wannabees and weekend-xperts.
Aaaand?

You think more folks like that would be won with such rules?

Statistics fans, how many championships were won on penultimate race? Off the top of my head -- 2005 (EDIT: wrong on this one), 2006 (almost), 2009.

xpensive
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Aaaand I understand where the FIA and MrE is coming from, the petrolheads are too few to feed this circus and the money-spending cannon-fodder want xcitement to the last race, discussing the latest front-wing tweak simply doesn't do it for them.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

timbo
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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xpensive wrote:Aaaand I understand where the FIA and MrE is coming from, the petrolheads are too few to feed this circus and the money-spending cannon-fodder want xcitement to the last race, discussing the latest front-wing tweak simply doesn't do it for them.
I ask again, what does new system change?
Out of last Vettel's streak it would influence outcome of only the last year. And it would change absolutely nothing as far as season finals go -- out of Vettel's 4, 2 were decided at the last race and 2 were decided before the penultimate.

There's only a small percentage of championships which were decided at the second to last race. Usually, if there's a true domination it's decided long before and if it's a battle it goes down to the wire.

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SectorOne
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Re: Double Points @ Final Race

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Whether some of the fans discuss front wing designs or not is irrelevant. Discussing quite big rules about Formula 1 is way more mainstream then that.
"If the only thing keeping a person decent is the expectation of divine reward, then brother that person is a piece of sh*t"