2021 Belgian Grand Prix - Spa-Francorchamps, Aug 27 - 29

[Hoffman900]

I don’t think you can blame the corner for rain starting as drivers reached it on their qualifying laps.

There are plenty of corners on the calendar that would result in as big of crashes given those circumstances.

[214270]

mediocre drivers getting caught out by the track conditions is what happened (it started to rain)

I think also the climb angle may be a factor; i don’t know whether they could see the mayhem ahead.

[Wouter]

[Jolle]

What about 90s style helmet cam?

Of course 1994 is also famous for not having eau rouge. (And seeing the accidents from today and two years ago, I think it might be time to say goodbye once again)

I'm quite sure that they'll exhaust all other possible solutions as there are plenty. It is important to not act upon emotion so drastically, especially if such emotion is as strong as that of shock or horror. The biggest issue with the eau rouge-raidillon section is that cars that lose traction end up crashing and rebounding off the barrier and onto the track because it is so close the track, and cars stopping o the track whilst others approach is the most dangerous situation in motorsport. This is sadly what happened in the Hubert crash and the Aitken crash. Another case is this W series where drivers go off the track ad others follow straight on with little deterrence/deceleration even in a full spin. Thus, a good change would be to remove/reprofile the tarmac run-off and to extend the runoff area on the outside of the corner exit- the issue is that there is a slope right behind the fan section after the barrier and a house, but if they put their minds to it they could find solutions for slope stability. In the Spa 24h there were quite scary accidents at the bus stop when the weather changed suddenly and drivers were on slicks. But there is a lot of run-off to the side and beyond the first part of the chicane. But there are other solutions ofcourse.

I wasn’t (or aren’t) acting upon emotion, I’ve been saying it for years. Eau Rouge is one of the most deadly corners on the current calendar and has serious issues that can’t be fixed with extra runoff or something like that (because of the situation right around the corner) and other measures to make the combination safer have been looked at extensively by many experts over the years and in particular after Huberts crash. The “ignition” of both accidents was quite similar, the W series crash was lucky in that sense that the pileup happened earlier then at the F2 race in 2019.

This corner combination is just waiting to take someone’s life again.

[jjn9128]

I wasn’t (or aren’t) acting upon emotion, I’ve been saying it for years. Eau Rouge is one of the most deadly corners on the current calendar and has serious issues that can’t be fixed with extra runoff or something like that (because of the situation right around the corner) and other measures to make the combination safer have been looked at extensively by many experts over the years and in particular after Huberts crash. The “ignition” of both accidents was quite similar, the W series crash was lucky in that sense that the pileup happened earlier then at the F2 race in 2019.

This corner combination is just waiting to take someone’s life again.

IMO the '94 solution of a tighter left at the base of the hill is where the track should go. Forces them to brake, slows the speed at the top of the hill, it's potentially a place to overtake, means there can be a differential of speed up to Le Combes if a car gets it slightly wrong. Sure the speed at the top of the hill isn't so great, but so what.

In the W-series case Visser was extremely lucky the last car which came steaming in Rosset style hit the back of the car not the cockpit.

[maxxer]

Hope everyone is having a good Friday, what's the weekend looking like after Friday practice? Currently at carfest south.

Carfest? We went to the first one. Great time had by all.

For the weekend, we are clay shooting on Sunday morning and having Sunday lunch in the local. Will watch the "highlights" in the evening unless I can find a stream to watch on my phone. Will try to watch qualifying tomorrow but yeah, whatever.

First race after the summer break and you go clay shooting ?

[Wouter]

As for the weather: The F3 is currently unable to start as the helicopter cannot take off due to low visibility.

[TNTHead]

Looks like we'll get a wet qualifying and a drying track and/or occasional showers during the race.

Still the question which setup is best for these conditions: high or low downforce? I would gamble for a in between setup.

[Wouter]

🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧



🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧 🌧

[Mr.S]

You will roughly end up in a similar position - You gain more on S2 with a bigger wing but you lose on S1 & S3. I will normally suggest a lower downforce set-up as a smaller wing, slipstream & DRS gives huge advantage to the car behind & leave the front-runner a sitting duck if the pace of 2 cars are roughly equal. But then you get the added variable of rain & a stint with inters or wet in a track as long as Spa can mean multiple seconds here & there. In wet & changing conditions, the higher downforce package should work best. I think Bottas with his penalty will go for a lower downforce package, Hamilton higher. Verstappen possibly lower if his pace is less than that of the Mercedes, don't know about Perez or the mid-field guys !

[Jolle]

You will roughly end up in a similar position - You gain more on S2 with a bigger wing but you lose on S1 & S3. I will normally suggest a lower downforce set-up as a smaller wing, slipstream & DRS gives huge advantage to the car behind & leave the front-runner a sitting duck if the pace of 2 cars are roughly equal. But then you get the added variable of rain & a stint with inters or wet in a track as long as Spa can mean multiple seconds here & there. In wet & changing conditions, the higher downforce package should work best. I think Bottas with his penalty will go for a lower downforce package, Hamilton higher. Verstappen possibly lower if his pace is less than that of the Mercedes, don't know about Perez or the mid-field guys !

If it’s a wet qualifying, could be a good opportunity for Verstappen to gamble on a wet race, with full wet setup. When it is dry tomorrow, get the car out of parc ferme, change the PU and take the penalties and have a low drag car.

[LM10]

As for the weather: The F3 is currently unable to start as the helicopter cannot take off due to low visibility.

Leclerc needs to take it a bit easier in practice sessions. Too many unnecessary crashes lately.

[SiLo]

Does anyone have any long run data? I've been looking around but I can't find any.

[politburo]

Of course 1994 is also famous for not having eau rouge. (And seeing the accidents from today and two years ago, I think it might be time to say goodbye once again)

I'm quite sure that they'll exhaust all other possible solutions as there are plenty. It is important to not act upon emotion so drastically, especially if such emotion is as strong as that of shock or horror. The biggest issue with the eau rouge-raidillon section is that cars that lose traction end up crashing and rebounding off the barrier and onto the track because it is so close the track, and cars stopping o the track whilst others approach is the most dangerous situation in motorsport. This is sadly what happened in the Hubert crash and the Aitken crash. Another case is this W series where drivers go off the track ad others follow straight on with little deterrence/deceleration even in a full spin. Thus, a good change would be to remove/reprofile the tarmac run-off and to extend the runoff area on the outside of the corner exit- the issue is that there is a slope right behind the fan section after the barrier and a house, but if they put their minds to it they could find solutions for slope stability. In the Spa 24h there were quite scary accidents at the bus stop when the weather changed suddenly and drivers were on slicks. But there is a lot of run-off to the side and beyond the first part of the chicane. But there are other solutions ofcourse.

I wasn’t (or aren’t) acting upon emotion, I’ve been saying it for years. Eau Rouge is one of the most deadly corners on the current calendar and has serious issues that can’t be fixed with extra runoff or something like that (because of the situation right around the corner) and other measures to make the combination safer have been looked at extensively by many experts over the years and in particular after Huberts crash. The “ignition” of both accidents was quite similar, the W series crash was lucky in that sense that the pileup happened earlier then at the F2 race in 2019.

This corner combination is just waiting to take someone’s life again.

Let's just agree to disagree then. The issue with the barrier is inarguable, and the only solution cannot be to alter the actual corner when there is a clear issue with barrier proximity, they already extended the runoff and tyre barrier on the inside of the Raidillon section after Hubert's car had crashed in 2019 now it is time to extend the runoff and the outside barrier for the Raidillon section.

The corner itself or it's geometry cannot be solely the issue, and I mean that with all due respect to the drivers who had their lives affected by the corner but plenty of vehicles have done 10s of thousands of laps flat out at that corner even in wet conditions including today in the F3 race going side by side, all this in the past month alone - and there have 2 big incidents at that corner due to barrier proximity, which is an issue not unique to eau rouge at this same track. Imagine a car smashing into the barrier at no name corner and spinning back on track with others following closely behind - it'd be nightmarish, there is so little runoff and room for error.

[politburo]

Does anyone have any long run data? I've been looking around but I can't find any.

From Lawrence Barretto on the official F1 website.