Mercedes AMG F1 W06

[Pierce89]

You guys seen this? http://www.skysports.com/f1/news/32420/ ... cy-in-2015

Apparently Ferrari picked up 40hp in fuel + combustion chamber optimization alone. Merc seems to have gained at least 40hp from their 2016-spec engine, a lot of that coming from the combustion concept.

No other Merc customer team could ever beat the factory PU and that is not for the fact that they receive engines from another batch, or the possibility of hidden powerful engine modes Merc team is using, no, one reason is having another fuel and lubes company (I also read the McLaren team official who was saying they were 20-30 HP down on power last year and the reason was their supplier Mobil 1) but the most important one is the fact that Merc engine is tailored for the Petronas fuels and lubes !

By the way could someone tell me which fuels use the customer teams?
Williams has Petrobras, Lotus - Total (I think) and FI I don't know ...
Same with the gearboxes, please ...

All Merc teams now use Petronas fuel and lube. The customer team's sponsors are only sponsors.

[FrukostScones]

is the pre-chamber ignition thing also something like creatively bypassing the fuel flow limit?

What would that even mean?

Like that but post injector...: http://www.grandprixtimes.com/news/display/10226

[Hail22]

Singapore GP - Qualifying

[.poz]

"The trick: a double injection together with a pre-chamber ignition.

Is this case only little fuel is injected into the (main) chamber, which would not ignite the mix using a standard spark. Therefore, the pre-chamber gets enriched with another extremely small quantity of fuel, but which in turn gets ignited by a spark plug in the pre-chamber.

The result: the hot gas strands inflame the meagre mix in the rest of the cylinder.
Especially under partial load, Mercedes may save fuel, which they may then spend at full throttle passages for more power."

Question: how do they do it with a single injector per cylinder ? How they "move" the fuel/air mixture form the first injection (the meagre mix) from the pre-chamber to the combustion chamber ?

Code: Select all

5.10.2 There may only be one direct injector per cylinder and no injectors are permitted upstream of the intake valves or downstream of the exhaust valves.

[weissblau]

I would think this is something similar to how a modern diesel works. Making a pre-injection (and in this case also ignition-spark) before the main-injection that creates a turbulense that helps the main-injection to burn more efficient. Of course this forces the need for very precise injection control. I doubt there is a "seperate" pre-chamber..

[hurril]

They are allowed up to five separate injection events per power cycle as far as I understand it. (And to my best recollection.)

[bill shoe]

i think direct injectors for street cars have several different spray patterns that change the direction and pattern/shape of the spray. They are activated by using different fuel pressures into the injector. I've heard up to 5 distinct sprays at different fuel pressures. Between timing the spray and using the different spray patterns you can target sending different amounts of fuel to different locations in the cylinder. So when the spark plug goes off you've already arranged it so there is stoichiometric air/fuel mixture near the plug and leaner elsewhere. Obviously easier said than done...

[.poz]

[quote="weissblau" I doubt there is a "seperate" pre-chamber..[/quote]

i think direct injectors for street cars have several different spray patterns that change the direction and pattern/shape of the spray. They are activated by using different fuel pressures into the injector. I've heard up to 5 distinct sprays at different fuel pressures. Between timing the spray and using the different spray patterns you can target sending different amounts of fuel to different locations in the cylinder. So when the spark plug goes off you've already arranged it so there is stoichiometric air/fuel mixture near the plug and leaner elsewhere. Obviously easier said than done...

This make sense. I was thinking about a diesel-like pre-chamber and can't figure how to inject fuel in the man combustion chamber.

[.poz]

Just an idea about merc performance in Singapore:

It looks like the W06 doesn't like hot temperature: Sepang, Hungary an Singapore are the hottest races in the season.

It's possible that they chosen to build a car with smaller radiators (and a better aerodynamic) and have to tune down the engine on 3 circuits to have an advantage on the others 16 ?

[Jordan44]

Just an idea about merc performance in Singapore:

It looks like the W06 doesn't like hot temperature: Sepang, Hungary an Singapore are the hottest races in the season.

It's possible that they chosen to build a car with smaller radiators (and a better aerodynamic) and have to tune down the engine on 3 circuits to have an advantage on the others 16 ?

I think Hungary can be dismissed on the ground Rosberg's pace that entire weekend was mediocre. Hamilton was by some margin the quicker driver, but because of his mistake never got to challenge Ferrari.

I wouldn't say it's down to the engine either, I think that it's to do with how the car works it's tyres.

[PlatinumZealot]

Singapore is very bumpy and it has true high traffic streets also. Remember lewis said he could heat his tyres up to temperature on his out laps but could not get further increase in his hot laps. His tyres actually cooled down. This is because the mercedes was not working the tyre as hard as the other cars. It could be scrub radius it could be the front wheel damper setup.... A lot of things. We know ther aero balance was there though. Hamilton confirmed he had good balance.

[SiLo]

I expect Mercedes to top the timesheet in all the sessions in Japan. I'd be surprised if that wasn't just a one off because they completely missed the mark with setup.

[mrluke]

Singapore is very bumpy and it has true high traffic streets also. Remember lewis said he could heat his tyres up to temperature on his out laps but could not get further increase in his hot laps. His tyres actually cooled down. This is because the mercedes was not working the tyre as hard as the other cars. It could be scrub radius it could be the front wheel damper setup.... A lot of things. We know ther aero balance was there though. Hamilton confirmed he had good balance.

But it wasn't just Mercedes, none of the merc powered teams did very well.

The only thing I can think of is that the merc teams have a set up which is much kinder to their tyres due to the higher power available (maybe?) meaning they can struggle to get enough heat into them on some tracks.

But....difficult to explain why so good at Monaco and so bad at Singapore.

Is it maybe heat and mguh/k related? I haven't seen side by side laps with the Ferrari to see where they lose out but heard its in the acceleration zones?

Odd.

[Hail22]

Suzuka Japan - Thursday

[siskue2005]

Is it maybe heat and mguh/k related? I haven't seen side by side laps with the Ferrari to see where they lose out but heard its in the acceleration zones?

Odd.

yes, traction zones