Mercedes GP 2011

[Mr.S]

That is because he does not like publicity of the press. He prefers a factory role. He said it himself,he does not like being on track.


Last year we thought the same that RB7 with all that in-season will be slow at the begining but it was the fastest car by 1 full second.

[Ferraripilot]

That is because he does not like publicity of the press. He prefers a factory role. He said it himself,he does not like being on track.


Last year we thought the same that RB7 with all that in-season will be slow at the begining but it was the fastest car by 1 full second.

What gimmick do they (RB) have left? DDD? no. EBD? no. Newey is just now getting going on things while everyone else is waste deep in building and very possibly with answers to whatever the FiA has up their sleeves in regards to exhaust exit (I believe they meet for discussion this Sunday with exhaust exit being part of the discussion). RB8 will not be RB7 or RB6. The new exhaust regs will be a game changer for Red Bull's exhaust based paradigm IMO.

[Byronrhys]

Do you really think Bob Bell,an out & out technical guy & aerodynamist is suited for this role. Personally I think this will be the most stupid appointment ever & I dont think Mercedes can be that stupid.

Sweetheart, he's already been a Team Principal, he's been around the block more times than Brawn ever has and his even hand was the one who picked Renault out of the toilet after Singapore 2008 and kept them in the sport.

he had to step in a position he never liked....which he never was very good at.

I can't see what this assessment is based on, but I suppose we'll have to bow to your obvious and considerable knowledge on the subject.

Munudeges is talking so much S%$#te, leave Bell where he is and let Ross work his magic.

[marcush.]

of course the concepts for 2013 and 2014 are worked on at this time.It´s simply impossible to wait for the rulemakers ,especially when things get swapped aand changed around 4 cylinder 6 cylinder ....maybe they come back to 8 during 2013? At some point you have to decide and for example the tyre was something the teams could not really integrate in the design for 2011 because the first test was well after the design freeze for the tub and major components.this will change for 2012 but only when pirelli does not change too much but at least the teams have a full year of work with the manufacturer under their belts and will adjust their layouts to get more out of the tyres if they feel they left something on the table..

[raymondu999]

From an article in Autosport Plus (subscription service)

"It's important to have an easy connection between all the elements," Brawn says. "Geoff has to make the aero group, vehicle dynamics group and controls group work even more effectively than it is now.

"Aldo has to make the design, engineering and R&D group work more effectively, and Bob will weld the two areas together."

"We've got some pretty reasonably-minded people. If we had difficult people I'd be concerned, but I don't think we do."

[xpensive]

Munudeges is talking so much S%$#te, leave Bell where he is and let Ross work his magic.

Oh, but I think Ross Brawn, if that's who you're referring to, has already displayed quite enough of his true "magic" at MGP.

Fact is that I'm a Mercedes fan myself, why I'm tormented to behold this display of utter management-incompetence.

[Mr.S]

Munudeges is talking so much S%$#te, leave Bell where he is and let Ross work his magic.

Oh, but I think Ross Brawn, if that's who you're referring to, has already displayed quite enough of his true "magic" at MGP.

Fact is that I'm a Mercedes fan myself, why I'm tormented to behold this display of utter management-incompetence.

Well they had no TD for a change & mis-interpretated the RRA,had lesser resources than the other team. Mercedes coming,new drivers,does take a while.

W01's failure was fairly acceptable & that car was no dog either. W02 was a huge dissapointment with Mercedes having no idea about what was right & what was not. It was a HUGE FLOP,from every angle.

Mercedes have taken some steps. Costa-Willis joining Bell.Bigois will probably get the boot or if he understand the message he will go away on his own. Ross Brawn has made it abundantly clear that Willis & Costa will head the aero & mechanical side.

The least we should do is give Mercedes time.W03(seeing what impact Bob Bell has & what input Costa-Willis will have on in-season development).

5-6 podiums atleast,double the number of points & the 3rd spot or atleast within 30-50 points of it SHOULD be the aim.

FINALLY W04 with this so-called dream team should be a race winning car,if not title winning,atleast 2 race victories. Otherwise in 2013 Mercedes should throw in the towel or fire Brawn-Haug.

For me Brawn deserves 2 more years. He has put some effot. We should give him some time to see if it works.

[Mr.S]

That is because he does not like publicity of the press. He prefers a factory role. He said it himself,he does not like being on track.


Last year we thought the same that RB7 with all that in-season will be slow at the begining but it was the fastest car by 1 full second.

What gimmick do they (RB) have left? DDD? no. EBD? no. Newey is just now getting going on things while everyone else is waste deep in building and very possibly with answers to whatever the FiA has up their sleeves in regards to exhaust exit (I believe they meet for discussion this Sunday with exhaust exit being part of the discussion). RB8 will not be RB7 or RB6. The new exhaust regs will be a game changer for Red Bull's exhaust based paradigm IMO.

As do Mclaren. Silverstone showed Mclaren benefitted as much from EBD as did Red Bulls if not more.

Who knows if Newey will not come with another amazing Exhaust idea??? Some tweak in the rules,bagpipe,octopus or whatever???

The only diadvantage which I see is that RBR might have reached its peak of development & evolution with RB5/6/7 & Newey maybe has to come with a completely different cars.

With low noses Mercedes/Brawn have substantial experience & Mclaren have the lowest nose of the Top 5-6 teams. So who knows who will benefit more. Anything can happen. Anybody of the TOP 3 with Mercedes as the dark horse. All I am saying is let's not discount Red Bull,everyone made the same mistake last year too. Newey is a fantastic guy.

[Cocles]

Fact is that I'm a Mercedes fan myself...

Dude... I-- WHAT?!? I-- how...

You've read your own posts... right?

I know I'm new here, but that also gives me the benefit of fresh eyes.

X, I have never seen someone hate a car brand the way you and Mun hate Mercedes Benz. Frankly, it blows my mind the amount of energy the two you spending voicing that hate, and your contempt towards its fans. At first I thought it was just passionate fandom for some other rival team, but then I read the SLS thread, and YEESH.

I know I might be scolded for this, but if that happens, I might as well be reprimanded for saying the sky is blue. This isn't criticism, nor even necessarily judgement. It's just fact. You and Mun hate Mercedes-Benz with an unnerving passion.

As a new guy to F1Technical, this hatred the two of you exhibit is like a big elephant in the room. We all see it, we all deal with it, but if we address it directly our words are either deflected by you or removed. There just seems to be some bush you and Mun are dancing around. So I ask, sincerely and honestly, because I really do want to know. What is going on with you two and Mercedes Benz? What is fueling this energy the two of you have? What did Mercedes Benz do?

And mods, I'm sorry if this crosses the line, but I have no ulterior motive. These aren't loaded questions, nor disguised bashing. I'd just like to know what's up, and I'm asking in public, because I think a lot of other people would too. And X, Mun... if you don't feel like answering, that's totally cool, and I'll do my best to ignore your shenanigans from now on.

[wunderkind]

Fact is that I'm a Mercedes fan myself...

Dude... I-- WHAT?!? I-- how...

You've read your own posts... right?

I know I'm new here, but that also gives me the benefit of fresh eyes.

X, I have never seen someone hate a car brand the way you and Mun hate Mercedes Benz. Frankly, it blows my mind the amount of energy the two you spending voicing that hate, and your contempt towards its fans. At first I thought it was just passionate fandom for some other rival team, but then I read the SLS thread, and YEESH.

I know I might be scolded for this, but if that happens, I might as well be reprimanded for saying the sky is blue. This isn't criticism, nor even necessarily judgement. It's just fact. You and Mun hate Mercedes-Benz with an unnerving passion.

As a new guy to F1Technical, this hatred the two of you exhibit is like a big elephant in the room. We all see it, we all deal with it, but if we address it directly our words are either deflected by you or removed. There just seems to be some bush you and Mun are dancing around. So I ask, sincerely and honestly, because I really do want to know. What is going on with you two and Mercedes Benz? What is fueling this energy the two of you have? What did Mercedes Benz do?

And mods, I'm sorry if this crosses the line, but I have no ulterior motive. These aren't loaded questions, nor disguised bashing. I'd just like to know what's up, and I'm asking in public, because I think a lot of other people would too. And X, Mun... if you don't feel like answering, that's totally cool, and I'll do my best to ignore your shenanigans from now on.

Actually, I think X and Mun only have issues with Ross Brawn, not Mercedes Benz.

But they, and marcush, love Paul Gascoyne and Geoff Willis..............

[Mr.S]

Fact is that I'm a Mercedes fan myself...

Dude... I-- WHAT?!? I-- how...

You've read your own posts... right?

I know I'm new here, but that also gives me the benefit of fresh eyes.

X, I have never seen someone hate a car brand the way you and Mun hate Mercedes Benz. Frankly, it blows my mind the amount of energy the two you spending voicing that hate, and your contempt towards its fans. At first I thought it was just passionate fandom for some other rival team, but then I read the SLS thread, and YEESH.

I know I might be scolded for this, but if that happens, I might as well be reprimanded for saying the sky is blue. This isn't criticism, nor even necessarily judgement. It's just fact. You and Mun hate Mercedes-Benz with an unnerving passion.

As a new guy to F1Technical, this hatred the two of you exhibit is like a big elephant in the room. We all see it, we all deal with it, but if we address it directly our words are either deflected by you or removed. There just seems to be some bush you and Mun are dancing around. So I ask, sincerely and honestly, because I really do want to know. What is going on with you two and Mercedes Benz? What is fueling this energy the two of you have? What did Mercedes Benz do?

And mods, I'm sorry if this crosses the line, but I have no ulterior motive. These aren't loaded questions, nor disguised bashing. I'd just like to know what's up, and I'm asking in public, because I think a lot of other people would too. And X, Mun... if you don't feel like answering, that's totally cool, and I'll do my best to ignore your shenanigans from now on.

Actually, I think X and Mun only have issues with Ross Brawn, not Mercedes Benz.

But they, and marcush, love Paul Gascoyne and Geoff Willis..............

Really??? They hate Mercedes as much as they do Brawn,reason they are always speculating that Mercedes will walk out of the sport in 1-2 years & MSC will have retired by now.

It's more of a Ferrari hate & anyone associated with it PLUS the others, so MSC,ROSS,Costa gets more of the hate. Mercedes gets less. They dont like Willis,atleast not both of them. Not the way they like Gascoyne or James Key.

They just want to see this team fail & flop & are always busy finding flaws with anything. If Brawn went away & they had Willis there,then they would have not hesitated to bash Willis one bit. Brawn is just the public face & Team Principal(& an X-Ferrari guy) so he probably gets slightly more hate.

[marcush.]

you gusy get things totally wrong.

I really really cheer for Mercedes and not only because it was Brawn GP and BAR not too long ago.

I had big hopes and really i find it hard to believe how long it takes them to get their issues sorted.You just cannot allow yourself to stand by and hope for the best in this sport...EXP and SEG did voice their concerns from day one and frankly I have to admit i was too mellow with them ..but they (MGP)seemed to be paralysed by the realities..
Now they have turned around and shoot frantically in all directions and this is the new concern I have -they have reacted too slow but it could be too much too late ...

I for myself would love to see Michael win and win a championship .No hate just frustration.

[munudeges]

Oh, but I think Ross Brawn, if that's who you're referring to, has already displayed quite enough of his true "magic" at MGP.

My opinion of him has actually lowered during his time at Mercedes. I just don't get the soundbites and the seemingly aimless shots in the dark he appears to be taking. It's completely at odds with his supposed reputation.

Fact is that I'm a Mercedes fan myself, why I'm tormented to behold this display of utter management-incompetence.

Well, the opposite of love is indifference, and we're not being indifferent to Mercedes because we actually care. Personally, I think if Mercedes gets disillusioned and pulls out then the sport will be in a very poor state, along with the shambles that is Renault/Genii these days.

[Cocles]

Well, the opposite of love is indifference...

The opposite of love is hate; indifference is what's right in between. Glad to know you care though.

Ross Brawn might just not be the type to like to admit to outsiders that his team is struggling. How did he act when Honda was having problems? Or when BrawnGP was slow in the last third of the 2009 season? Unfortunately we can't look at when Ferrari was in Mercedes' situation, since Brawn wasn't a TP back then.

"You know how my team is doing. We're fourth. If you don't want blind optimism and BS then stop trying to make me admit we're struggling." Unified front.

Anyway, who knows. It's all just speculating.

[munudeges]

The opposite of love is hate; indifference is what's right in between.

Nope, it isn't. It's easy to make that mistake, but it's a well known saying.