After being being banned for breaking the sporting regulations at the Hungarian GP, the Renault Formula One team now has a date for their appeal to be tried. The reason for it all being that the French team let Fernando Alonso out onto the track with a wheel nut problem, whereafter Alonso's wheel completely fell of less than a lap later.
Ok lets stop these debate (you dont have to debate if not want to). You are right he does not leave the pit lanemx_tifosi wrote:Massa did stop and get the hose removed, all without leaving the pit lane. This event has nothing to do with either the Renault or Brawn incidents.
I don't even know why I'm debating this...
After reading that can the suspension be considered extreme? I think they fully deserved it.A statement issued by the stewards on Sunday night said that there had been multiple breaches of the regulations by the Renault team.
Stewards talked to Renault representatives twice after the race.
The statement said that Renault "knowingly released car no. 7 from the pitstop position without one of the retaining devices for the wheel-nuts being securely in position, this being an indication that the wheel itself may not have been properly secured."
It added that Renault, "being aware of this, failed to take any action to prevent the car from leaving the pitlane....failed to inform the driver of this problem or to advise him to take appropriate action given the circumstances, even though the driver contacted the team by radio believing he had a puncture."
It said that the team's actions had compromised safety in breach of Article 3.2 of the Sporting Regulations, and in breach of Article 23.1.i had released the car from the pits before it was safe to do so.
I still say the same should be said of Brawn. They knowingly released a car onto the track with suspension problems that has been verified from the driver of the car and they were not penalized. Renault deserves this penalty, and I think Brawn does as well. Too bad this didn't happen like Heidfelds car last year I think. They did everything Renault did other than informing him, and the wheel didn't come off fortunately.ISLAMATRON wrote:After reading that can the suspension be considered extreme? I think they fully deserved it.A statement issued by the stewards on Sunday night said that there had been multiple breaches of the regulations by the Renault team.
Stewards talked to Renault representatives twice after the race.
The statement said that Renault "knowingly released car no. 7 from the pitstop position without one of the retaining devices for the wheel-nuts being securely in position, this being an indication that the wheel itself may not have been properly secured."
It added that Renault, "being aware of this, failed to take any action to prevent the car from leaving the pitlane....failed to inform the driver of this problem or to advise him to take appropriate action given the circumstances, even though the driver contacted the team by radio believing he had a puncture."
It said that the team's actions had compromised safety in breach of Article 3.2 of the Sporting Regulations, and in breach of Article 23.1.i had released the car from the pits before it was safe to do so.
No.Ray wrote:I still say the same should be said of Brawn. They knowingly released a car onto the track with suspension problems that has been verified from the driver of the car and they were not penalized.
Feeling a bit strange and seeing a wheel shield rotating when the car moves away from the service area isn't the same thing. Not even nearly. Brawn didn't know what was wrong with the car. Not to mention that they didn't know something was going to fall off. It even felt okay enough to go for another fast lap.Barrichello wrote:it felt a bit strange
With the Renault case it was obvious that the lollopop man released the car while the mechanic was still working on the front right. It was easy to notice straight away before any replays, that the fairing started rotating as soon as the car moved. And if the Renault engineers are so slow and shortsighted they could at least order Alonso to slow down on the track to avoid the wheel coming off. EVERYONE who bothered to switch on the TV knew it was going to fall off.Barrichello wrote:I still did an okay time through sector one, but when I went into Turn 3 I felt the rear collapse.
No. Out of context. This is the complete transcript.modbaraban wrote:Feeling a bit strange and seeing a wheel shield rotating when the car moves away from the service area isn't the same thing. Not even nearly. Brawn didn't know what was wrong with the car. Not to mention that they didn't know something was going to fall off. It even felt okay enough to go for another fast lap.Barrichello wrote:it felt a bit strangeBarrichello wrote:I still did an okay time through sector one, but when I went into Turn 3 I felt the rear collapse.
They knew something was up and chose not to check it sufficiently. How does the whole cap come off the damper, and it went unnoticed? Because sufficient checks were not made, and they released the car onto the track three time. If it had killed Massa when it hit him, we would all be thinking differently.Barichello wrote:This afternoon it felt a bit strange, vertically the car was moving a bit. And we suspected since the beginning of qualifying that it was starting to go. Eventually it went completely on that lap, because I had a lap of traffic which I had to abort and that lap, as soon as I braked for Turn 1, it was very, very bad. I still did an okay time through sector one, but when I went into Turn 3 I felt the rear collapse.
A suspension for the whole team is a suspension for both Alonso AND Piquet. Both of whom did no wrong, and in fact were penalized. Think it through. Brawn had a suspect rear suspension that they figured was going to fail, yet didn't do anything about it. And it failed. And it almost killed another competitor. What came off is irrelevant. It failed. They should be banned from that event. And again I will say, if it killed Massa all of you would change your tune.The FOZ wrote:Penalty is perhaps a bit on the harsh side, a suspended suspension and a big fine would have been more appropriate IMHO.
BUT IT IS JUST!
The difference between Brawn and Renault is simple.
With Brawn, there was absolutely no way of knowing exactly what the problem was in the rear end, and there certainly was no way of knowing that it would result in a spring coming loose. Think about it - this kind of thing happens ALL THE TIME. The car feels weird, but is still driveable, so the driver absolutely must try to bring the car home - and that's precisely what Rubens was doing. He'd abandoned his flying lap, and was headed home. The car was still driveable, and there was no probable hazard to Rubens, or anybody else. Period.
Renault had an issue that would result in imminent failure and a dangerous situation. The pit crew knew the retaining device wasn't installed properly. They released him anyhow. Alonso knew there was an issue right away, although in his defence, it could have been just a blown tire. In fact, if the team did not make him aware of the issue, and he was proceeding as though he had a flat tire, then nothing he did was terribly improper.
Which might be why 'Nando wasn't fined, or suspended, but rather, the team was. It was a bonehead move, and had to be treated as such.
You can't seem to make the connection. You are saying that Renaults situation was dangerous and 'could have hurt someone.' BRAWN DID!!! He was damn near killed! What is so hard to understand about that?!dave34m wrote:I cant agree with the comments about Brawn. If anything Red Bull were more at fault sending Vettel out again when he clearly had a problem and they really didnt do enough to see what the fault may have been, but I dont see that that that was so very wrong either. The renault penalty if deserved, it was clearly a very dangeous situation that could easliy have ended in multiple daeths to either drivers or spectators.
It was of course very bad timing to lose a wheel this week after the death last week but that doent make it any less serious.
It will interesting to see the outcome of the appeal.
It added that Renault, "being aware of this, failed to take any action to prevent the car from leaving the pitlane....failed to inform the driver of this problem or to advise him to take appropriate action given the circumstances, even though the driver contacted the team by radio believing he had a puncture."
It said that the team's actions had compromised safety in breach of Article 3.2 of the Sporting Regulations, and in breach of Article 23.1.i had released the car from the pits before it was safe to do so.
