The fastest F1 car of all time?

[megz]

Mercedes tweeter not too long ago published F1 fuel is 99% percent the same as pump fuel and that you could run F1 cars on it as if it's all the same. In fact current engines would detonate themselves asap if you really tried pump fuel. Just goes to show how much you can trust random PR people who operate social media for teams.

While the cynic in me suggests that maybe this could all be an elaborate ruse...

[Samraj_official]

"Hey guys, the telemetry says we've hit 378kph in Bottas' car!"

"Can't be true - some bloke on the internet says it's wrong. Did you click the forum validation box when calibrating the speed trace? Perhaps you entered Captcha wrong."

12kph in 1 second is hardly astounding acceleration...

12kmph in a second at those speeds and where the engine completely tops out!!!!!,its not possible, 12kmph in second achieved at speeds over 360 is extremely difficult than acccelerating 12kmph per second from idle.

[Juzh]

Mercedes tweeter not too long ago published F1 fuel is 99% percent the same as pump fuel and that you could run F1 cars on it as if it's all the same. In fact current engines would detonate themselves asap if you really tried pump fuel. Just goes to show how much you can trust random PR people who operate social media for teams.

While the cynic in me suggests that maybe this could all be an elaborate ruse...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbQZQUo ... nnel=Shell

Current V6 is much more sensitive to detonation due to fuel limits and how lean it runs.

[andylaurence]

"Hey guys, the telemetry says we've hit 378kph in Bottas' car!"

"Can't be true - some bloke on the internet says it's wrong. Did you click the forum validation box when calibrating the speed trace? Perhaps you entered Captcha wrong."

12kph in 1 second is hardly astounding acceleration...

12kmph in a second at those speeds and where the engine completely tops out!!!!!,its not possible, 12kmph in second achieved at speeds over 360 is extremely difficult than acccelerating 12kmph per second from idle.

Because of drag, right? Now consider the slipstream. Don't assume he had pulled out of it. Provide evidence he wasn't in the slipstream... if you can.

Let's look at this logically. There's really two ways this tweet could have materialised. Firstly, the social media team could have seen the high speeds on track and decided to pretend that they had broken the outright speed record. They just picked a speed that seemed vaguely plausible. Secondly, the team could have seen the outright speed, got a little bit excited and notified the social media team who posted it. We don't know which is true.

[krisfx]

Mercedes tweeter not too long ago published F1 fuel is 99% percent the same as pump fuel and that you could run F1 cars on it as if it's all the same. In fact current engines would detonate themselves asap if you really tried pump fuel. Just goes to show how much you can trust random PR people who operate social media for teams.

While the cynic in me suggests that maybe this could all be an elaborate ruse...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AbQZQUo ... nnel=Shell

Interestingly, the F1 site also says this. I believe the make up has to be pretty close to standard fuel, which is written in the regs.

[Juzh]

"Hey guys, the telemetry says we've hit 378kph in Bottas' car!"

"Can't be true - some bloke on the internet says it's wrong. Did you click the forum validation box when calibrating the speed trace? Perhaps you entered Captcha wrong."

12kph in 1 second is hardly astounding acceleration...

12kmph in a second at those speeds and where the engine completely tops out!!!!!,its not possible, 12kmph in second achieved at speeds over 360 is extremely difficult than acccelerating 12kmph per second from idle.

Because of drag, right? Now consider the slipstream. Don't assume he had pulled out of it. Provide evidence he wasn't in the slipstream... if you can.

I can, and already did. He did pull out of slipstream just before the end. Not to mention the speed trap line at which he was messured by the independant speed guns at 366 is literally 0.5s before that.
https://streamable.com/ubwi
Now it's your turn to provide evidence to support 378 kmh claim. You don't have any. And that's because all the so callled "evidence" so far came from 1 sole tweet.

If this 378 is to be plausible, then quite literally, every single speed trap (and onboard telemetry) taken previously should have an extra 8-12 kmh added to it.

[Ogami musashi]

If this 378 is to be plausible, then quite literally, every single speed trap (and onboard telemetry) taken previously should have an extra 8-12 kmh added to it.

Just to highlight this because it is the second time you use this argument, there is a logical fallacy there. You can't use inference (generalizing from a single event) except if all the conditions are the same (track, track conditions, traffic, speed trap measurement method and position, eventual post measurement corrections etc..). You (and the others) have not all the information to infer there. To give you an example, it is like saying that because a guy has received a speeding ticket with a retained speed of 140km/h while actually being measured at 150km/h (in which case a post measurement correction was applied), all people that receive a 140km/h speeding ticket have actually been speeding at 150km/h. It is only true if you know that the same post measurement was applied for all. This you can't know. The radar may have measured another speed and a different post measurement method may have been applied.

That doesn't bring more info about the topic but i think you can't use that argument to prove your opinion.

[ChrisDanger]

Not commenting about the 378, but during live timing I've seen cars regularly come to a sudden stop, then teleport to another part of the track. So it wouldn't be a big stretch to under-report the speed slightly. So basically, any evidence from this source can be disregarded.

[Juzh]

Not commenting about the 378, but during live timing I've seen cars regularly come to a sudden stop, then teleport to another part of the track. So it wouldn't be a big stretch to under-report the speed slightly. So basically, any evidence from this source can be disregarded.

Graphics are interpolated, numbers themselves are not.

[andylaurence]

I can, and already did. He did pull out of slipstream just before the end. Not to mention the speed trap line at which he was messured by the independant speed guns at 366 is literally 0.5s before that.

I left an ambiguity in there, sorry. Prove he pulled out of the slipstream after the speed trap. Note that you will need to establish where the speed trap is and estimate at what point during the speed trap he was doing the reported speed. How long is the speed trap? 2/5/10 metres? How long was it from the speed trap to applying the brakes?

Now it's your turn to provide evidence to support 378 kmh claim. You don't have any. And that's because all the so callled "evidence" so far came from 1 sole tweet.

Exactly my point. There's not enough evidence. You'll note that I've not claimed the 378kph is true, just argued that it isn't certain that it's untrue. Frankly, I neither know nor care as it was pretty frigging quick whatever the speed was.

[notsofast]

Given that we don't have access to the telemetry of all cars on all laps that have ever been driven, we cannot establish which car was the fastest this way. If we want to establish an official record of fastest car, all we can do is go by the speed recorded in the speed trap.

But I don't really see the point in such a record. Whenever constructors make their cars faster, the FIA adopts regulations to slow them down. If constructors had full freedom to build the fastest car possible for each F1 race, surely they would have exceeded 400 km/h by now.

[Juzh]

I can, and already did. He did pull out of slipstream just before the end. Not to mention the speed trap line at which he was messured by the independant speed guns at 366 is literally 0.5s before that.

I left an ambiguity in there, sorry. Prove he pulled out of the slipstream after the speed trap. Note that you will need to establish where the speed trap is and estimate at what point during the speed trap he was doing the reported speed. How long is the speed trap? 2/5/10 metres? How long was it from the speed trap to applying the brakes?

Speed trap is positined EXACTLY at the start/finish line. There's about 100m of track left after it before braking zone.
http://i.imgur.com/go0j1gq.jpg

As for the slipstream stuff, proof is in the video.

In the race cars BARELY managed to get over 360 few times during the race. Fastest was hamilton at 364 trough the speed trap, and his highest ultimate speed was 366. He gained a net 2 kmh after the speed trap line. Yet we're supposed to believe bottas magically gained 12 kmh.

[SectorOne]

What about the pit stop then, which also goes for Ferrari who has claimed a faster pit stop time then what the official recording said.
Williams official time says 1,92s while in car data says 1,89s.

[Juzh]

What about the pit stop then, which also goes for Ferrari who has claimed a faster pit stop time then what the official recording said.
Williams official time says 1,92s while in car data says 1,89s.

As I've said. This could be the case, but then all speed traps are void.

[SectorOne]

What about the pit stop then, which also goes for Ferrari who has claimed a faster pit stop time then what the official recording said.
Williams official time says 1,92s while in car data says 1,89s.

As I've said. This could be the case, but then all speed traps are void.

They´re void in this particular subject as they are measuring speed trap figures not total speed figures.

Sure you can look at the speed trap and say something may be funky but you can´t use speed traps as the ultimate argument for why 378km/h is false since it´s just a speed trap, not maximum speed on straight.

One more thing to consider (which may lie near your idea of speed trap figures being void) is that FIA´s system simply is less accurate or reliable then the teams measuring system. It may get it right sometimes, but other times wrong.

Teams i guess measure actual wheel speed whereas FIA i think goes purely on GPS data.