Ferrari F138

[Joie de vivre]

so he should have stopped the car, right? it was a failure

Sorry, but since when has "some part of my car has failed, I must stop now" been part of F1?

I was replying to him.

I dont see why he was allowed to run 2 laps with DRS open in the first place.

I just said it isn't Alonso's fault his car had a failure, why shouldn't he be allowed to run with DRS open if it was obvious failure.

[ecapox]

Alonsos wing, when stuck, was actually causing lift. It was higher than the neutral DRS open position. This was NOT an advantage.

[ironrose]

Alonsos wing, when stuck, was actually causing lift. It was higher than the neutral DRS open position. This was NOT an advantage.

Still he managed well to keep all four wheels on the track, decent lap time and with little downforce.... MSC was all over the place when the DRS got stuck in the open position in canada.

[turbof1]

Gives you an idea how much % of rear downforce the diffuser produces, compared to the rear wing.

[Kalsi]

Well... he didnt do 3 laps actually i think... if i remember correctly the DRS didn't fail in the pit straight ... it failed after turn 10 in the other drs zone... just the time to close it and finish the lap and you are in the next one (0,5laps completed) at this time you probably just realized what happened and try to fix that maybe by keep pushing the DRS activation or by whatever other method (meanwhile you did another lap... remember 1 f1 lap is 1 or 2 mins, so we are at 1,5 laps completed) at this point you can say "damn i have to pit or i can get into FIA attention" and you can do it at the end of the lap ... so 2,5 ....
I dont think the process could have gone faster than this if you think that they decided to pit Alonso after maybe less than 3 mins ...there is only 1 pit entrance in the track ...

[wesley123]

so he should have stopped the car, right? it was a failure

imo he should either have stopped at the track, or have pitted immediately. His car was just in a dangerous position with the DRS fully open.

[turbof1]

so he should have stopped the car, right? it was a failure

imo he should either have stopped at the track, or have pitted immediately. His car was just in a dangerous position with the DRS fully open.

Rules aren't so much clear on what is dangerous. Like said, his car went on just fine. Yes you could argue less rear DF, could overshoot braking points or loose grip in the middle of a corner, but the fact was he didn't. He kept the car perfectly under control without much effort. I'd disagree this particular case was dangerous.

[Pierce89]

so he should have stopped the car, right? it was a failure

imo he should either have stopped at the track, or have pitted immediately. His car was just in a dangerous position with the DRS fully open.

Rules aren't so much clear on what is dangerous. Like said, his car went on just fine. Yes you could argue less rear DF, could overshoot braking points or loose grip in the middle of a corner, but the fact was he didn't. He kept the car perfectly under control without much effort. I'd disagree this particular case was dangerous.

How dare you write something logical when people are trying to crucify Ferrari. That's against "the spirit of the rules".

[turbof1]

Party spoiler is a profession, son.

[wesley123]

so he should have stopped the car, right? it was a failure

imo he should either have stopped at the track, or have pitted immediately. His car was just in a dangerous position with the DRS fully open.

Rules aren't so much clear on what is dangerous. Like said, his car went on just fine. Yes you could argue less rear DF, could overshoot braking points or loose grip in the middle of a corner, but the fact was he didn't. He kept the car perfectly under control without much effort. I'd disagree this particular case was dangerous.

One can also keep the car perfectly under control with a wheel missing, doesnt mean it is safe.

Point is, whether or not Alonso could or could not keep the car on track, he was missing crap loads of df and with that would have a much less predictable car to drive, which makes it "unsafe".

I am not someone who always thinks about safety and tries to apply it everywhere, but if you ask me in a situation like this, or with loose body parts(isnt that already the case btw?), the driver should be forced to pit to have the problem fixed.

[turbof1]

One can also keep the car perfectly under control with a wheel missing, doesnt mean it is safe.

Point is, whether or not Alonso could or could not keep the car on track, he was missing crap loads of df and with that would have a much less predictable car to drive, which makes it "unsafe".

I am not someone who always thinks about safety and tries to apply it everywhere, but if you ask me in a situation like this, or with loose body parts(isnt that already the case btw?), the driver should be forced to pit to have the problem fixed.

If he really missed "crap loads" of DF, his times would had been total crap. The main plane still produced a bit of DF btw. It's not like the complete rear wing stops producing DF. Also note it was a lower DF set up anyway. The net loss of DF is relative ok, especially with the diffuser doing most of the work anyway.

[beelsebob]

One can also keep the car perfectly under control with a wheel missing, doesnt mean it is safe.

Point is, whether or not Alonso could or could not keep the car on track, he was missing crap loads of df and with that would have a much less predictable car to drive, which makes it "unsafe".

I am not someone who always thinks about safety and tries to apply it everywhere, but if you ask me in a situation like this, or with loose body parts(isnt that already the case btw?), the driver should be forced to pit to have the problem fixed.

If he really missed "crap loads" of DF, his times would had been total crap. The main plane still produced DF btw. It's not like the complete rear wing stops producing DF.

Yes, it is actually – DRS is very carefully designed by the teams to make sure that when the flap opens, the air can no longer stay attached to the main plane, and it stalls out too.

[turbof1]

One can also keep the car perfectly under control with a wheel missing, doesnt mean it is safe.

Point is, whether or not Alonso could or could not keep the car on track, he was missing crap loads of df and with that would have a much less predictable car to drive, which makes it "unsafe".

I am not someone who always thinks about safety and tries to apply it everywhere, but if you ask me in a situation like this, or with loose body parts(isnt that already the case btw?), the driver should be forced to pit to have the problem fixed.

If he really missed "crap loads" of DF, his times would had been total crap. The main plane still produced DF btw. It's not like the complete rear wing stops producing DF.

Yes, it is actually – DRS is very carefully designed by the teams to make sure that when the flap opens, the air can no longer stay attached to the main plane, and it stalls out too.

I am not entirely convinced. Obviously teams want that; if they achieve that without loss of net DF is a different question.

[Alonso Fan]

OK they failed... again... but let's look at a little bit underrated aspect of all the facts happened in the barhein weekend...
Alonso menaged to keep the car on track for 2 laps without losing a significant amount from Vettel and keeping Di Resta safely at his back before he was called into the pits... we all know what Alonso's is capable of but, i think that if it happened with the F2012 things would have gone WAY differently

If you look at some videos you can even see the wing so bend upwards that should also generate a positive lift ...
What you all guys can conclude from this aspect?
I mean in terms of car's performance

we can interpret that the Ferrari has very good mechanical grip. maybe not as good as the redbull, but if Alonso can drag that thing around with rear lift and keep the flying force india behind him, then it also can be interpreted that alonso is a very very good driver.

the ferrari is also light on its tyres, maybe not as light as lotus, but still light enough for alonso to go fast on an inlap, and the extra grip that was saved would have allowed him to maintain the gap to di resta. Alonso has always had a speciality on heavy fuel. he outshines anyone in the opening laps of the grand prix, and this combined with a good car with good mechanical grip and narrow 'coke bottle' area, (which allows much more air to reach the diffuser and underside of the car) makes a car that can run quite quickly with an inverted rear wing flap.

How did you translate comparing Ferrari's mechanical grip over FI in Bahrain with DRS open ?

Firstly Bahrain has more straight than you average Grand Prix track here Fernando could out run the FI but in corners paul was easily catching him (Not to show disrespect to FA , he did excellent job with the damage) , if the situation happened in China even a driver with FA caliber would have spun off at turn 1-2 complex if he tried to defend the FI and carry those sorts of speeds into the corners .

I think the only track were excellent mechanical grip excels (with blown diffuser offcourse and driver influence) is Monaco.

he seemed to be ok in the corners

[wesley123]

I honestly doubt he was okay in the corners. He would be much slower in the corners, and yes he would have been quicker on the straights.

There dont seem to be any vids online though that show Alonso running with DRS open.