Red Bull RB6

[A13EX_f]

unbelivable footage from the RBs in singapore after the tea tray deflection test!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

Flexing wings and the floor still flexing. RB should be thrown out of this championship!!!

This does not prove anything. it's only the 'tea tray' getting closer to the floor that will be of benefit so redbull must have designed the strengthening bar to allow upwards movement if it hits something but with the ability to prevent further downwards movement under load.

It passes all the tests at every race so is legal, so stop complaining. This is the whole point of F1 you design a car that is very close to the rules and exploits parts of the rules no one has thought about. if you have a car that isn't close to the rules you will be slow.

[imightbewrong]

it's only the 'tea tray' getting closer to the floor that will be of benefit so redbull must have designed the strengthening bar to allow upwards movement if it hits something but with the ability to prevent further downwards movement under load.

What? The tea-tray moving upwards is the whole issue.

[forty-two]

What? The tea-tray moving upwards is the whole issue.

Absolutely

+1

I am going to continue this discussion in the Flexible wings thread:
viewtopic.php?f=6&t=8764&start=960

[siskue2005]

unbelivable footage from the RBs in singapore after the tea tray deflection test!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

Flexing wings and the floor still flexing. RB should be thrown out of this championship!!!

what? infact the tea tray should move up when slamming hard on the kerb!!

[forty-two]

unbelivable footage from the RBs in singapore after the tea tray deflection test!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... QOWMKE-agw

Flexing wings and the floor still flexing. RB should be thrown out of this championship!!!

what? infact the tea tray should move up when slamming hard on the kerb!!

Sorry Siskue, what do you mean?

The rules state that the "tea-tray" should remain static. That is why they perform a load test upon it, to ensure that it isn't able to move up out of the way to prevent the plank from being worn when the car is running lower that it's allowed to.

If the bib IS indeed moving up when they "slam hard on the kerb", they're either cheating, or they've found a way of making the bib flex without failing the FIA test (which some would argue, also construes cheating).

I expect I misunderstood your post, because you seem to be saying that the "tea-tray" should move up, implying that this is normal and acceptable behaviour for this part?

[ecapox]

If the force placed on teh tea tray when it bangs angainst the curbs is significantly greater than the forces that they use to test the flexibility of the tea tray, then they either need to revise their tests (again) or we all have to come to terms with the fact that they arent goign to make the tests "real world" and that flexibility is permitted as long as the FIA tests are passed.

[BreezyRacer]

I may have my facts wrong but tea trays flexing up on impact is NOT the issue here. Indeed all the way to .. was it 2005 when Ferrari were caught with a spring loaded flexing tea tray and had to re-engineer it for the season. From that experience I believe it was found that all teams had the right to build a tray that was spring loaded for impact flexing and just about everyone was at that time. Elsewise ask yourself .. why does a tea tray never break even in off track adventures ...???

[bgroovers]

If the force placed on teh tea tray when it bangs angainst the curbs is significantly greater than the forces that they use to test the flexibility of the tea tray, then they either need to revise their tests (again) or we all have to come to terms with the fact that they arent goign to make the tests "real world" and that flexibility is permitted as long as the FIA tests are passed.

Finally 2 others that know what they are talking about! thank you ecapox and forty two you are clearly informed and knowledgeable about f1 and the tech regs!
The rules say that no aero part can move and the recent increasing of the load tests was to eradicate this cheating. Th idea of f1 is not to circumnavigate the rules.The idea is that everyone races to the same rules!
The Ferrari from a few years ago was deemed illegal and the springs were removed!
This area is a huge advantage to Red Bull as it allows them to run mush lowere to the ground at the front increasing front downforce, it also allows much stepper rake of the flow which generates more downforce from the rear diffuser. It also allows the suspension to be setup much softer allowing the cars to ride the bumps/kerbs even better, especially as all the other teams have to run there cars so as not to wear the tea tray as they do not deflect (and comply to the rules). On top of this we also have the illegal flexing of the front wings!

[forty-two]

I may have my facts wrong but tea trays flexing up on impact is NOT the issue here.

Agreed, the main issue is not whether the RB6 bib moves upon impact on a kerb, but detecting that it CAN deflect upon kerb riding (which I believe this clip shows with some degree of clarity) indicates that it CAN MOVE relative to the car.

By virtue of this same movement (as bgroovers has stated), the RB6 is able to run significantly closer to the ground than would otherwise be possible if their bib/plank was "rigidly fixed to the car with no degree of movement" as is defined in the regulations.

Indeed all the way to .. was it 2005 when Ferrari were caught with a spring loaded flexing tea tray and had to re-engineer it for the season. From that experience I believe it was found that all teams had the right to build a tray that was spring loaded for impact flexing and just about everyone was at that time. Elsewise ask yourself .. why does a tea tray never break even in off track adventures ...???

I don't quite get what you're saying here. If Ferrari were forced to re-engineer their bib because it was spring loaded, how can that be justification for others to start to spring load theirs? I'm sure it's me being dense, so please spell it out for me a little?

[BreezyRacer]

Indeed all the way to .. was it 2005 when Ferrari were caught with a spring loaded flexing tea tray and had to re-engineer it for the season. From that experience I believe it was found that all teams had the right to build a tray that was spring loaded for impact flexing and just about everyone was at that time. Elsewise ask yourself .. why does a tea tray never break even in off track adventures ...???

I don't quite get what you're saying here. If Ferrari were forced to re-engineer their bib because it was spring loaded, how can that be justification for others to start to spring load theirs? I'm sure it's me being dense, so please spell it out for me a little?

The Ferrari tea tray also flexed down, and that was the problem. It was a pretty elaborate setup if I remember correctly. They (Ferrari) had to revise it so it didn't flex down, after the first race if I remember correctly.

[BreezyRacer]

Turns out it was 2007 and here is a short mention of it here ..

http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2007/0/396.html

springloaded tea trays are the norm for everyone. It's the flexing DOWN that everyone/someone is worried about.

[siskue2005]

Indeed all the way to .. was it 2005 when Ferrari were caught with a spring loaded flexing tea tray and had to re-engineer it for the season. From that experience I believe it was found that all teams had the right to build a tray that was spring loaded for impact flexing and just about everyone was at that time. Elsewise ask yourself .. why does a tea tray never break even in off track adventures ...???

I don't quite get what you're saying here. If Ferrari were forced to re-engineer their bib because it was spring loaded, how can that be justification for others to start to spring load theirs? I'm sure it's me being dense, so please spell it out for me a little?

As BreezyRacer answered all the things i was about to answer

The spring loaded tea try was allowed from 2004 to 2007 and was used by infact all the teams. this was allowed coz on impact no one wanted their cars to brake and FIA agreed.....but why it was banned coz Stepheny tipped Mclaren about the tray doing illegal things like bending upwards while on smooth track and in the process lowering the FWing with the whole car.
That is what the ferrrari car did and thats why FIA furthur banned the spring loaded trays

So the concept here is that FIA allows teams to have their tea tray flex ON IMPACT with kerbs and huge bumps

so its perfectly fine if ur tea tray flex on a kerb, but if it flexed otherwise then its illegal

[forty-two]

So the concept here is that FIA allows teams to have their tea tray flex ON IMPACT with kerbs and huge bumps

so its perfectly fine if ur tea tray flex on a kerb, but if it flexed otherwise then its illegal

I wasn't aware of that, but if flexing is allowed, whether that is flexing because of a kerb or otherwise then why do the FIA perform a flex test upon it? (albeit one which the RB6 has managed to pass).

[ecapox]

So now that we have an understanding that a tea try can flex upon impact but not just under aero load, lets tackle the front wing. =D>

[BreezyRacer]

So now that we have an understanding that a tea try can flex upon impact but not just under aero load, lets tackle the front wing. =D>

Indeed! My favorite team is getting their asses kicked so Red Bull MUST be cheating!!!!!