Will Schumacher's Race Win and WDC records be broken?

[ENGINE TUNER]

So it would seem. The 1 reason I hear most people in the UK wouldn't want him knighted, is always the fact he moved abroad.

That's not why, that is just the excuse that they give. We know exactly why.

[Jolle]

I've been a huge Hamilton supporter since 2008. Back then, I thought he'll easily win a couple of championships, but then came the RedBull domination period and I didn't think he'd get to 2 championships, let alone the 6 he now has, when he abandoned the McLaren ship (best ever decision, obviously).

While the number of championships is a product of the team and environment he is in, I do think Hamilton is easily one of the very best F1 drivers in a very long time and I am happy that he is being rewarded with the titles I think he and the team deserve. It's hard to compare his achievements with other drivers across different periods... they all have their strengths and weaknesses. Having said that, achieving 7 is going to be really tough. I am inclined to think he'll beat Michaels number of wins, but am less convinced on the number of championships. Not that he doesn't lack the talent, but if it's achievable or not, will come down to the team, the car and the competition. The Ferrari has been hugely competitive since the summer break and if this strong form continues into next, it'll be exciting to see if Mercedes can step up to the challenge. I also think Leclerc will prove to be perhaps a stronger opponent to Lewis than Seb has been while being in a competitive car (just IMO). RedBull will also be very strong contenders in my book and Max is proving time and time again what a ridiculous talent he is... the question for me, is will RB be up there at the beginning of the year and how consistent and calm will Max be able to perform, when a championship is at steak?

All interesting thoughts going into next year. It's going to be quite a season I think. I also wouldn't discount Bottas, though I think he may be a more fierce competitor if Mercedes end up with a dominant package once again. If it's a more level playing field between multiple teams, I think he'll suffer more which might hurt his championship ambitions. A very good start into a new season (like this year) could however be a powerful motivator and confidence boost that may yield a stronger competitor across the entire season...

In numbers Mercedes has been extremely dominating this year. I think we think to see some cracks because them winning every race is the new norm. Hamilton alone won more then half the races with a 0% DNF score. There are no big rule changes for next year (like the one that ended Schumachers reign). Where both Hamilton and Mercedes making the big differences is their ability to make less mistakes then the opposition. Leclerc is up and coming, but still made a lot of mistakes this year (and there is nothing wrong with that). RedBull is more of a contender, because they still have room for development with their Honda engine, while Ferrari should have reached the ceiling more after 6 years of hybrid power.

From all big teams I expect almost B-spec cars from this year, ramping up for 2021. Designing a new concept for the last year of a rule set only worked really well once, in 1988, when there was still unlimited testing and the teams a whole lot smaller.

[TAG]

As unlikely as this seemed even five years ago, we'll soon be in 2020 and both records are within grasp. I am genuinely shocked by that.

[Just_a_fan]

Posted here to free up the race thread.

Because I think anyone with a bit of sense about F1 will know he's not.

He's hardly been hot property has he?

The only certain comparison is between team mates. The rest is whistling in the wind.

Hamilton has only lost two seasons to his team mates in 13 seasons. He's had three champions as team mates. And on balance beat them all.

And people question his talent.

Stop twisting people’s words. Nobody was questioning his talent. Just asking to be objective and see how much the car is helping him these past 6 years. Just compare Ham stats pre-2014 and post-2014 and you have your answer. Excellent driver, but not the god some make him out to be.

Look at any multiple champion and you'll find the car was key to all of them. Did Senna, Schumacher, Clark, Fangio win in bad cars? Of course not.

As for his pre-2014 record, it was excellent in cars that were not the class of the field. He has scored at least one win in every season he has competed - no other driver in history has done that. Ever. Although Micheal had done it before his return to drive for Mercedes. He's only been out-won by a team mate once in his F1 career and that was Rosberg in 2013.

To claim Hamilton is only any good because of the car is to deny the evidence that's there for all to see.

I'm not claiming Hamilton is the GOAT. Such a claim is pointless as one can't compare eras. I'd put the likes of Fangio and Clark above Schumacher and Hamilton, to be honest, but it's impossible to prove. I'd put Hamilton above Vettel, certainly, but Alonso is probably Hamilton's equal. As for the young guns? No way of knowing other than inference and fan preference. You can only truly compare drivers who have shared cars. By that metric, Hamilton is the best of his team mates.

[izzy]

As unlikely as this seemed even five years ago, we'll soon be in 2020 and both records are within grasp. I am genuinely shocked by that.

it gives me the feeling that f1 will be a better place, if you get what i mean. The records'll be with someone who really deserves them at every level, and is a warm, empathetic, generous human being at the exact same time as a ferocious competitor 110% committed to the ruination of his unlucky rivals

[Jolle]

Hamilton and Schumacher are scarily similar in statistics. Schumacher scored his sixth championship in his 13th season as did Hamilton, at similar age. Schumacher went on to race six more seasons, with one championship and a gap of three years, so potentially we have 9 more years of Hamilton....

[Titchener]

This is interesting.

Lewis Hamilton's sixth F1 world title: the stats - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/50176043

[hollus]

Another thread flooded by Haminlton lovers and Hamilton antilovers. Amazing. Well, All those posts are gone now. The irony of people soooo focused on LH derailing a thread that right now is obviously so very much about LH. Because obviously he is very much within sight of most of them while other drivers are a decade off at least.
But nah, let's talk about other users, it is so much more fun. *And all users are soooo waiting to read what I think about other users. /irony off/.

[Just_a_fan]

This is interesting.

Lewis Hamilton's sixth F1 world title: the stats - http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/formula1/50176043

Some of the stats are now wrong because the article predates the last race.
For example: he's tied with Senna on races led every lap (19 each) and he's on 6 grand slams (behind Clark's 8 but ahead of Schumacher's 5). Likewise wins, poles etc are wrong.

[oT v1]

I would love to see Mick or Mrs Schumacher hand over the title, if it comes to pass, to Ham. Or even for the victory to equal the record. A nod to the great man!

[PlatinumZealot]

If 2020 season does not happen, inveitably the record breaking hopefuls have one less year to break MSC's records.

[Wass85]

If 2020 season does not happen, inveitably the record breaking hopefuls have one less year to break MSC's records.

Yep, this won't help Hamilton at all if this season fails to get going.

[Just_a_fan]

If 2020 season does not happen, inveitably the record breaking hopefuls have one less year to break MSC's records.

Yep, this won't help Hamilton at all if this season fails to get going.

As next year replaces this year, the chances are pretty much the same. The huge change of rules that's coming is the biggest risk to his record "attempt". If Mercedes drop the ball with the new cars then that'll be the end of the title runs. Next year is basically this year's car so the chances with that car are the same as if they had run normally this year.

[Wass85]

If 2020 season does not happen, inveitably the record breaking hopefuls have one less year to break MSC's records.

Yep, this won't help Hamilton at all if this season fails to get going.

As next year replaces this year, the chances are pretty much the same. The huge change of rules that's coming is the biggest risk to his record "attempt". If Mercedes drop the ball with the new cars then that'll be the end of the title runs. Next year is basically this year's car so the chances with that car are the same as if they had run normally this year.

He's not getting any younger though, his record attempt would benefit if he can get a shot this season.

[Just_a_fan]

Yep, this won't help Hamilton at all if this season fails to get going.

As next year replaces this year, the chances are pretty much the same. The huge change of rules that's coming is the biggest risk to his record "attempt". If Mercedes drop the ball with the new cars then that'll be the end of the title runs. Next year is basically this year's car so the chances with that car are the same as if they had run normally this year.

He's not getting any younger though, his record attempt would benefit if he can get a shot this season.

I don't think he's so old that he'll physically struggle. It's all mental fitness / drive at this level really as they're all physically silly-fit anyway. And does anyone think that Hamilton will have suddenly lost the drive to win more races/titles? The drivers will all still be doing physical training in their private gyms etc.