2019 German Grand Prix - Hockenheimring, July 26-28

[Restomaniac]

Raining now, more rain for the morning but expected to be dry for qualifying. Again rain on sunday morning but dry for the race. Looks like F1 is going to dodge wet running again, or as Vettel would say: ‘honestly?’

Surely there is dry and DRY though. If it’s cool it’s hardly going to be bone dry if it’s been raining. Also the met office have it at over 60% chance of rain right through till 4PM on Sunday.

[Phil]

Button is not a good wet driver. Neither is alonso. What button did was to know when to change between an intermediate and slick tyre. If on the same tyres with hamilton or any other car of similar ability he was beaten. Button was very observant and patient letting the race come to him. Maybe a skill he developed from his triathalons. But by no means a good wet driver. You can check the hilight reels.

I’d argue Button was just very lucky. That ‘image’ of having that supernatural ability to know when to put on the right tires is a myth. He usually lucked into the right strategy (the perfect one) because he was out of position (relative to Hamilton) where a gamble could yield a higher gain if it worked - and it did.

I remember those few races where things just miraculously worked out for him. On one occasion, i think it was Hungary, he was behind Hamilton and was given the 2nd best strategy which just so happened to be better. Changeable conditions usually benefit the bold - there’s no way to know if the track weather will improve or not and sometimes, decision or timing just works out. Canada is also a good example and i am impressed some here remember the reality of it. Not to say Button was a bad driver or anything - he wasnt.

Ps: i am happy to argue these points in a seperate thread.

[Bill]

If so called luck happens too often it's no longer luck but talent

[Phil]

If you call those few (3-4) rain races (across hundreths of dry races) often...

As i said, i am happy to argue this in a seperate topic. One needs to understand the context of those races. Button was pretty much out of position every single time when he benefitted from those calls. His image is based on 3-4 races max. But this isnt the topic for it, so start one and i am happy to argue the context of each and every one of those races to set the record straight.

[Juzh]

verstappen's fp2 p5 lap 1.14.133

https://streamable.com/2ylrw

[Shrieker]

verstappen's fp2 p5 lap 1.14.133

https://streamable.com/2ylrw
https://streamable.com/2ylrw

First corner

[Juzh]

verstappen's fp2 p5 lap 1.14.133

https://streamable.com/2ylrw
https://streamable.com/2ylrw

First corner

it's still down around 14 kmh compared to his last year's q3 run

[MtthsMlw]

We'll have a lot of laps deleted with these new track limits in turn 1 and turn 17.

[Restomaniac]

Ferrari 7/10’s faster?

Pull the other 1 it’s got bells on it!

[Restomaniac]

Hamilton having roadkill for lunch?

[Pyrone89]

RBR should use Gasly to give Max a good tow on the long straight in Q3, can get them 1 or 2 positions higher. Gasly is battling again with the midfield.

[Mansell89]

Do you think any teams will gamble with a higher downforce setup in a bid to be at an advantage should any rain fall in the race tomorrow?

[Pyrone89]

So what stopped his teammate from accumulating a similarly impressive record?

Nothimg apart from them being less talented than those drivers. But the point is there are a number of drivers more talented than Bottas and Rosberg in the wet and those drivers could have had the same record if in Hamilton’s position, making it not some godlike achievement it is made out to be here.

In fact I think the following recent drivers would 100% have the exact same wet record as Hamilton’s Merc wet record when in his position:
1. Verstappen
2. Alonso
3. Button

Not to mention the number of drivers that are likely to be better in the wet than Rosberg and Bottas yet may have lost 1 or 2 at most (Vettel, Kimi, Ricciardo etc)


I am gonna exclude Norris and Russell because they have yet too prove themselves.

Button is not a good wet driver. Neither is alonso. What button did was to know when to change between an intermediate and slick tyre. If on the same tyres with hamilton or any other car of similar ability he was beaten. Button was very observant and patient letting the race come to him. Maybe a skill he developed from his triathalons. But by no means a good wet driver. You can check the hilight reels. As for alonso, no long explanation needed. He is not good at all in the wet. 60% of the time he will spin on a curb or fall off track. Max is better in the wet than two above. Bottas is in fact better in the wet than all these 3. Watch his wer races to appreciate that he has very good car control in slippery conditions.

Bottas better than Max in the wet?

[HondaPOD]

verstappen's fp2 p5 lap 1.14.133

https://streamable.com/2ylrw
https://streamable.com/2ylrw

First corner

it's still down around 14 kmh compared to his last year's q3 run

there is one less DRS zone this year.

[MtthsMlw]

Interesting that Merc can't come back in S3 so far. Ferrari seems like that they got their tyres right in the window for the whole lap.