Red Bull RB7 Renault

[Hangaku]

KERS saves fuel.......
if you at the 2009 stats ferrari with kers consume the same amount of fuel as brawn gp and mclaren had equal fuel consumption as the renault engine, so with no refuelling and 2010 fuel saving strategies its reasonable to assume that the tank will be reduced in size

Would be dangerous to assume that. What happens if (and it's very likely) the KERS unit fails on the grid. If your fuel tank has shrunk, due the assumption your KERS will save you fuel, you're going to look very silly indeed. Ask Virgin about miscalculating that!

[Afterburner]

Teams will start with the supposed "no-kers" fuel and will burn the fuel in excess throw the race obviously....

[flynfrog]

Teams will start with the supposed "no-kers" fuel and will burn the fuel in excess throw the race obviously....

KERS shouldn't save fuel if you are doing it right

[raymondu999]

Really? I would've thought that the race would then not be 100% powered by the engine/fuel. Eg. 1 lap of fuel on a certain engine map

Without KERS, would only last 1 lap.

With KERS, would last 1 lap, then still be able to have the 80hp for 6 seconds or so

[hud]

reason for this tight shape?
And why other teams can't seem to get their car like this?

the redbull's tank in very wide, in contrast to mclaren with a long fuel tank.
This allows them to bring the engine and it's manifolds away from the rear of the car.
The gear box is thus overly long, which also helps to house the pull rod suspension.
Redbull's long wheel base this year is artificial, it didn't need to be that long if they used a typical lenght gearbox. Using a long gear box gives them a massive aero benefit.



compare the blue and purple areas. The exhausts and engine prevent teams like mclaren from mimicking the tight packaging of redbull.
However i think there is a penalty to pay for a wider fuel tank.
Mclaren's new sidepods does not support a wide tank design, so there are many ways to approach flow to the rear.

nice drawing. i think you should include radiators in your drawing. on the narrower tank side, there's a lot more possible space to put a radiator. shouldn't cooling demand for this season higher due to KERS?

[Raptor22]

To assume the fuel tanks are purely slab sided geometric shapes is a very big and incorrect assumption. The shapes are far more complex than that to suit the packaging requirements What you are refering to is the shape of the rear of the tub...

[Just_a_fan]

Also the rules define a maximum width for the fuel tank - 400mm either side of the centre line IIRC.

[flynfrog]

Really? I would've thought that the race would then not be 100% powered by the engine/fuel. Eg. 1 lap of fuel on a certain engine map

Without KERS, would only last 1 lap.

With KERS, would last 1 lap, then still be able to have the 80hp for 6 seconds or so

if done proper teams will do that lap faster because they have an 80 hp burst. No fuel saved. If KERS were unlimited I would run the motor at full load and use the KERS system to brake it to control speed more charge and you could even work TC into it. Anyhow way off topic. Back to RB7

[ringo]

To assume the fuel tanks are purely slab sided geometric shapes is a very big and incorrect assumption. The shapes are far more complex than that to suit the packaging requirements What you are refering to is the shape of the rear of the tub...

It's a simplification to bring the point across easily. The idea is that the same exact volume can be in any suitable dimensions. A renault engined car can carry the same exact fuel mass as a Mercedes, one doesn't have to be more fuel efficient.
Even the Mclaren could have chose a shorter tank, but they would have to opt for a longer gearbox design.
The tank does define the tub shape any how.
After drawing that i realized i didn't even put in radiators, but those can be placed in any orientation, which we all can see, so i didn't bother with them.

[ringo]

Also the rules define a maximum width for the fuel tank - 400mm either side of the centre line IIRC.

assuming each team carries 250kg of fuel:

density of fuel is 737kg/m3 that's 0.339 m3
400mm of either side is 800mm width. That's the only restricted limited dimension.
Looking on drawing 5 with side protection foam in the tech regulations, the tank can be anywhere around 600mm above the reference plane.
Since we're not using a fixed shape there are infinite ways to fit 250kg in a tub.

for example using the widest dimmensions of 800mm and just using a 600mm height:
0.339/ (.8 * 0.6) = 0.706 m long

using say 380mm on either side instead of the maximum 400mm; 760mm wide:
0.339m3 / (.76 * 0.6) = 0.743 m long tank.

This is just using a simple rectangle to illustrate.
What we have there is the same capacity of fuel, but one tank almost 4cm shorter though 20mm wider.
And it can be much more extreme than that considering that we're not dealing with simple rectangles in reality.

edit: my fuel mass value may be wrong, but it still proves the point.

[Raptor22]

To assume the fuel tanks are purely slab sided geometric shapes is a very big and incorrect assumption. The shapes are far more complex than that to suit the packaging requirements What you are refering to is the shape of the rear of the tub...

It's a simplification to bring the point across easily. The idea is that the same exact volume can be in any suitable dimensions. A renault engined car can carry the same exact fuel mass as a Mercedes, one doesn't have to be more fuel efficient.
Even the Mclaren could have chose a shorter tank, but they would have to opt for a longer gearbox design.
The tank does define the tub shape any how.
After drawing that i realized i didn't even put in radiators, but those can be placed in any orientation, which we all can see, so i didn't bother with them.

granted, an over simplification because what we're actually dealing with is a flame proof Kevlar reinforced bag that can fit into almost shape. You could run the tank down the sides of the engine if you like or fill the entire floor with it. The packaging follows what the designer is trying to achieve.

[ringo]

it still doesn't change the fact that the bag will assume a certain shape.

You want me to draw a bag in MS paint?



The rectangle is good enough for anyone to understand what is happening basically.

And even looking on this bag above you can see the width and length. Those can be varied.
Fuel cannot be run along the sides of the engine. Only 2lt of fuel are allowed to be stored outside of the tub.

[raymondu999]

Does anyone else think that the RB7 truncated fin looks neutered? The F150's razor fin looks better IMO. Just the fin, mind you. The rest of the F150 is butt ugly.

[mx_tifoso]

^^
Does the title of this thread or website say "F1BeautyContest"?

[Francesc]

Bigger cooling outlet