2017 F1 general testing thread

[Restomaniac]

Seriously the reasoning of some people here is pretty poor.

"Historical" fuel loads are not an argument today. You know.. historically when Ferrari made a car with a 0 and a 7 in its name they won both WCC and WDC. Ferrari 2017 WDC confirmed?

I'm sorry but using historical testing practices is sound reasoning, even more so when it looks clear in the video that the Mercedes was indeed heavier on its fastest lap which backs it up.

[balintgabulya]

Seriously the reasoning of some people here is pretty poor.

"Historical" fuel loads are not an argument today. You know.. historically when Ferrari made a car with a 0 and a 7 in its name they won both WCC and WDC. Ferrari 2017 WDC confirmed?

I'm sorry but using historical testing practices is sound reasoning, even more so when it looks clear in the video that the Mercedes was indeed heavier on its fastest lap which backs it up.

The behavior of the Mercedes could definitely fall down to more fuel on board during the testing. Or less grip, or not fully optimized PU, aero. I just want to point out that just because they have run with more fuel historically you should not take it for given.

Same for Ferrari. For them indeed it seems to be important to show they are the fastest (topped most days) probably for PR. If they realise the other teams are not challenging them, they are not pushed to do runs with basically empty tanks either (which they did previous years when ending on top).

I think both teams will show more performance and looking forward to this season, hopefully the top teams will be closer than previous years.

[Vanja #66]

Oh, good, this discussion is still ongoing...

[Afterburner]

Same for Ferrari. For them indeed it seems to be important to show they are the fastest (topped most days) probably for PR. If they realise the other teams are not challenging them, they are not pushed to do runs with basically empty tanks either (which they did previous years when ending on top).

Really??

Marchionne issued a black out to the media and didn't made any predictions to this year results and on testing they're pushing to be noticed??

Come on, Ferrari started to downplay their chances since last September, Ferrari just wants to be focused on their program.

[Restomaniac]

Seriously the reasoning of some people here is pretty poor.

"Historical" fuel loads are not an argument today. You know.. historically when Ferrari made a car with a 0 and a 7 in its name they won both WCC and WDC. Ferrari 2017 WDC confirmed?

I'm sorry but using historical testing practices is sound reasoning, even more so when it looks clear in the video that the Mercedes was indeed heavier on its fastest lap which backs it up.

The behavior of the Mercedes could definitely fall down to more fuel on board during the testing. Or less grip, or not fully optimized PU, aero. I just want to point out that just because they have run with more fuel historically you should not take it for given.

Same for Ferrari. For them indeed it seems to be important to show they are the fastest (topped most days) probably for PR. If they realise the other teams are not challenging them, they are not pushed to do runs with basically empty tanks either (which they did previous years when ending on top).

I think both teams will show more performance and looking forward to this season, hopefully the top teams will be closer than previous years.

I agree with some of this. The Mercedes did look heavier though IMHO. So taken all that into account it's not such a stab in the dark to assume it's business as usual.

Like I said it strikes me that Ferrari have collectively thrown the gauntlet down and shouted 'Come on!!!'. Mercedes have collectively got up out of their chair and looked at it, shrugged their shoulders and sat back down and got on with how they want to run testing.

I think it will be very close between Ferrari and Mercedes. Around 1-2 tenths in it either way which is all anyone wants.

[Restomaniac]

Oh, good, this discussion is still ongoing...

Better to have this discussion then to have a dead thread surely?

[mika vs michael]

Nobody actually knows for sure apart from the teams maybe. I think through gps data and other tools and instruments (noise of engine) etc they can estimate about fuel loads etc so they can have a pretty good idea regarding the pecking order. The rest of us...may have a hint or clue but for sure no one can really tell.
Ferrari was about 1 sec behind Mercs in the end of last season. I find it very difficult to have surpassed that and be half a second faster than them but nevertheless they might have ditched 2016 development in order to shift focus on 2017. Also they might have used 2015 Haas wind tunnels to prepare for 2017. But equally Merc had such big advantage in 2016 that I guess shifted focus to 2017 very early. Unless Mercedes got it somewhere wrong with 2017 rules I can't see them slower than Ferrari...maybe equally fast. Also there may be a few more surprises...There may be another team Williams or Redbull that has been masking their pace too well and they prove to be a match for Mercedes and Ferrari. Be patient...it's only 14 days for the race and 11,5 for the first free practice session.

[Restomaniac]

Nobody actually knows for sure apart from the teams maybe. I think through gps data and other tools and instruments (noise of engine) etc they can estimate about fuel loads etc so they can have a pretty good idea regarding the pecking order. The rest of us...may have a hint or clue but for sure no one can really tell.
Ferrari was about 1 sec behind Mercs in the end of last season. I find it very difficult to have surpassed that and be half a second faster than them but nevertheless they might have ditched 2016 development in order to shift focus on 2017. Also they might have used 2015 Haas wind tunnels to prepare for 2017. But equally Merc had such big advantage in 2016 that I guess shifted focus to 2017 very early. Unless Mercedes got it somewhere wrong with 2017 rules I can't see them slower than Ferrari...maybe equally fast. Also there may be a few more surprises...There may be another team Williams or Redbull that has been masking their pace too well and they prove to be a match for Mercedes and Ferrari. Be patient...it's only 14 days for the race and 11,5 for the first free practice session.

All very true but come on as long as it's not nasty what's wrong with a bit of fun guessing?

As for your point I think you are correct that it's hard to see Ferrari making up and passing Mercedes by the amount shown.

[mika vs michael]

I think we are all just making guesses...so since there are not many data available I think we should not argue beyond the level of a guess trying to prove others wrong. I think we should create a topic and each one should post pecking order and maybe time gap among teams just as a fun game...for australia though which is a bit unique circuit.

[3jawchuck]

Oh, good, this discussion is still ongoing...

Better to have this discussion then to have a dead thread surely?

Not really when nothing new is being added to the discussion.

[Restomaniac]

Oh, good, this discussion is still ongoing...

Better to have this discussion then to have a dead thread surely?

Not really when nothing new is being added to the discussion.

You would rather have a dead thread

[3jawchuck]

Better to have this discussion then to have a dead thread surely?

Not really when nothing new is being added to the discussion.

You would rather have a dead thread

If there is nothing new being added to the discussion then yes, I would rather have a dead thread.

[Restomaniac]

Not really when nothing new is being added to the discussion.

You would rather have a dead thread

If there is nothing new being added to the discussion then yes, I would rather have a dead thread.

Fair enough. I would rather have a discussion when its quiet (As it is ATM).

[ripper]

Another comparation
https://twitter.com/piusgasso/status/840922539396341760

[Vortex Motio]

I did some simple comparisons of number of laps covered by each F1 engine manufacturer in pre-season testing.

It's benchmarked by the engine manufacturer with most laps vs the one with least laps
Data source is motorsport.com article published in last 24hrs, and excludes the 2016 Ferrari powered Sauber

You can access the spreadsheet here:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... -14mKuC94/

Some highlights:
Honda powered cars covered 16% of laps of Mercedes powered cars

A better comparison may be # of McLaren's laps vs avg # of laps of:

• Mercedes powered teams = 48%
• Renault powered teams = 68%
• Ferrari powered teams = 51%

Interesting to note McLaren covered over 2/3rds distance of the avg Renault powered team. But perhaps Toro Rosso dragged that # down due to fitting issues of adusting to new supplier?

So if we then compare lap count of McLaren to other works teams it's:

• 39% of Mercedes AMG
• 44% of Scuderia Ferrari
• 71% of Renault

There is more (hopefully interesting) data in the sheet.