Chuckjr wrote:
I don't know anything nor am claiming to know anything for certain. That's why I'm asking questions---so I can better understand and appreciate the sport. I'm sorry if this just wastes people's time. That was the opposite of my intent.
As Bhall said do not apologize for anything.
Chuckjr wrote:
My first question is, if there is indeed no correlation issue, and they had from July 2011 till February 2012 to design the car, why did their original solution fail so badly that they abandoned it completely after 6 months of study and just a single day on the track even though they knew it was the superior solution? Does this, in the opinion of those here who really know what they are talking about, emulate that there is indeed no correlation problem, or does it say otherwise? That's not a set up question for saying it does point to a discrepancy, it's a real and open question. I want to understand based on your experience and facts.
You cannot properly simulate exhaust in the wind tunnel because the models are 60% and do not have working engines in them. So you're left with CFD. This is an area that Ferrari is admittedly behind other teams such as McLaren & Red Bull. But it's not an excuse, nor more than likely is the exhaust the only problem. Everything works together to create a package and if one piece is off or missing the entire car doesn't work as intended obviously. Scarbs mentioned something with the FWEP(Front Wing End Plates) and air.
I understand many thinking the original solution failed horribly and there's something there in a sense but Fry said it gave the most performance but it just wasn't race ready yet. Bad yes, but it seems if they can get it right, it will provide good performance.
There is talk that the advanced materials the team was using didn't perform as expected and more time is needed, so I think this plays a part in the troubles as well.
Really it's almost impossible to accurately answer your question because unless you're in the team, you never really know what the problem is. We're only speculating. As Fry said, they tried something aggressive and got it wrong. It happens. Happens more than it should at Ferrari but other teams are not immune either. So without knowing full details I'd say the tunnel correlation problems are probably fine but there's still work to do in CFD.
Chuckjr wrote:Second, and this is an even more speculative question, (that seems to be a synonym for this site and that's not intended to be derogatory since we are all just trying to combine minds to understand) if Ferrari is indeed able to make their original idea work, which failed so bad day 1 they abandoned it completely, why would it be a better solution than the proven McLaren or Sauber exhaust since we know those solutions work--esp the Macca solution? Ferrari could easily copy either of those and in doing so is nearly guaranteed a vast improvement, so is there truth to the theory that it is indeed a better solution from this decision to stay with day 1 Jerez exhaust? We all saw last year Macca just copied and pasted the RB blown diffuser solution, so pride of original design seems to give way to having a competitive car...maybe Ferrari has more pride, but that can't be answered conclusively here.
Well I don't really think it failed day one, but they knew at the end of the first test it need more work. I guess how it performed is up to interpretation.
I would think the team probably tried/simulated different exhaust solutions before deciding on the final spec. So they may or may not know if their solution is better or best, but it seems they think it will provide the best performance. As far as just copying the McLaren/Sauber/Red Bull exhaust solution it's not as easy as just making the right sidepods changing the exhaust pipes and doing it. It gets back to a package deal and how every bit of the car is made to work in unison. You couldn't put the McLaren sidepods on the F2012 and expect everything to work right.
Being that it's quite possible we won't see the updated exhaust until Spain, it's quite possible they've decided to go with a solution similar to another team, which requires modifying or changing about everything; Front Wing, modifications to the nose, suspension arms, sidepods, floor, turning vanes, radiators, engine packaging, engine cover, possibly the rear end, Rear Wing & diffuser, etc. Or it's possible they decided to keep the original, modify only the necessary pieces which would probably be less in quantity than using another teams solution and go with it.
I feel like I rambled on the post above. If it makes no sense, sorry. I'm very tired. And honestly it's a lot of speculation on certain things. Either way I hope it helped to answer your questions or perhaps give you a little better understanding.
edit: they used the original exhaust solution for more than one day.
