2025 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[ringo]

I think it's a testament do drive until you are no longer fast enough.

He hasn't been fast enough last few years compared to his teammates. I don't understand why people don't want to accept that. You cant compete with young lions at that age.

I would even say he already lost some agresion in 2021.
This is not Lewis from 2007 any more.

That is true. I also noticed that at the start of 2021. He seemed almost philosophical and too patient. He only got aggressive when it was clear he needed to win all of the remaining races to win the title.
After equalling Shumacher, I think he got jaded.

I am just looking at his career as a body of work. If you can still dp your job and earn money while being of value to the organization then why stop?
He wont be the best, but he's still the face of the sport and still provides more human touch to the sport. I think the media like him now in his weakened and honest state. I think he is providing more insight and honesty about how hard it is to drive an F1 car now that he's realizing he doesnt have it any more.
His peak was 2020. But i still say he has a few more wins in him, and he can still support Ferrari to get a constructors if they make the 2nd fastest car.
One thing he hasnt done so far is make a mistake or move backwards in a race. So he still has some elite traits that some of the young guys dont have. Only Max has elite qualitites of the bunch. Russel and Charles seem to be there now.

[ringo]

IMO the issue is the combo of the car DNA/Charles. Hear me out before you shoot me down.

Charles incredible unique driving style masks issues with the ferrari cars to reach the top. So the development / R&D is all around how charles can use his driving style to get laptime. This means the other driver HAS TO either drive like charles OR the car takes a complete u-turn in years of car DNA/philosophy and be more neutral for most drivers to drive (not going to happen). Therefore, the direction where they develop means charles will get better as the car's DNA seems to be in that direction. I am not sure how good the race engineers are in terms of communicating the race track technically but there seems to be a disconnect from the design team and race track performance (in lewis's side). So maybe the solution to bring both drivers to the same level would be to start taking Lewis's direction of how the car needs to get better? As if the car is better for lewis, charles will naturally follow. If they keep going down how charles can handle the car then i am afraid Lewis will fall further and further away.

This is Fred's/Loic dilemma now. Do they try to get the car towards Lewis style or keep their development plan as it is, which will mean Charles will always be ahead and lewis be always P6-p10

Interesting point. And its likely the W16 is benefiting from Hamilton's feedback when he was at Mercedes. Hopefully the SF26 is more neutral and drivable.

With Lewis feedback Charles will be faster just the same. But 1 and 2 is bettwr than 4 and 7 in qualifying.

[SB15]

IMO the issue is the combo of the car DNA/Charles. Hear me out before you shoot me down.

Charles incredible unique driving style masks issues with the ferrari cars to reach the top. So the development / R&D is all around how charles can use his driving style to get laptime. This means the other driver HAS TO either drive like charles OR the car takes a complete u-turn in years of car DNA/philosophy and be more neutral for most drivers to drive (not going to happen). Therefore, the direction where they develop means charles will get better as the car's DNA seems to be in that direction. I am not sure how good the race engineers are in terms of communicating the race track technically but there seems to be a disconnect from the design team and race track performance (in lewis's side). So maybe the solution to bring both drivers to the same level would be to start taking Lewis's direction of how the car needs to get better? As if the car is better for lewis, charles will naturally follow. If they keep going down how charles can handle the car then i am afraid Lewis will fall further and further away.

This is Fred's/Loic dilemma now. Do they try to get the car towards Lewis style or keep their development plan as it is, which will mean Charles will always be ahead and lewis be always P6-p10

Interesting point. And its likely the W16 is benefiting from Hamilton's feedback when he was at Mercedes. Hopefully the SF26 is more neutral and drivable.

With Lewis feedback Charles will be faster just the same. But 1 and 2 is bettwr than 4 and 7 in qualifying.

But you saying that like George didn’t have a massive role in how the car was developed also…. Not discrediting Lewis but a lot of “fans” are forgetting there are 2 drivers that develops a car because remember Lewis wasn’t in much of the Mercedes meetings last year.

Unless your Alonso, who is just bad at car development.

[Farnborough]

It didn't surprise me LH move to Ferrari, more that he didn't go earlier. To me, he doesn't owe the sport and can have free reign to do as he is now, as long as they want to employ him.

Still don't feel he's lost his fundamental skills ..... do think he just doesn't get the 18 inch tyre era unpredictability that's now routine. More faith than feel in absolute terms for a driver. Searching for an island of calm that's not going to be on horizon. Encouraging that his recent words are stepping out on a path to understand this fully, and what he can change to succeed.

Others haven't made that switch either.

[Cs98]

IMO the issue is the combo of the car DNA/Charles. Hear me out before you shoot me down.

Charles incredible unique driving style masks issues with the ferrari cars to reach the top. So the development / R&D is all around how charles can use his driving style to get laptime. This means the other driver HAS TO either drive like charles OR the car takes a complete u-turn in years of car DNA/philosophy and be more neutral for most drivers to drive (not going to happen). Therefore, the direction where they develop means charles will get better as the car's DNA seems to be in that direction. I am not sure how good the race engineers are in terms of communicating the race track technically but there seems to be a disconnect from the design team and race track performance (in lewis's side). So maybe the solution to bring both drivers to the same level would be to start taking Lewis's direction of how the car needs to get better? As if the car is better for lewis, charles will naturally follow. If they keep going down how charles can handle the car then i am afraid Lewis will fall further and further away.

This is Fred's/Loic dilemma now. Do they try to get the car towards Lewis style or keep their development plan as it is, which will mean Charles will always be ahead and lewis be always P6-p10

Interesting point. And its likely the W16 is benefiting from Hamilton's feedback when he was at Mercedes. Hopefully the SF26 is more neutral and drivable.

With Lewis feedback Charles will be faster just the same. But 1 and 2 is bettwr than 4 and 7 in qualifying.

But you saying that like George didn’t have a massive role in how the car was developed also…. Not discrediting Lewis but a lot of “fans” are forgetting there are 2 drivers that develops a car because remember Lewis wasn’t in much of the Mercedes meetings last year.

Unless your Alonso, who is just bad at car development.

If we are going to play the silly game of “drivers develop the cars” (they really don’t), all the credit should go to George and the performance of the W16 would actually be an indictment on Hamilton’s feedback. Remember last year the excuse for Lewis losing out was that development was moving away from him and focusing on George. Regardless, there’s not going to be any miracle for Ferrari due to driver feedback.

[ringo]

Drivers give feedback which is a part of development.
We even see this in the auto industry.
They do play a role in development. They aren't going to be designing parts or parsing through data, but an engineer is designing blind if there is no real world feedback from the end user.

No team can develop a car without drivers.

[jurinius]

Lewis lost it after getting robbed in his 8th championship title win. Having said that, yes this is a new car for him and he can take only two approach :

- The fisrt one is thrive to catch Leclerc qualification rythm at any costs in few race. (Maybe the young Hamilton will have achieved this nicely without too much drama)
- The second one : take time to adapt his drving style and build progressively while achieving a solid race pace (Looks like he is taking this orientation)

You can think Sainz, Russel or Leclerc have a lot of energy so they can deal with car inconsistencies, but they aren't wining anything Hamilton can't at this moment.

[deadhead]

If anything out of all the cars LEC has driven at Ferrari only the F1-75 was to his liking and it showed, the rest are all
machines he has to adopt and compromise to get the maximum out, which is also why Sainz was nowhere near him in 2022 and much closer in 2023/24

[JPower]

If anything out of all the cars LEC has driven at Ferrari only the F1-75 was to his liking and it showed, the rest are all
machines he has to adopt and compromise to get the maximum out, which is also why Sainz was nowhere near him in 2022 and much closer in 2023/24

Outside of Max, I don't think there's a driver on the grid that frequently "likes" the car they're driving, and even Max hasn't had that over the 2024 and now 2025. Having to adapt to a compromised car is normal. Having one built to the driver's wants is the exception.

[ScuderiaLeo]

Sooo... where is that race pace Vasseur mentioned?

[killua]

Sooo... where is that race pace Vasseur mentioned?

Still the 4th quickest

[DGP123]

Pretty much nowhere tonight

[killua]

Charles is doing some amazing laps right now, maybe we could try soft tires?

[Fluido]

That is true. I also noticed that at the start of 2021. He seemed almost philosophical and too patient. He only got aggressive when it was clear he needed to win all of the remaining races to win the title.
After equalling Shumacher, I think he got jaded.

Many times in 2021 he was too gentle with Max, in the last race he should have closed the left door for Max(even cause crash, like kamikaze-Max always do), but he didn't.
He had to drive more with his balls instead of his brains.

[Autobahn303]

Now some free air