2018 Scuderia Ferrari F1 Team

[Manoah2u]

To be honest, i think HAAS is very smart in not wanting to become some sort of 'Ferrari slave', which would also be negative for their name.
I think a Haas - Chrysler would be cool, but i'm sure Ferrari would want some finger in the mix there and then.

Haas is taking supplies from Ferrari already, and did so to build their team. It's now a case of learning and becoming able to do things 'on their own', which is a much smarter move.
As such, they won't be 'Ferrari slaves' which means they can decide for themselves which sponsors to sign, which drivers to sign, which personel to sign, and not having to let a Ferrari-powered car (like an Alfa Romeo Sauber) just because they have a Ferrari partnership. They also don't have to do Ferrari-forced PR stuff, and be all that they can and be all by themselves instead.

That also means they are free to choose what to do at any moment in time. They could sign for a Honda engine for 2019 for example. A Mercedes engine. Or perhaps Cosworth does step in somehow, perhaps even through Ford, who knows. They got some critisism recently for stating there are no 'capable' F1 drivers from the States right now, and though it politically sounds a bit painful, they're just darn right about it.

In any case, Haas is one of the few teams in F1 that is not forced in any way to do something they don't want or could decide for themselves. Matter of fact, they might be the only team in the grid that can do whatever they want because their funding and sponsorship comes from themselves, from Haas. Not from some corporate head like Marchionne. Not from a contracted sponsor like BWT demanding their livery. Also not becoming a forced 'gateway' to dump junior driver programme participators in their midst, like which will happen with Alfa Romeo and happens with Toro Rosso.

I know this is tad offtopic as it's not the Haas thread, but since they were mentioned here, it fits.

[f1316]

Haas take a lot more than just engines from Ferrari - for that matter, they take a lot more from Ferrari than Sauber and are the biggest users of spec parts on the grid - so I think the characterisation of ‘Ferrari slave’ is not quite right: Haas were able to come in an be competitive (unlike Caterham, Virgin etc) *because* if their technical partnership with Ferrari.

And they themselves say thry’d be up for a Sauber style arrangement:

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.moto ... 93165/amp/

[basti313]

Kvyat becomes development driver for Scuderia Ferrari

They just wanted him to stay away from Vettel during the races. Mission accomplished.

Lol, i remember Ferrari aquiring loads of (former) F1 drivers to their pool, never to see either of them in F1 ever again.
Badoer, Fisichella, Kobayashi, and now Kvyat, just to name a few.

??? Badoer replaced Massa, Fisicho replaced Badoer. There is no other team with a better usage of reserve drivers.

And then there's still Giovanazzi, Fuoco (what happened to him anyway), LeClerc. Is Grosjean fully contracted to Haas or is there a Ferrari-connection there? i don't think so, but i might have missed that.

I think the doors are closed for Gio. Ferrari had the plan to put him into the Haas, but Steiner said no. Marchione did not like that for sure...I guess Haar will be behind Sauber now...

I would argue that the reason Haas doesn't want to help Ferrari is likely because Ferrari doesn't help Haas with how to run the power unit, or how to get the most out of it. Haas figures they're on their own, so they don't have to give Ferrari special favors. They helped Ferrari get extra wind tunnel time which is why the 2015 car was so competitive at the start. Ferrari doesn't reciprocate other than giving them current power units, and treat Haas like a customer.

If they had a better relationship, I wouldn't doubt that Haas would be more welcoming to Ferrari juniors.

I'm not speaking on behalf of anyone just my interpretation of the situation. I have no opinion on who is right or wrong.

That is quite a strange interpretation...you just need to look at the topspeeds, Haas may lack anything but not engine power or deployment strategies.
Haas is lacking aero and nothing else. And this is the only point where they are on their own by the rules. Nearly everything else is coming from Ferrari or other suppliers.

[godlameroso]

Their problem is their car is more pitch sensitive than the others, their suspension is not quite as good as the big teams, so the car suffers under braking and has poor low speed balance, they're ok in the high speed stuff, at least from what I can see. Believe it or not the power unit can help under braking and low speed balance, it's not full on TC, but there's a lot of things you can do with the brake by wire, and the differential settings.

[dans79]

This reads like it has ulterior motives.
https://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2018/01/ ... -champion/

According to the Ferrari chairman Sergio Marchionne,

“The true champions are also great men. They are capable of making difficult decisions, of admitting their mistakes and of pushing harder than before when they get up from a fall.

“They also share their success with their colleagues.

“They are leaders, who take responsibility in every situation, winning the respect of their colleagues and their rivals alike.”

[f1316]

Their problem is their car is more pitch sensitive than the others, their suspension is not quite as good as the big teams, so the car suffers under braking and has poor low speed balance, they're ok in the high speed stuff, at least from what I can see. Believe it or not the power unit can help under braking and low speed balance, it's not full on TC, but there's a lot of things you can do with the brake by wire, and the differential settings.

You’re talking about the Haas or the Ferrari? Must be the Haas.

[godlameroso]

Yep.

[PlatinumZealot]

The Haas has the same outward suspension geometry as Ferrari. Maybe they don't have the same shocks and dampers. They don't have the Ferrari aero, the Ferrari low weight chassis, nor the Ferrari brakes. But yeah they have a very good base.

[Raleigh]

Haas started out running a 100% Ferrari suspension, all the purchased suspension components brake ducts etc, the same brembo brakes, everything except the wheels were identical (Haas chose to CNC machine their own copies of the OZ Racing wheels Ferrari runs), they simply couldn't get the brakes set up right.

Last year Haas started experimenting with Carbon Industries brakes to try and solve their woes, can't remember if they stuck with Carbon Industries or went back to Brembo.

If the Ferrari suspension is falling short anywhere it would be in comparison to Mercedes and Red Bull.

[marmer]

Haas started out running a 100% Ferrari suspension, all the purchased suspension components brake ducts etc, the same brembo brakes, everything except the wheels were identical (Haas chose to CNC machine their own copies of the OZ Racing wheels Ferrari runs), they simply couldn't get the brakes set up right.

Last year Haas started experimenting with Carbon Industries brakes to try and solve their woes, can't remember if they stuck with Carbon Industries or went back to Brembo.

If the Ferrari suspension is falling short anywhere it would be in comparison to Mercedes and Red Bull.

They don't have brake issues it's just Roman being picky very rare k mag has the same issues

[Webber2011]

Haas started out running a 100% Ferrari suspension, all the purchased suspension components brake ducts etc, the same brembo brakes, everything except the wheels were identical (Haas chose to CNC machine their own copies of the OZ Racing wheels Ferrari runs), they simply couldn't get the brakes set up right.

Last year Haas started experimenting with Carbon Industries brakes to try and solve their woes, can't remember if they stuck with Carbon Industries or went back to Brembo.

If the Ferrari suspension is falling short anywhere it would be in comparison to Mercedes and Red Bull.

They don't have brake issues it's just Roman being picky very rare k mag has the same issues

There's some reason Roman has more trouble, but I'm not sure what it is to be honest ?

It's definitely not him "being picky" though

Brakes failing at high speed is a serious issue.

Is it his style, or something deeper ?

[Tomek1623]

2018 Ferrari Teamwear

[GhostF1]

Haas started out running a 100% Ferrari suspension, all the purchased suspension components brake ducts etc, the same brembo brakes, everything except the wheels were identical (Haas chose to CNC machine their own copies of the OZ Racing wheels Ferrari runs), they simply couldn't get the brakes set up right.

Last year Haas started experimenting with Carbon Industries brakes to try and solve their woes, can't remember if they stuck with Carbon Industries or went back to Brembo.

If the Ferrari suspension is falling short anywhere it would be in comparison to Mercedes and Red Bull.

They don't have brake issues it's just Roman being picky very rare k mag has the same issues

There's some reason Roman has more trouble, but I'm not sure what it is to be honest ?

It's definitely not him "being picky" though

Brakes failing at high speed is a serious issue.

Is it his style, or something deeper ?

Whatever issues they have, they aren't as bad as it's been made out to be. It is only Romain. They mentioned "Romain's driving style is what they are trying to get the brakes setup for". That's probably the most they can say before he has a tantrum. It is 99% of the time only him with these issues. And that speaks louder than anything else, it is definitely not all hardware related.

[Peter1919]

Guys the Haas thread is at viewtopic.php?f=15&t=26915&start=30

[iotar__]

Haas started out running a 100% Ferrari suspension, all the purchased suspension components brake ducts etc, the same brembo brakes, everything except the wheels were identical (Haas chose to CNC machine their own copies of the OZ Racing wheels Ferrari runs), they simply couldn't get the brakes set up right.

Last year Haas started experimenting with Carbon Industries brakes to try and solve their woes, can't remember if they stuck with Carbon Industries or went back to Brembo.

If the Ferrari suspension is falling short anywhere it would be in comparison to Mercedes and Red Bull.

- That's not true and that's the very gist of the problem. Educate yourself before posting.
- Neither is every other pseudo technical conclusion ("set up problems" as opposed to technical characterictics including material failure) that followed and preceded this statement in this and other (Haas) thread.

Whatever issues they have, they aren't as bad as it's been made out to be. It is only Romain. They mentioned "Romain's driving style is what they are trying to get the brakes setup for". That's probably the most they can say before he has a tantrum.

It is 99% of the time only him with these issues.

And that speaks louder than anything else, it is definitely not all hardware related.

A. See above.
B. Would it be possible to back up this number with any data? It would speak even louder than empty claims .

BTW whatever happened to simlarly empty claims from Sky experts about special/perfect/different suspension by Haas courtesy of former Lotus "desinger" (2016)?