2025 Aston Martin | Aramco F1 Team

[SSJ4]

judging by the end of season performance i would say 7th best going into 2025

but the team has shown they're capable of building a solid base the past two seasons

[diffuser]

Spanish journo carlosmiquel says both Williams and Aston think they can be 5th in constructors. Obviously in reference to both spanish drivers. Aston is a minimum, Williams is interesting

2025 could start pretty even outside the top 4. Perhaps Aston not even being 5th fastest outright. Whether updates are finally positive is the important thing to watch imo

ALO seems quite pessimistic ("no mircales") for 2025 for a while now, or at least very cautious.

I always have the feeling that Miquel is close to ALO and feeded by his camp. True?


Somehow my feeling is that pecking order wise we won't change much at the beginning, but it will be way more closer in both directions were everything can happen. Like the crazy 2012 season.

So is finishing 5th considered a miracle or would that be finishing 2nd in constructors? Where do we draw the line?

[collindsilva]

As stated by Kimirai, 5th is minimum..

[zoroastar]

"Cardile is a good organizer but as designer he's not as brilliant."

Piergiuseppe Donadoni (AutoRacer journo) during a twitch stream

Schmidt from AMuS said in his video blog about the same and believes that the "set up" with Newey and Cardile is good. The team is obviously growing at a high rate, so this needs structure and guidance. Cardile proved at Ferrari that he can make a technical structure work. If someone blames him for a failed upgrade, the same guys should give him credit for (help) building the technical structure to make things work at all. Put the right people at the right place and make sure they work together. Easy to say, hard to achieve (not only in F1).

I read that Cardile had setup the new WT at Ferrari when they got a new one a few years ago.

With regards to how well Cardile and Newey do/get along... Few of us thought that Fallows would be fired before 2025 when he came over in 2021. So I have positive aspirations but ultimately ....As good as Newey has been, there are no guarantees.

i think that the chances of newey NOT eventually building a title winning car gets smaller and smaller the longer that he remains at aston. my hope is that he designs one before alonso retires, but i dont think theres anyone in the paddock that would bet against him designing one in the next 5 years. sooner than that really. so much stuff needs to fall into place in short order for it to come by 26. honda, just like newey will eventually build a competitive PU, but will it be from the start, or 3 years down the road, right before they pull out of the sport again? if there are relative "sure things" in F1, those are at the top of the list. unless newey realizes he made a huge mistake by working for daddy stroll, ithink chances are better than 50/50 that he will eventually turn aston into a championship team. but yeah there really are no guarantees.

[-wkst-]

Spanish journo carlosmiquel says both Williams and Aston think they can be 5th in constructors. Obviously in reference to both spanish drivers. Aston is a minimum, Williams is interesting

2025 could start pretty even outside the top 4. Perhaps Aston not even being 5th fastest outright. Whether updates are finally positive is the important thing to watch imo

ALO seems quite pessimistic ("no mircales") for 2025 for a while now, or at least very cautious.

I always have the feeling that Miquel is close to ALO and feeded by his camp. True?


Somehow my feeling is that pecking order wise we won't change much at the beginning, but it will be way more closer in both directions were everything can happen. Like the crazy 2012 season.

So is finishing 5th considered a miracle or would that be finishing 2nd in constructors? Where do we draw the line?

Why should a 5th place in the WCC be considered as a miracle for 2025 from anyone within the team, when thats the Position they finished the last 2 years?
ALO's reference is obviously the front of the grid.

[the EDGE]

If the top 4 teams carry an advantage such that the top 8 finishing places are pretty much locked out each race, then it will be a lottery for any team to finish 5th

When your scrapping over a point or 2 between 6 teams, any lucky 1-off high place finish brings a huge reward

I don’t see any reason to suspect AM to hold a 5th place advantage at present, they didn’t show any sign of improvement towards the end of last year, like Alpine did for example, & they go into this season minus their TD & still waiting for their new design talent to arrive. When they do arrive I suspect it will be a case of too little too late as they will surely be focused on preparing for 2026

But hey, this is F1… anything can happen, so I stand to be proved wrong

[KimiRai]

Agree. Let's see how it goes. Interesting times ahead...

[Sevach]

If the top 4 teams carry an advantage such that the top 8 finishing places are pretty much locked out each race, then it will be a lottery for any team to finish 5th

When your scrapping over a point or 2 between 6 teams, any lucky 1-off high place finish brings a huge reward

I don’t see any reason to suspect AM to hold a 5th place advantage at present, they didn’t show any sign of improvement towards the end of last year, like Alpine did for example, & they go into this season minus their TD & still waiting for their new design talent to arrive. When they do arrive I suspect it will be a case of too little too late as they will surely be focused on preparing for 2026

But hey, this is F1… anything can happen, so I stand to be proved wrong

The second half of the season Fernando was fighting a losing battle against Alpines, Haas, Williams... and Lance was nowhere.
My expectations for 2025 are really low.

[diffuser]

My expectations are the same as they were ahead of 2023

[Rikrikrik]

If they fighting for point in Australia will be a good surprise. I think they will suffer in the same level than last year, again, they just talk, talk, talk, interviews and zero result and progress, i dont believe anymore on their speech while they not show result on track, but, my hope is. Fallows isnt here anymore, they will change the concept of the car, people arriving, WT already done, so. the most important thing is. opposite to 2023 and 2024 they need improve AMR25 during the season, if they cant do this i literally dont see they fighting for nothing in 2026, even with Newey, change regulations or whatever. They need prove theirselfs first.

[peewon]

I think so much is unknown/uncertain about the operation at AM this offseason that any position prediction is very much guesswork. 5-9 is very much in play. But I would be very surprised if they crack the top 4. I think couple of people have mentioned deciding when to switch to '26 car already so gives a slight insight into team's thinking as well.

[zoroastar]

i think that their upgrades will be better this year with everything/everyone they are bringing in. even if newey is working on the 26 car, he will be there on the pitwall and there will be some benefits there. setup and upgrade paths that havent been there in the past. but yeah its impossible to know how itll compare to anyone else, and how long theyll even concentrate on upgrading the car. it does seem like even in years where people say that teams will stop to work on next years car, they still bring an upgrade after summer break most of the time. well just have to wait and see, but my prediction (if were making predictions) is that their upgrades will work finally haha

[-wkst-]

Nearly everyone said that summer break is the latest switching point for 2026, unless you are fighting for the championship.

Stella said 1-2 years ago that christmas is about the date were development for the base car (for the test) stops to be in time to produce the car.

Krack mentioned that this year they won't hurry to bring updates (McLaren approach), only when they are confident.

Imola seems to be once again a logical date for a bigger upgrade, race 7 at the mid of May.

Silverstone or Spa in July comes to my mind for a 2nd and final bigger upgrade.

[collindsilva]

Nearly everyone said that summer break is the latest switching point for 2026, unless you are fighting for the championship.

Stella said 1-2 years ago that christmas is about the date were development for the base car (for the test) stops to be in time to produce the car.

Krack mentioned that this year they won't hurry to bring updates (McLaren approach), only when they are confident.

Imola seems to be once again a logical date for a bigger upgrade, race 7 at the mid of May.

Silverstone or Spa in July comes to my mind for a 2nd and final bigger upgrade.

This should be more realistic approach..

[basti313]

i think that their upgrades will be better this year with everything/everyone they are bringing in. even if newey is working on the 26 car, he will be there on the pitwall and there will be some benefits there. setup and upgrade paths that havent been there in the past. ...

This will be interesting to see. If Newey is really on the pitwall...
I would not expect him there. And I would not expect major flaws in the aero or setup of the 2024 car, that he can correct....that would mean the rest of the team is really not up to top level which would mean they are screwed anyways.
What I would suspect is, that they test some radiator or material (weight) ideas for 2026 on the current car. But I do not think this will immediately change the performance.