2021 Dutch Grand Prix - Zandvoort Sept 3 - 5

[Jolle]

Gearboxes maybe, but not the engines surely? Although as this isn't a power circuit, it might be an older engine anyway as they have to manage them effectively to complete the season.

It was his first specification PU from the start of the season.

That engine must have done nearly 6.000 km by now with 5 whole race weekends and 6 fridays (5×800km + 6x300km). Only downside for LH is that from now on his 2nd engine will have to be used as friday engine and rack up miles there instead of spare race engine. Can't imagine his nr. 3 engine holding on from Spa to last race..

They have quite a plan for engine life and don’t use them in consession. Good chance this race they will use PU #2 to have the fresher one for Monza. Also, running a PU on 95% (or at least not full beans) and the life dramatically improves. Bit like you can bin a road engine that should do 100k miles, after 5k of track time.

[Hoffman900]

Bit like you can bin a road engine that should do 100k miles, after 5k of track time.

Exactly.

Most high performance street cars, can go 100k + miles no problem, but in a race environment, their fuse is very short.

A tune change or in other applications, just shifting 500-1000rpm less can double or triple engine life.

[PlatinumZealot]

We used to measure engine life in MegaWatt hours when I was in power generation. (MAN giant bore engines ).

The the piston rings and liner is what goes. I think for F1 the bearings may be closer in wear to the rings and liner since these bearings are waaaay more loaded than a normal slow speed engine.

On another note. I see Max is not quite gelling with this track. A few uncharacteristic points of weakness on exit here and there. I will be watching keenly how he gets on top of things.

[Mogster]

If they can run here, they can run at Road America.

Definitely.

It’s not the same. Zandvoort has some huge, banked, areas of gravel covering the faster sections. There are areas of Elkhart Lake with really serious run off problems, they can’t be fixed because of the underlying terrain or the surrounding stuff like roads and railways. The Kink at Elkhart Lake is like pre 1994 Tamburello at Imola…

[Hoffman900]

If they can run here, they can run at Road America.

Definitely.

It’s not the same. Zandvoort has some huge, banked, areas of gravel covering the faster sections. There are areas of Elkhart Lake with really serious run off problems, they can’t be fixed because of the underlying terrain or the surrounding stuff like roads and railways. The Kink at Elkhart Lake is like pre 1994 Tamburello at Imola…

The Kink has issues, but it’s no more dangerous than many of the street circuits F1 runs on or an oval.

The gravel traps have to be banked to keep the cars from going airborne off a banked corner. The corner at the end of the straight at Mid Ohio is a classic example of what happens when you don’t do that.

Zandvoort has a safer barrier on that final corner. An F1 car going left into that barrier is going to be ugly (over correction) and I don’t think they’re as tested in those type of impacts like Indy Cars have been.

There is one barrier at Zandvoort that juts out 35* (maybe a little less) to the racing surface and it’s not far off from the exit curbing (drivers are looking straight at it leaving the second to last corner). It’s at the entrance to the final corner. Besides being an incredible impact, it’s going to throw a car into the rest of the field at what isthe fastest corner on the track.

I’m sure if the Governor of Wisconsin wrote Liberty a check on the taxpayers dime, it would happen. Seems to work everywhere else…

Top right corner:

[Francis Bacon]

If they can run here, they can run at Road America.

Just politics is the only reason for it not happening. Too many dictators worldwide willing to cut Liberty a check.

Heck yes Road America.

[Mogster]

Definitely.

It’s not the same. Zandvoort has some huge, banked, areas of gravel covering the faster sections. There are areas of Elkhart Lake with really serious run off problems, they can’t be fixed because of the underlying terrain or the surrounding stuff like roads and railways. The Kink at Elkhart Lake is like pre 1994 Tamburello at Imola…

The Kink has issues, but it’s no more dangerous than many of the street circuits F1 runs on or an oval.

The gravel traps have to be banked to keep the cars from going airborne off a banked corner. The corner at the end of the straight at Mid Ohio is a classic example of what happens when you don’t do that.

Zandvoort has a safer barrier on that final corner. An F1 car going left into that barrier is going to be ugly (over correction) and I don’t think they’re as tested in those type of impacts like Indy Cars have been.

There is one barrier at Zandvoort that juts out 35* (maybe a little less) to the racing surface and it’s not far off from the exit curbing (drivers are looking straight at it leaving the second to last corner). It’s at the entrance to the final corner. Besides being an incredible impact, it’s going to throw a car into the rest of the field at what isthe fastest corner on the track.

I’m sure if the Governor of Wisconsin wrote Liberty a check on the taxpayers dime, it would happen. Seems to work everywhere else…

Top right corner:
https://www.holland.com/upload_mm/4/f/1 ... dvoort.jpg

The other problem with EL (and sadly really most other US road courses) is the lack of access, on site facilities and tbh the poor state of repair. The last couple of years EL lake has started to look particularly bad, even on TV. Also EL is in the middle of nowhere, the local area has no facilities for the teams or fans so F1 isn’t going there…

From a purely track point of view Watkins Glen is a much better proposition, Charlie Whiting said Watkins was essentially suitable for F1 when he reviewed its FIA grade 2 status. However the same problem exists, Watkins is in the middle of nowhere, has poor facilities for the teams and the local area has no facilities to support the teams or fans.

[Hoffman900]

That ultimately is the problem.

F1 is interested in replicating the Monaco model everywhere, at the expense of the racing itself.

[Mogster]

On a sentimental level I’d love to see US F1 back at Watkins, it’s US F1s historical home.

However its location just can’t support tens of 1000s of travelling fans and 1000s of team personnel. Where would everyone stay within a reasonable travel distance?

[Hoffman900]

On a sentimental level I’d love to see US F1 back at Watkins, it’s US F1s historical home.

However its location just can’t support tens of 1000s of travelling fans and 1000s of team personnel. Where would everyone stay within a reasonable travel distance?

NASCAR sells the place out. 95,000 including infield and 39,000 with grandstand seats.

Running the long course buys some more viewing capacity.

Spa only has a 70k person capacity and I believe is similarly situated as Watkins Glen. The Finger Lakes may have more to offer with the wineries and the lakes and all.

[search]

What are the odds for a Sainz win atm?

Would be awesome to have his maiden victory in red!

25/1 at the moment.

It could be a Ferrari or Alpine weekend, indeed! They seem very quick (or RBR + Mercedes unusually slow?).

Bottas lost half a second in sector 1. Hamilton had almost as quick sector times on Mediums as the Ferrari on Softs. I'd think there's still a lot to come.

[zibby43]

[Hoffman900]

I feel like we’re really lacking in data points though due to a shortened FP1 and Lewis going out early in FP2 to make a call on predicted pace. I also really don’t know how much clean running Max had.

[Wouter]

The FIA has other information, @Toni Sokolov too.

https://www.fia.com/events/fia-formula- ... nformation >>>> Second Practice Lap Times >>>>

file:///C:/Users/User/AppData/Local/Temp/2021_13_ned_f1_p2_timing_secondpracticesessionlaptimes_v01-1.pdf

Toni Sokolov @tonisokolov1011

Very interupted FP2 for the #DutchGP as we've had 2 Red Flag situations that really didn't provide us with a clear picture for Sunday.

It looks like Red Bull is the car to beat with Mercedes being close second, altough without Hamilton.
More details in article later on. #F1

[zibby43]

These data sets from FOM have little predictive value, aside from the fact that if the gaps are close, it’s usually close.

They can only go based off the data they have.