Mercedes GP W02

[marcush.]

Brawn seems to be angry with his technical staff convincing him to go for the swb option.
He cites high cofG with the fuelload as a possible cause for them underperforming.

Now that opens really the option to elongate the car ,move the batteries in RedBull manner between engine and gearbox and redesign the tank to occupy the bottom of the monocoque formerly blocked by the Battery pack..Quite a bit of work this but then real men need challenges....
They would come out with some more kers issues but i´m pretty sure they have the strength in depth in that department to not struggle like RedBull.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Well fair play to Brawn.

I think he needed someone like Bell to take stock, then tell him the honest to goodness truth. There are issues like weight distribution and tyres that affect this team persistently.
If I was in that department, I would be sweating right about now.

The positive out of this, is that a weakness has been identified. I expect a few comings and goings...

X, I agree that we will see a change. How big a change is hard to say. A marcush said, maybe all that's needed is a spacer.

[xpensive]

Well fair play to Brawn.

I think he needed someone like Bell to take stock, then tell him the honest to goodness truth. There are issues like weight distribution and tyres that affect this team persistently.
If I was in that department, I would be sweating right about now.

The positive out of this, is that a weakness has been identified. I expect a few comings and goings...

X, I agree that we will see a change. How big a change is hard to say. A marcush said, maybe all that's needed is a spacer.

A) I think the above verifies what I have said all the time, that RB has always been Technical director in name only.

B) A rear-suspension redesign could also incorporate a slight xtention of wheelbase, how much are we talking on the W02?

[marcush.]

I remember the delta in wheelbase Mercedes and Mclaren was 200mm thats an awful lot of volume to package some kers components.if you dare to put it between engine and gearbox .Admittedly this is not a happy place for a batterypack...

[mantikos]

In years past the tubes were for Schumacher's bad back. They are/were adjustable air bags.

Brian

He doesnt have a bad back and the airbags are because he likes to sit tight in his seat and not slide around...please don't make crap up!

[xpensive]

I remember the delta in wheelbase Mercedes and Mclaren was 200mm thats an awful lot of volume to package some kers components.if you dare to put it between engine and gearbox .Admittedly this is not a happy place for a batterypack...

200 mm shorter wheelbase than McLaren, are you sure about that? I have no recollection of MS' Ferraris being go-karts?

[marcush.]

He´s an old fart but you need to give it all to pass him and stay ahead.

Absolutely. The longer he drives the more I think he is one of the bests ever.
It doesn’t matter if he lost a few tents in qualifying compared to Rosberg. In the races he shows his real qualities. All the high rated drivers made stupid mistakes in Canada race except him. He doesn’t let you pass easily. Braking to the hairpin it sometimes looked like he tries to scare the others by letting the car slide in their direction.

He´s certainly not driving out of his depth every driver in Formula 1 would be very proud of that drive in that car under those circumstances.If it were Sutil,di Resta ,Buemi no question such a drive would pave your way into a front line team if you are able to do it not just occasionally.

any statement this was the car and nothing else should remember that Rosberg in exactly the same machinery had a tough time.
Quite interestingly Schumacher was quicker only in the final stage of the race when it counted.
He lost out to Rosberg in time spent in the pits even though Rosberg had to fetch a new nose..

[ForMuLaOne]

As it seems to happen that there is no real expertise behind most of the technical comments in this forum, most of you start to discuss things where you only need an opinion about topics which have been heavily discussed FOR AGES (Schumacher`s skills etc.) And, out of the sudden it seems so very clear how a shorter wheelbase effects the handling and tyre wear. If you guys need statements by those who build the car, then please stop to comment. Speculations are fine, and questions leading to a discussable issues are also nice. But there is so many nonsense around here. Why don`t you copy and paste technical illustrations from other pages and discuss them in a constructive way like we did pre-season? Maybe cause there are no major changes? So what, this means we don`t need to post that much.

[Byronrhys]

It's a little odd that this thread has so many posts, it's not normally a popular car and it isn't very interesting IMO.

Its is a popular car, the W01 was only beat in post count by the Mp4-25, and as to say its not interesting is also incorrect, being interesting isn't translated as being fast per se, for instance on the W02, the DRS is interesting, the short wheel base also, its double radiator, its exhaust solution, wheel nuts, annoying gills and how they beat the rules with them.. and a lot more.

[Giblet]

Let's leave this thread directly about technical developments and discussions about the car please. Drive yin yang has its own thread,

[hecti]

Thought I'd share some pics i took this weekend after the race:


you can see all my post race pics here

[marcush.]

First of all ,we are certainly not in it ,so what do you suppose to get in terms of real facts?
For a start we can clearly analyse what the team is reporting and how it relates to reality.
Mercedes GP have stood out in their two seasons with a lot of announcements and assumptions sold to the public as facts only to realise later on that they were indeed already in a blind alley and have to somehow redress their earlier statements.

Second nobody in the business would post sensitive information in a public forum or to the press ..so all the so called information we can gather is certainly half baked and filtered by some journo ...in the case of Scarbs he´s at least aware as much as earmarking asumptions as what they are when most mags sell assumptions as facts.

What has some relevance surely is the pictures we get and the timing wich does not lie ..but to derive really a complete picture from this is ..? we speculate but heck ..Brawn does as well methinks.The Teams try to sell themselves as professionals and masters of this exercise science.. they certainly are good very good but to me the whole formula 1 thing is a lot more trial and error than we are made to believe.
Just because someone can do a lot of complicated maths and simulate for weeks months and years does not say anything ...when in the end the results are indifferent.

.

[munudeges]

It really should have been obvious to everyone that the technical team wasn't strong enough, owing to the team's record as BAR and Honda. It was assembled from CART engineers and Reynard, wasn't it?

The wheelbase is the key to just about everything I feel, and if they're planning on changing their suspension to a push-rod one on this car then it will probably make things even worse. They're already lacking a ton of rear downforce, and it makes me wonder if this is why their front wing hasn't developed. They simply haven't had to balance the front out with the rear.

Wheelbase is normally determined by how the car and tyres will be affected mechanically, how much you need to pack into the space you've got and more importantly these days the aerodynamic profile of the car. The short wheelbase is clearly promoting too much movement mechanically, drastically shortening the life of the tyres, and they don't have as much space length-wise as other teams creating cooling problems. There will also be an increase in centre of gravity probably.

From an aerodynamic point of view the whole point of a pull-rod suspension is to get as much uninterrupted air to the back of the car exactly where this single diffuser is. If you have a car with a short wheelbase then you clearly negate this because everything is going to be shorter and fatter rather than slimmer and longer. That's the biggest reason for longer wheelbase cars these days.

Personally, I would increase the wheelbase of the car first before changing the suspension and see what happens. The suspension is a red herring. Then again, as Williams has proved, unless you have a solid aerodynamacist who can work with the space they're given then it's all a bit of a wasted trip (baby).

[marcush.]

BAR started out in 1999 ....you would say even when you came from a cart background after 12 years of Formula 1 you are still not up to the task? Dave Richards surely had a big swipe when he ran the ship and we should not forget that under Geoff willis the team was indeed a force...
The Technical team is the responsibility of Ross Brawn and not a legacy of Pollock and Reynard.

[munudeges]

The lineage of this team always seems to precede itself and you can't ignore history. The history of this team tells you that it eats through large wads of cash, it seems to take a titanic effort for them to get any modicum of success and they never seem to be able to maintain it.

It's amazing how a lot of things remain the same even when personnel have changed and been moved around.