Bahrain GP situation: postponed, reinstated, cancelled

[Hail22]

And above all F1 should stay out of politics

The FIA makes Formula 1 political, if you haven't picked up already...

[myurr]

And above all F1 should stay out of politics

The FIA makes Formula 1 political, if you haven't picked up already...

I absolutely have, and make a point about criticising the FIA for just that. But I fail to see how adding international politics to the internal politics of F1 makes that situation better.

[Mysticf1]

A bit of perspective on the Bahrain problem.

http://f1mole.wordpress.com/2012/02/16/ ... -mandarin/

[jenkF1]

I continue to see no chance for the GP to go forward. I have said so since November 2011 and the situation has not improved one bit since then. The al Khalifas will probably pay Bernie again in order to keep the GP on the schedule but the race isn't going to run this year.

As it stands I have my doubts that they can fix the situation in time for the 2013 GP. It is just too much political change that has to be implemented. The government report confirms the atrocities and human rights violations but no remedies are actioned. The protests are more violent every months and Amnesty International confirms ongoing torture by the regime. There is no sign of a change in government or the way the majority of the population is represented in a parliamentary system.

The F1 circus has some common sense left in it. The cancellation of the 2011 race has shown that. The same forces will prevent the 2012 race to take place. You simply can't hold a race in a place where protesters can invade the track and throw themselves in front of the cars with 500 million people watching on TV. It is not done that way.

Whilst you are probably right that it'll end up being cancelled again, I personally really wish it won't be. F1 should be a beacon of light to that country, bringing media attention and scrutiny to the region. Think about why the media is currently giving as prominent coverage to Bahrain as it is - precisely because of the GP. If the government give up on hosting a GP then do you think there will be this same scrutiny next year?

And above all F1 should stay out of politics. We race in places like China and India, where there are very real human rights abuses and state sponsored murders day in day out, and whilst I'm not one of them many people around the world have issues with America. If we allow politics to dictate where we race then you'd be able to find a group of people that would object to every single race on the calendar. Where do you draw the line? Why single out Bahrain?

You state that the grand prix will bring scrutiny on Bahrain but I think the complete opposite. The grand prix is run by the Sunni government and will be symbollic of their control of the country. It will be false evidence of stability in the region for them to show the West.

Good point about China etc. But at the same time, there is a situation at the forefront of media attention in Bahrain. China's people are not rebelling (mainly because they are to fearful to). In drawing the line, what about in the other direction. When do you say its still okay to hold a grand prix? Would Nazi Germany still be allowed? Apartheid South Africa, with white only grandstands?

[WhiteBlue]

You state that the grand prix will bring scrutiny on Bahrain but I think the complete opposite. The grand prix is run by the Sunni government and will be symbollic of their control of the country. It will be false evidence of stability in the region for them to show the West.

That is one point. The other point is the probability of violence at the race. Because the race is run by the government they oppose there is a huge temptation for the suppressed Schia minority to demonstrate their situation to the global TV audience. It would be easy for some activists to invade the track and throw themselves at the passing cars. It would be impossible for the government to secure such a huge area by security forces. It is a scenario one would not want to contemplate.

[bhall]

It would be impossible for the government to secure such a huge area by security forces. It is a scenario one would not want to contemplate.

That's not exactly true. Anyone who's been to a post-9/11 event in America can attest to that. In fact, it's likely easier to provide security in Bahrain, because they don't have that pesky notion of due process getting in the way.

Bad things are going to happen in Bahrain whether F1 is there or not. With F1's presence, at least those bad things will be seen by a massive audience.

[myurr]

I continue to see no chance for the GP to go forward. I have said so since November 2011 and the situation has not improved one bit since then. The al Khalifas will probably pay Bernie again in order to keep the GP on the schedule but the race isn't going to run this year.

As it stands I have my doubts that they can fix the situation in time for the 2013 GP. It is just too much political change that has to be implemented. The government report confirms the atrocities and human rights violations but no remedies are actioned. The protests are more violent every months and Amnesty International confirms ongoing torture by the regime. There is no sign of a change in government or the way the majority of the population is represented in a parliamentary system.

The F1 circus has some common sense left in it. The cancellation of the 2011 race has shown that. The same forces will prevent the 2012 race to take place. You simply can't hold a race in a place where protesters can invade the track and throw themselves in front of the cars with 500 million people watching on TV. It is not done that way.

Whilst you are probably right that it'll end up being cancelled again, I personally really wish it won't be. F1 should be a beacon of light to that country, bringing media attention and scrutiny to the region. Think about why the media is currently giving as prominent coverage to Bahrain as it is - precisely because of the GP. If the government give up on hosting a GP then do you think there will be this same scrutiny next year?

And above all F1 should stay out of politics. We race in places like China and India, where there are very real human rights abuses and state sponsored murders day in day out, and whilst I'm not one of them many people around the world have issues with America. If we allow politics to dictate where we race then you'd be able to find a group of people that would object to every single race on the calendar. Where do you draw the line? Why single out Bahrain?

You state that the grand prix will bring scrutiny on Bahrain but I think the complete opposite. The grand prix is run by the Sunni government and will be symbollic of their control of the country. It will be false evidence of stability in the region for them to show the West.

Good point about China etc. But at the same time, there is a situation at the forefront of media attention in Bahrain. China's people are not rebelling (mainly because they are to fearful to). In drawing the line, what about in the other direction. When do you say its still okay to hold a grand prix? Would Nazi Germany still be allowed? Apartheid South Africa, with white only grandstands?

Many sporting events did boycott apartheid South Africa and yet did it really change that much or have the intended consequences? Would F1 alone boycotting Bahrain have greater or lesser impact? It's a hugely complex subject without definitive answers.

Another way to look at it is with the terrorist organisation Hamas gaining control of Palestine. Through having to step up to the plate and run the country and look after their people it is arguable that they stopped much of their terror activities to concentrate on the job in hand. The same happened with the IRA in Northern Ireland.

All that said it's such a contentious subject with so many conflicting sources of information that we're not going to all be able to agree on this message board.

For me it is far more important for sport to be something that can unite all the people of the world than it is to use it as a political weapon against the rulers of a particular land. Let the politicians fight that battle using diplomacy, sanctions, the threat of force, etc. Let sport unite the people of all countries and shine the media's spotlight on troubled regions, making sure that events in these lands are not just quietly forgotten as soon as the media moves on to the next story.

[PlatinumZealot]

If we don't live in Bahrain we should just mind our own business and enjoy the race.

[ESPImperium]

True, but how would you feel if the protestors murdered a car containing a group of a teams personell or even if a protestor got into the circuit and jumped the barriers and ran out on front of a driver in one of the 4 high speed straights there and killed himself and posibly the driver as well???

Would you like to watch a "martyr" murder a driver?

Would F1 want to show that, would sponsors like to have their names on the blood stained barriers where the car finally came to rest? How would the broadcasters like to show it on their networks? How would the viewing public like to have that on their televisions on a Sunday lunchtime whilst eating their Sunday roast? It doesnt even have to be sunday it could happen in Quali or one of the FP sessions.

How would the FIA and indeed FOM even put out that PR fire without at least Bernie and Jean submitting a resignation letter. In the civialised world, heads would roll in a corperate way, not in a war way.

I know that China has a poor Human Rights record, but at least they arnt fanatical about the way they go about their cause, their security is more or less absouloute.

But i have had a good moral sence instilled into me by my Grand Father who fought in WW2 and my father who worked in a ship yard during the Falklands War. The Bahrani people deserve freedom and changes, untill Bahrain is a safe and stable state again, i think F1 should stay away.

With the gap in the callender, should there be a race replace Bahrain or should the teams go testing. Id rather have another test in season, however im totaly unsure of the Logistics of how either could be done. A 3 day test at Imola or Magney would probably be what id do.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

+1 Nsmikle

@ESPI

Bahraini multinational companies are also involved with F1 teams. Should these withdraw?
You mention China, look at their Human rights record. America? Geneva convention contraventions at Guantanamo bay. Britain? Going to war on hear say costing 1000s of lives? Hell look at Turkey and their treatment of Kurds!
We shouldn't ignore the goings on, but whether F1 is there or not these things will still happen.
If it was constructively used, when the Media is there attention could be drawn to the plight of some of the people.

The government would never have called on Saudi tanks if there was an element of aggression in the uprising. Legitimate or not, people with rocks and petrol bombs are no match for tanks. The people behind the uprising should have had the nous to realise that.
My experience of what happened in South Africa is a good marker. Nothing progressed through violence, and only when all the parties involved could agree on peaceful elections and minority/majority dynamic. Its all gone down the pan there now, but that's irrelevant in the context of transformation from a state of panic to a stable government. There was no bloodshed.

In my opinion, if F1 goes ahead in Bahrain it will be a good platform for the disgruntled to make their point peacefully.

[bhall]

Legitimate or not, people with rocks and petrol bombs are no match for tanks. The people behind the uprising should have had the [sense] to realise that.

The world would be a far different place if everyone followed that logic. Overcoming almost insurmountable odds is how nations are born.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Legitimate or not, people with rocks and petrol bombs are no match for tanks. The people behind the uprising should have had the [sense] to realise that.

The world would be a far different place if everyone followed that logic. Overcoming almost insurmountable odds is how nations are born.

Then they have to accept casualties. And they cannot ask for outside interference in an internal problem as they decided on the aggressive strategy.

Victory attained by violence is tantamount to a defeat, for it is momentary

[bhall]

I agree with you in that they, or anyone in a similar position, must be willing to accept what happens, whatever that may be. After all, "one can't win unless he's willing to be defeated." (~ Me)

Yet, I don't know that I necessarily think an intervention by others is strictly off-limits. History notes too many incidents of that happening without any real political effect one way or the other. The victors still collect the spoils, you know?

Moreover, the Bahraini government opened the door for possible intervention the very moment Saudi troops crossed the border.

And while it would be nice if we could look to Gandhi to illuminate the path to peace, the "real world," sadly, just doesn't work that way. Yes, war will always be a spiritual assassin, even when it's necessary to secure justice. But, sometimes it truly is the only way to secure justice.

Maybe one day that will change. Humanity, it seems, simply hasn't finished evolving yet.

If we don't live in Bahrain we should just mind our own business and enjoy the race.

The problem is that the West has never minded its own business as far as the Middle East is concerned. Somebody somewhere decided that stable oil supply and prices were worth more than people, and since then "we've" unapologetically pulled every string possible to accomplish that goal. Well, the natives have finally gotten restless.

[ESPImperium]

James Allen has written a well ballanced article on his blog: http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2012/02/f ... ahrain-gp/

[WhiteBlue]

It would not need a suicide invader to cause havoc. Just one Molotov slinger getting access to the track would be enough. I'm totally convinced that the authorities cannot provide enough security forces around the facility to prevent pig headed demonstrators gaining illegal access over a period of 72 hours.