European GP 2010 - Valencia

[feni_remmen]

Hamilton did say in the press confrence he couldnt see the car, and before I make this comment I am a Lewis Hamilton fan,... but I believe that was a load of old tosh. He seen the car, thought about it and went for it. What was interesting for me was I do not think McLaren HQ knew about it, their was no footage of this until AFTER the penalty was imposed and Martin Whitmarsh didnt look all to pleased.

Either way I do not think he was totally to blame, Race Control balls up the Safety Car deployment, but what strikes me as even stanger is why they didnt pit Hamilton that lap!

I think we need to research some facts here first. I am making these numbers up, but if race control called the safety car 30 seconds after the accident, then imagine if they had've called it at 25 seconds after the accident. In that case I think they would've caught Vettel as well. At this point Button or maybe who ever was just in front of him (?Massa?) may have won the race.The point is, the problem is a logistical one. It probably takes at least 20 seconds for the safety car to get to the control line from the moment Charlie calls a safety car. So to catch the leader of the race he need to make that call when the leader is 15 seconds from the last corner (or something like that). We all rave on about who is to blame, but the truth will lie in the gaps between all of the events.
First Question ~ Did the whole field drive by the accident scene before the SC period?

[Giblet]

Race control does not care where and when the safety car is deployed. They send it out as quickly as they can, and deem proper. Race results are the farthest thing form Charlie's mind when an accident occurs, and rightly so.

The problem is the convoluted safety car rules, and the fact drivers have to make split second decisions based on them while trying to run a race. The rules need to be more cut and dry.

[zgred]

Ten drivers handed post-race penalties

In a separate incident, Timo Glock has had 20 seconds added to his race time for ignoring blue flags.

[ringo]

They need a rule where everyone holds position that they had at the time of the accident. Or simply prevent cars from going to the pits during the yellow of the SC period, even if the car is not yet on track; since there is no refueling.

I believe the SC should only be used in the race weekend for safety purposes not as a slot machine after someone crashes out. It seems it is some kind of lotto game that some teams look forward to, no longer is it seen as something to bring order on the track.

Everyone who had a bad weekend should direct their blame at Marc Webber. Alonso, Heiki, Ferrari, Kubica, Massa, all should blame flipper for causing the SC in the first place.
The race would have been very good without it.

[WhiteBlue]

Wow glad mark walked away

In the past he would have been killed there - and frankly he would have deserved it. 100% his fault.

Segedunum, you must be out of your mind. Who can wish a driver would die? This personal hate is the worst I have ever seen. A pitty that we don't have a rating for such unbelievable comments. I'm ashamed to be posting on the same board. Your post is a disgrace for the sport and this board. I wish it will be deleted and that you apologise.

[feni_remmen]

They need a rule where everyone holds position that they had at the time of the accident. Or simply prevent cars from going to the pits during the yellow of the SC period, even if the car is not yet on track; since there is no refueling.

I believe the SC should only be used in the race weekend for safety purposes not as a slot machine after someone crashes out. It seems it is some kind of lotto game that some teams look forward to, no longer is it seen as something to bring order on the track.

Everyone who had a bad weekend should direct their blame at Marc Webber. Alonso, Heiki, Ferrari, Kubica, Massa, all should blame flipper for causing the SC in the first place.
The race would have been very good without it.

That's right Ringo. All the equipment and procedures are in place to allow a controlled field without the Safety Car. Except that everyone would prefer some controversy and a bunch up field! Insane.

[ringo]

About Mark "flipper" Webber,
Webber's f duct would have kept the car on the ground.
We have to remember the rear wing and diffuser is behind the rear wheel center line. This means the downforce on the rear wing is clockwise moment which acts to pitch the nose up.
The front wing and floor downforce is what balances the forces and keeps the car from rotating around the back wheels. No front wing, with a little bump, and the car will flip. F duct would reduce the flipping by reducing downforce over the rear wing.


About the SC, Button seems to be a very lucky fellow, he benefited more than anyone else. Alonso is just pissed he didn't follow Hamilton past the SC.
The hamilton penality is also not neccesary, he missed it by a few metres and i don't think he was fully able to see where he was relative to the SC. I think he got that one becuase another reprimand would seem like they were favouring him.

Hamilton did say in the press confrence he couldnt see the car, and before I make this comment I am a Lewis Hamilton fan,... but I believe that was a load of old tosh. He seen the car, thought about it and went for it. What was interesting for me was I do not think McLaren HQ knew about it, their was no footage of this until AFTER the penalty was imposed and Martin Whitmarsh didnt look all to pleased.

Either way I do not think he was totally to blame, Race Control balls up the Safety Car deployment, but what strikes me as even stanger is why they didnt pit Hamilton that lap!

Yes he saw the top of the car, but did he see the line ahead of the car?
It's imposisble for him to judge where the line is to the SC, his field of vission prevents him from doing that. He only has an idea of where it is, this is when he hesitated. In the same way Vettel always has an idea of where another car is on the track, but never really quite knows exactly where.

[Intego]

It seems it is some kind of lotto game that some teams look forward to, no longer is it seen as something to bring order on the track.

Actually MCL speculated for a SC in Canada, but it didn't come out.

[timbo]

IMO with no refuelling, the dreaded closed-pit rule makes sense.

[Just_a_fan]

The irony with the Hamilton / SC issue is that, had Hamilton just raced towards the second corner as normal he would have been well past the SC at the SC line. Alonso would not have been or would have been in the same position as Hamilton found himself having to decide what to do.

What ever Hamilton did would not have affected Alonso's position at the end.

Alonso / Ferrari played to form though - cry foul in any and all situations and try to get Ferrari International Assistance to help them. Luckily, the FIA has moved on from those days.

I'm just glad that the driver-steward was a German - imagine the outcry had it been a Brit!!

[jason.parker.86]

This car is faster than the Mclaren atm. Alonso was hounding Hamilton in the earlier laps, especially exiting the turns. It just seemed faster watching it pecking at the back of the Mp4 in the first 5 or so laps. Unfortunate for the F10 it didn't finish where it deserved. It easily could have threatened for the win.

Sorry? Catching Hamilton? I seem to remember Hamilton pulling away?

[andartop]

The irony with the Hamilton / SC issue is that, had Hamilton just raced towards the second corner as normal he would have been well past the SC at the SC line. Alonso would not have been or would have been in the same position as Hamilton found himself having to decide what to do.

What ever Hamilton did would not have affected Alonso's position at the end.

Alonso / Ferrari played to form though - cry foul in any and all situations and try to get Ferrari International Assistance to help them. Luckily, the FIA has moved on from those days.

I'm just glad that the driver-steward was a German - imagine the outcry had it been a Brit!!

So, how does the fact it was Ferrari who brought this to the stewards' attention change the fact LH did something deemed illegal by the rules?

[PlatinumZealot]

This car is faster than the Mclaren atm. Alonso was hounding Hamilton in the earlier laps, especially exiting the turns. It just seemed faster watching it pecking at the back of the Mp4 in the first 5 or so laps. Unfortunate for the F10 it didn't finish where it deserved. It easily could have threatened for the win.

Sorry? Catching Hamilton? I seem to remember Hamilton pulling away?

Alonso's engineer told him to hang back when I remember it. They were saying Hamilton's wing is damaged or something like that.

[Afterburner]

This was one of the worst races i've ever seen race control related, 5s penalty?! Drive through penalty for LH? Well, this shows crime pays off...

[Just_a_fan]

Hamilton was punished for his misdemeanour. As I said, had he just raced towards the second corner he wouldn't have been in a position to be punished. The irony is that wondering if he was being naughty actually made him naughty.

Anyway, I don't like the way that Ferrari goes about its little games running to the stewards at every turn. They weren't even doing it in an attempt to better their position - they were just trying to ruin someone elses race. And that is just sad.