2019 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Honda F1 Team

[Manoah2u]

Paddock talk. It's really only Renaults claim and Cyril BS PR. Still surprise he is still having his job. I believe RB dumping them hurt them more and they feel like responding. I wonder Riccardo is thinking now

If I remember correctly he was offered significantly less money than Max at RBR and Renault offered Ricardo significantly more than Max is getting. So I'm sure from that prospective he is extremely happy. Although Horner didn't say that.

Listen things at RBR haven't changed significantly from last few years. They are pretty much in same place. The real change this year is Ferrari's pace, Vettel in particular.

I don't have a link, but I remember Horner (and co) saying that Ricciardo was offered all he asked for to stay, It was not over cash. I dont know that he did make the right move, but he made it at the time his value was highest.
I would not be at all surprised to see either him or seb back there soon though

I think Ricciardo's ship has sailed. No way Seb comes back, there is no room for him. They got max and no need for a hot tempered has-been. Ricciardo left and they didnt enjoy that much, they gave him everything. Yes he's miles better than Gasly but they go with Max now and they need a supporting act for Max, not risk Prost-Senna situations.
Albon is the way to go, he's fast, controlled, a whole LOT cheaper than DannyRic which then goes into the car, and will accept a 'supporting role' whilst growing and learning to become a force himself. Albon is able to win, Gasly not.

Danny will stay at Renault OR switch to Mercedes/Ferrari when the opportunity arises and i think that opportunity will rise at both. Vettel will leave 'soon' (2020 or 2021) and then it depends on whether Hamilton wants to go there or not. If Hamilton goes to Ferrari, Daniel will go to Mercedes, it's that simple.
If Hamilton doesn't go to Ferrari, Daniel will go to Ferrari - UNLESS Hamilton simply retires from F1 and Mercedes would be a better bet. Renault is nothing more but a placeholder for Daniel for this year and presumably next year aswell.

Before, Max was the ace in the hold that influenced seat possibilities, and that was due to the question mark regarding how Honda would do. That question has been answered and Max is now completely out of the picture regarding available seats. Mercedes might double his wages, or would Ferrari, Max still would stay with RBR.

Since Honda is performing well, the value (financially AND performance-wise) of a seat at RBR has skyrocketed and now there is no longer room for diappointment. In other words, Gasly's expiration date has arrived due to Honda delivering their promise. Gasly doesn't , so he's out, it's a no-brainer. Albon or Kvyat in, that's all there is.

[ivanlesk]

There is a good example front of us. Spec 3. It looked like there is not any gain with the update in the first race. Because of reliability first aproach. And then let hp's run freely around.
Let's assume Renault has 1000 hp ( I like Renault in fact. If it is true no problem for me) but there is not reliability What is point of it.

I hope more powerful PU before reliability

Little bit contradictory isn't it?

No.
If it is reliability issue that prevent you from finishing races then reliability first. But if you aim 7 races reliability before power then for me power first compared to reliability.

Reliability almost always cost you points / finishing. Rearly we se people cruising around just to finish with some issue.

[Pyrone89]

If I remember correctly he was offered significantly less money than Max at RBR and Renault offered Ricardo significantly more than Max is getting. So I'm sure from that prospective he is extremely happy. Although Horner didn't say that.

Listen things at RBR haven't changed significantly from last few years. They are pretty much in same place. The real change this year is Ferrari's pace, Vettel in particular.

I don't have a link, but I remember Horner (and co) saying that Ricciardo was offered all he asked for to stay, It was not over cash. I dont know that he did make the right move, but he made it at the time his value was highest.
I would not be at all surprised to see either him or seb back there soon though

I think Ricciardo's ship has sailed. No way Seb comes back, there is no room for him. They got max and no need for a hot tempered has-been. Ricciardo left and they didnt enjoy that much, they gave him everything. Yes he's miles better than Gasly but they go with Max now and they need a supporting act for Max, not risk Prost-Senna situations.
Albon is the way to go, he's fast, controlled, a whole LOT cheaper than DannyRic which then goes into the car, and will accept a 'supporting role' whilst growing and learning to become a force himself. Albon is able to win, Gasly not.

Danny will stay at Renault OR switch to Mercedes/Ferrari when the opportunity arises and i think that opportunity will rise at both. Vettel will leave 'soon' (2020 or 2021) and then it depends on whether Hamilton wants to go there or not. If Hamilton goes to Ferrari, Daniel will go to Mercedes, it's that simple.
If Hamilton doesn't go to Ferrari, Daniel will go to Ferrari - UNLESS Hamilton simply retires from F1 and Mercedes would be a better bet. Renault is nothing more but a placeholder for Daniel for this year and presumably next year aswell.

Before, Max was the ace in the hold that influenced seat possibilities, and that was due to the question mark regarding how Honda would do. That question has been answered and Max is now completely out of the picture regarding available seats. Mercedes might double his wages, or would Ferrari, Max still would stay with RBR.

Since Honda is performing well, the value (financially AND performance-wise) of a seat at RBR has skyrocketed and now there is no longer room for diappointment. In other words, Gasly's expiration date has arrived due to Honda delivering their promise. Gasly doesn't , so he's out, it's a no-brainer. Albon or Kvyat in, that's all there is.

If RB indeed starts to challenge for the win on all tracks with Verstappen, then Mercedes and Ferrari need Hamilton. The others including RIC and VET wont cut it as nr.1’s. Leclerc is still a question mark. So why would Merc or Ferrari hire RIC as nr.1 (as nr.2 is a different story) when he was already shown the be slower in both Q and R than Max Verstappen, a Verstappen who has seemee to go to yet another gear this year on top of it.

[GPR-A]

If I remember correctly he was offered significantly less money than Max at RBR and Renault offered Ricardo significantly more than Max is getting. So I'm sure from that prospective he is extremely happy. Although Horner didn't say that.

Listen things at RBR haven't changed significantly from last few years. They are pretty much in same place. The real change this year is Ferrari's pace, Vettel in particular.

I don't have a link, but I remember Horner (and co) saying that Ricciardo was offered all he asked for to stay, It was not over cash. I dont know that he did make the right move, but he made it at the time his value was highest.
I would not be at all surprised to see either him or seb back there soon though

I think Ricciardo's ship has sailed. No way Seb comes back, there is no room for him. They got max and no need for a hot tempered has-been. Ricciardo left and they didnt enjoy that much, they gave him everything. Yes he's miles better than Gasly but they go with Max now and they need a supporting act for Max, not risk Prost-Senna situations.
Albon is the way to go, he's fast, controlled, a whole LOT cheaper than DannyRic which then goes into the car, and will accept a 'supporting role' whilst growing and learning to become a force himself. Albon is able to win, Gasly not.

Danny will stay at Renault OR switch to Mercedes/Ferrari when the opportunity arises and i think that opportunity will rise at both. Vettel will leave 'soon' (2020 or 2021) and then it depends on whether Hamilton wants to go there or not. If Hamilton goes to Ferrari, Daniel will go to Mercedes, it's that simple.
If Hamilton doesn't go to Ferrari, Daniel will go to Ferrari - UNLESS Hamilton simply retires from F1 and Mercedes would be a better bet. Renault is nothing more but a placeholder for Daniel for this year and presumably next year aswell.

Before, Max was the ace in the hold that influenced seat possibilities, and that was due to the question mark regarding how Honda would do. That question has been answered and Max is now completely out of the picture regarding available seats. Mercedes might double his wages, or would Ferrari, Max still would stay with RBR.

Since Honda is performing well, the value (financially AND performance-wise) of a seat at RBR has skyrocketed and now there is no longer room for diappointment. In other words, Gasly's expiration date has arrived due to Honda delivering their promise. Gasly doesn't , so he's out, it's a no-brainer. Albon or Kvyat in, that's all there is.

What are Red Bull's options if Max decides to leave? Their young driver lineup has dried.

[Manoah2u]

The thing is, RIC is NOT slower than Verstappen and RIC is blazingly fast and i think we can all argue he's got an overtaking 'divebomb' skill that NO driver in the field has today.
Ricciardo has a huge skillsket, is very experienced, very fast and a very positive attribute to any team. Ricciardo is guaranteed better than Vettel, so it's quite easy to ditch Vettel in favour of Ricciardo. If LeClerc wasn't around - or lets say, Ferrari's late boss didn't mandate Charles to get a seat there, then Ricciardo would have replaced Raikkonen without a single doubt, even though there has been talk Vettel 'blocked' his entry aswell, whether that has any merit is unknown to me.
Ricciardo without a single moment of doubt is a safer bet than Ocon and above all is vastly more stable and experienced and quite frankly, a proven race winner, and as or even faster, i say the latter. Hell, if Bottas actually gets replaced next year, personally, i think Mercedes would be better off replacing Bottas with Ricciardo than Ocon.
I think it would be a far safer bet to then put Ocon in 2021 and see what happens when Hammy goes to Ferrari in 2021.

but i'm turning this way too much in silly season thread.

Was it wise for Ricciardo to leave RedBull this year? well, if you compare how he's doing at Renault right now, not so much.But, if his move is done purposefully to give him a surrounding which makes it easier for him to go to a competitive top team, then i think it's a absolutely brilliant move,and something i think as such could very much be what he's looking to do.

At Renault, he finds himself in a much less 'pressurised' environment. After all, he is forced to be weighed out against joung gun Max, and is judged - fair or not- on everything compared to him. Next of all, it's clear RBR is focusing more and more on Max, so the environment isn't that beneficial to him.
At Renault, he doesn't have any of the PR regime RBR has, doesn't have the slightest faint of pressure he had at RBR, and can even have a bad day without being weighed out for it.
Matter of fact, if he has a good impressive day, it's made much more special than the same 'effort' (even though in a better car the result will be better) at his former team.
His knowledge of the Renault engine surely helps and they appreciate him for being positive, not critical, so has a much warmer reception/environment there.

All along he is in a team that doesn't give him the WDC and winning environment he is looking for, so when the opportunity arises for a seat at Mercedes or Ferrari,
he will recieve zero backlash, the team will miss him but won't hold him back, and there will be no contracts or weird clauses that will hamper progression.
whilst essentially taking a break from F1 whilst still racing for F1.

At first i didn't get much of his decision, but by now, as i mentioned, i think it's an absolutely brilliant move which is carefully thought over.and quite frankly, he now has much more options:

Theoretically, he can still come back to RBR. At the same time, he's comfortable at Renault, and can go to either Ferrari or Mercedes any way he wants.

and, as if things weren't brilliant enough: He has such a great salary at Renault, that he either can step in either of those big teams with that same fantastic salary, or make his bargaining tools much better by offering to take a salary cut so he can step into the top teams, which will make him interesting anyway.

DannyRic doesn't get his impressive salary because he's not a valuable aquirement. He's worth the buck.

2020 or 2021, probably the latter, DannyRic at Mercedes or Ferrari. that is my bet. If it's Ferrari, that means alongside LeClerc. a fan-tastic duo if you'd ask me. If it's Mercedes, then any duo would be seriously impressive but if it's Hamilton-Ricciardo, that would be just mesmerizing. Ricciardo-Bottas sounds pretty stellar still, and quite frankly, Ricciardo-Ocon or Ricciardo-Russell sounds pretty tasty too.

I think 2022 Ricciardo-Schumacher would be fantastic too. Whether that be at Mercedes or Ferrari, i don't care.

BUT i must say i'd also be curious to see whether or not RedBull does a Verstappen repeat and offer Schumacher a Toro Rosso seat next year and replace Albon or Kvyat going to RBR whilst Gasly gets the big ol' boot.
The mere thought of Verstappen - Schumacher is just absolutely sensational and would be 'like father like son', even though things are a bit different this time. I think it would also be quite an interesting and worthwile combination. I even think Mick would be better off at RedBull after a ToroRosso start.

[Manoah2u]

What are Red Bull's options if Max decides to leave? Their young driver lineup has dried.

Max won't leave.
That said, Albon is in the pipeline, and i'd say they should put an offer on the table for Schumacher.
Get them while they're hot.

[GPR-A]

What are Red Bull's options if Max decides to leave? Their young driver lineup has dried.

Max won't leave.
That said, Albon is in the pipeline, and i'd say they should put an offer on the table for Schumacher.
Get them while they're hot.

Why wouldn't Max leave if Mercedes is still ahead in 2020?

[Manoah2u]

What are Red Bull's options if Max decides to leave? Their young driver lineup has dried.

Max won't leave.
That said, Albon is in the pipeline, and i'd say they should put an offer on the table for Schumacher.
Get them while they're hot.

Why wouldn't Max leave if Mercedes is still ahead in 2020?

It's doubtfull Mercedes will still be 'that' ahead at the end of this year.
Winning loyally with RBR, in much more of an underdog position is worth much more than Mercedes,
and Mercedes' dominance is coming to an end fast. RBR is going to be the better team soon, so why
on earth lose all your investment and effort at RBR for a question mark?

Additionally, it's rather doubtfull Mercedes is going to keep being ahead in 2021, which is where
everybody certainly is aiming towards. RBR has the cards to be better in the relative short-term.
Why risk everything for just a day success tomorrow?

[GPR-A]

Max won't leave.
That said, Albon is in the pipeline, and i'd say they should put an offer on the table for Schumacher.
Get them while they're hot.

Why wouldn't Max leave if Mercedes is still ahead in 2020?

It's doubtfull Mercedes will still be 'that' ahead at the end of this year.
Winning loyally with RBR, in much more of an underdog position is worth much more than Mercedes,
and Mercedes' dominance is coming to an end fast. RBR is going to be the better team soon, so why
on earth lose all your investment and effort at RBR for a question mark?

Additionally, it's rather doubtfull Mercedes is going to keep being ahead in 2021, which is where
everybody certainly is aiming towards. RBR has the cards to be better in the relative short-term.
Why risk everything for just a day success tomorrow?

Fan sensibilities,.team loyalties are not something a driver cares, because the single biggest desire for every top driver is to be in the championship winning car and team. IF Mercedes manages to stay ahead, regardless of the margin and provides a good outlook of the 2021 plans, it's natural wisdom to take an informed decision and jump ship. Ultimately, a driver is remembered for the championships he won, not for being a loyal servant of a team.

Red Bull Honda need to have their plans in place in this ruthless competitive atmosphere. Max's perceived loyalty can't be their only option.

[McMika98]

What are Red Bull's options if Max decides to leave? Their young driver lineup has dried.

Max won't leave.
That said, Albon is in the pipeline, and i'd say they should put an offer on the table for Schumacher.
Get them while they're hot.

Just what has Schumacher done this year that is sensational? Getting spanked by Zhou in the rookie class. Has he even got the superlicence points necessary?
Id take Nyck DeVries in a heartbeat over him, dude is fast but impulsive. F1 will suit him better.
If Max was to leave Vettel will be reinstated instantly as the No1 driver. Simples.

[Pyrone89]

The thing is, RIC is NOT slower than Verstappen and RIC is blazingly fast and i think we can all argue he's got an overtaking 'divebomb' skill that NO driver in the field has today.

I think 2022 Ricciardo-Schumacher would be fantastic too. Whether that be at Mercedes or Ferrari, i don't care.

BUT i must say i'd also be curious to see whether or not RedBull does a Verstappen repeat and offer Schumacher a Toro Rosso seat next year and replace Albon or Kvyat going to RBR whilst Gasly gets the big ol' boot.
The mere thought of Verstappen - Schumacher is just absolutely sensational and would be 'like father like son', even though things are a bit different this time. I think it would also be quite an interesting and worthwile combination. I even think Mick would be better off at RedBull after a ToroRosso start.

1. It was not like RIC was Gasly levels behind, but especially after Monaco 2018 Verstappen was well ahead on pace, and this was before RIC decided to jump ship. So at the time RB had every reason to not piss of RIC (or even favor him) until he extended.
2 Mick has shown zero to be considered F1 material, let alone top team material. He won in F3 against one of the weakest field in years driving a Prema. He has failed to impress in an equally weak F2 field so far and has only managed to finally score a win in a sprint race due to the idiotic reverse grid concept which makes the value of a win in the sprint race a lot lower than in a feature race. Yet again driving a Prema, considered the dominant team in feeder series. People just keep hyping him based on his last name. If he had been called Mick Housemaker nobody would have given him any chance in F1

[Sieper]

Ric is slower then Ver. So much so in fact that in that 2018 post season pace difference chart the only bigger gap between teammates was Hartley and Gasly. That astonished quite a few onlookers. Ric is very good in selling his own vantagepoint. He does it so well that that is better known then reality. This is not to say Ric is a Poor driver or so, he is very, very good, just not as fast as Verstappen.

[Maplesoup]

What are Red Bull's options if Max decides to leave? Their young driver lineup has dried.

Max won't leave.
That said, Albon is in the pipeline, and i'd say they should put an offer on the table for Schumacher.
Get them while they're hot.

Schumacher is a Ferrari junior so doubt it would happen. Red bull still have a really good rookie program, check out a guy called Vips he's done some great driving in the lower ranks.

[Maplesoup]

Paddock talk. It's really only Renaults claim and Cyril BS PR. Still surprise he is still having his job. I believe RB dumping them hurt them more and they feel like responding. I wonder Riccardo is thinking now

If I remember correctly he was offered significantly less money than Max at RBR and Renault offered Ricardo significantly more than Max is getting. So I'm sure from that prospective he is extremely happy. Although Horner didn't say that.

Listen things at RBR haven't changed significantly from last few years. They are pretty much in same place. The real change this year is Ferrari's pace, Vettel in particular.

I don't have a link, but I remember Horner (and co) saying that Ricciardo was offered all he asked for to stay, It was not over cash. I dont know that he did make the right move, but he made it at the time his value was highest.
I would not be at all surprised to see either him or seb back there soon though

You are correct.

I believe it was mentioned on the drive to survive Netflix series. Also during live interviews last year and on motorsport.com articles.

I think he got the same cash offer as max but better benefits. In the end Renault offered way more for him think he's paid more than max at the minute.

But as David Coulthard said don't move for the money, stick with the better chance of winning. End of the day ric and max could be 2nd and 3rd in the championship and red bull would be second. I think he will come too regret the move.

[diffuser]

If I remember correctly he was offered significantly less money than Max at RBR and Renault offered Ricardo significantly more than Max is getting. So I'm sure from that prospective he is extremely happy. Although Horner didn't say that.

Listen things at RBR haven't changed significantly from last few years. They are pretty much in same place. The real change this year is Ferrari's pace, Vettel in particular.

I don't have a link, but I remember Horner (and co) saying that Ricciardo was offered all he asked for to stay, It was not over cash. I dont know that he did make the right move, but he made it at the time his value was highest.
I would not be at all surprised to see either him or seb back there soon though

exactly, RB had given RIC everything he asked for, even a short term deal that "IF" a seat came avialable at Mercedes or Ferrari he could leave....

"We gave Daniel everything he wanted and asked for and it still wasn't enough," said Horner. "We bent over backwards to make it happen."

Red Bull's complicity even extended to offering Ricciardo a short-term deal in case Mercedes or Ferrari sought his services for 2020.

"We were even prepared to do a one-year agreement should Ferrari or Mercedes come knocking in 12 months' time," Horner confirmed.

"It wasn't about money, it wasn't about status, position, commitment, or duration. If someone's heart is not really in it…"

https://www.skysports.com/f1/news/12433 ... do-leaving

That was what Horner said.

But you can see here [url] https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.gpfans ... d=4026/url]

Danny getting paid 3.5 Million more than Max.