Most important technical development in F1?

[autogyro]

So F1 is there to help develop aircraft and yachts.
Says it all.
Oh and I seem to remember an aircraft, now what was it called...........
Ah yes Concorde. I think that was a little better than any of the others, at least for aerodynamics.
Cant see F1 aero catching up there then.

[aral]

So F1 is there to help develop aircraft and yachts.
Says it all.
Oh and I seem to remember an aircraft, now what was it called...........
Ah yes Concorde. I think that was a little better than any of the others, at least for aerodynamics.
Cant see F1 aero catching up there then.

You were talking about no progress in aerodynamics since WW2 weren't you? That must be why I had to fly recently in an Avro Lancastrian. (for your info, a civilianised verson of the Lancaster.)

Aero on cars has advanced fantastically. If it hadn't I doubt that the current cars would be able to drive at any speed, around a track.

[autogyro]

You do not have to explain the Lancastrian gilgen, I have flown in Shackletons.
Contra rotating airscrews on the Griffon engine.
Also worked with Nimrods and guess what they are still state of the art.
The Germans were working on transonic laminar flow in 1940.
After all Boeing airliners are only large versions of the sub sonic ME262 using British engines.
Almost all work on F1 aero is to meet regulations, not to advance aero technology.
It is an illusion to keep people in work nothing more, just like the over kill arms industries wasting our money.
Even Adrian Newey will tell you it has all been done before at least twice.

[aral]

You do not have to explain the Lancastrian gilgen, I have flown in Shackletons.
Contra rotating airscrews on the Griffon engine.
Also worked with Nimrods and guess what they are still state of the art.
The Germans were working on transonic laminar flow in 1940.
After all Boeing airliners are only large versions of the sub sonic ME262 using British engines.
Almost all work on F1 aero is to meet regulations, not to advance aero technology.
It is an illusion to keep people in work nothing more, just like the over kill arms industries wasting our money.
Even Adrian Newey will tell you it has all been done before at least twice.

A number of your "facts" could be up for debate, but unfortunately this is not the thread for that, so I will leave it so as to allow it to return to the proper topic.

[Just_a_fan]

Well, so many...
disc brakes

Indeed there are many but disc brakes isn't one of them.

The first disc brakes dated from about 1903 when a chap called Lanchester came up with the idea of a disc gripped by a caliper. Didn't work very well mind, but hey, that's "the old days" for you...

Wasn't the first use of disc brakes in motor racing the 1953 C-type with Dunlop brakes fitted...?

[volarchico]

So F1 is there to help develop aircraft and yachts.
Says it all.
Oh and I seem to remember an aircraft, now what was it called...........
Ah yes Concorde. I think that was a little better than any of the others, at least for aerodynamics.
Cant see F1 aero catching up there then.

So you are defining aerodynamics as pure speed? There's more to it than just going fast. The whole point of studying aero in F1 is to produce more downforce with less drag. This study has actually been integrated into street cars as well. Check the significant decrease in coefficient of drag for production vehicles over the last 50 years.

[aral]

So F1 is there to help develop aircraft and yachts.
Says it all.
Oh and I seem to remember an aircraft, now what was it called...........
Ah yes Concorde. I think that was a little better than any of the others, at least for aerodynamics.
Cant see F1 aero catching up there then.

So you are defining aerodynamics as pure speed? There's more to it than just going fast. The whole point of studying aero in F1 is to produce more downforce with less drag. This study has actually been integrated into street cars as well. Check the significant decrease in coefficient of drag for production vehicles over the last 50 years.

Quite right. And F1 technology, including aero, was used in the construction and design of the Americas cup boats, this year, where BMW Oracle used a slotted solid wing , as a sail, and trounced Alinghi.

[timbo]

And F1 technology, including aero, was used in the construction and design of the Americas cup boats, this year, where BMW Oracle used a slotted solid wing , as a sail, and trounced Alinghi.

It is not a technology that "originated" from F1.
Actually, F1 rarely was a source of technology. OTOH it was always fast to pick up and enhance anything useful from aerospace.

[wesley123]

indeed, mostly it is just using things from aeroplanes, only redesigned to fit the needs.

[aral]

And F1 technology, including aero, was used in the construction and design of the Americas cup boats, this year, where BMW Oracle used a slotted solid wing , as a sail, and trounced Alinghi.

It is not a technology that "originated" from F1.
Actually, F1 rarely was a source of technology. OTOH it was always fast to pick up and enhance anything useful from aerospace.

Timbo, the BMW Oracle team stated that they were using lessons learnt in F1, probably from the BMW team itself. But granted F1 also picks up info from the aerospace industry. But it is only now , with the Boeing Dreamliner, that cf is being used, comprehensively , in the aerospace industry, whereas F1 has perfected its use over many years. But, all learn from each other.

[Just_a_fan]

The early aero stuff was often carried out by guys who moved over from hydrodynamics work such as ship designing.

Indeed, I chatted to a chap running a wind tunnel a few years ago. He'd started in F1 with McLaren (if I remember correctly) having been working on in marine design originally.

I found the comment earlier in the thread, about F1 helping boat design, rather funny in view of this...

[WhiteBlue]

But it is only now , with the Boeing Dreamliner, that cf is being used, comprehensively , in the aerospace industry, whereas F1 has perfected its use over many years. But, all learn from each other.

Airbus started to make big aircraft parts in the eighties if I remember right. They were doing the tails and ailerons on big passenger aircraft with carbon fibre. The FA-117 and the B2 bomber were developed around that time and they consisted mainly from carbon fibre and very little metallic alloys.

[aral]

The early aero stuff was often carried out by guys who moved over from hydrodynamics work such as ship designing.

Indeed, I chatted to a chap running a wind tunnel a few years ago. He'd started in F1 with McLaren (if I remember correctly) having been working on in marine design originally.

I found the comment earlier in the thread, about F1 helping boat design, rather funny in view of this...

Of course, air is a "fluid". But I reiterate that in the Americas Cup boats, over the last few years, the builders have been borrowing from F1 techniques and design. You wont find many large container ships using slotted wings as sails.

White blue, The dreamliner is using cf for its body and wings, something that was not tried before, other than in small jets. Already there have been serious problems with strength of attachment between wings and body. Unfortunately, nobody is sure if cf has a finite life. As aircraft have to suffer the stresses of thousands of cycles, they need to be sure that aircraft will last 30+ years. The jury is still out on that one.

[xpensive]

This thread has now gone completely off track, why is this happening so frequently?.

[gridwalker]

Lets get back on topic then with another suggestion ...

The Cosworth DFV : the most successful engine in the history of the sport.

Back in the days of the FISA-FOCA wars, this engine marked the dividing line between independents and the manufacturer teams. The results of the threatened FOCA split heralded the creation of the concorde agreement, moving the sport into the business that we see today (the more things change, the more they stay the same).

Although the DFV cannot be attributed with the credit for this political development, its sheer availability and common use across the grid defined a generation of team owners.

When Ron Dennis took over McLaren, the first car to carry the MP4 designation had a DFV in the back. The FW01 carried a DFV ... I could continue, but I'd be laboring the point!