Honda Power Unit Hardware & Software

[Powerslide]

Sorry for spoiling the party...

"5.2.1 The use of any device, other than the engine described in 5.1 above, and one MGU-K, to propel the car, is not permitted."

And Mercedes-Benz AMG has a long turbocharger, within the length lies hydraulics which seem like coolant but actually use to propel as a hydraulic drive unit and cooling properties as bonus. Hence Mercedes-Benz's power advantage by not just using MGU-K but also using the motor on the MGU-H to propel as it decouples with the turbochargers spindle. Formula One conspiracy theory bordering Scientology!!

[PlatinumZealot]

Speaking of the split turbo. Honda has mysterious heat shielding near the v of the engine. It is not like the typical under the skin aero that redbull uses. It is clearly non aerodynamic. What super hot object could they have under there?

Could they be bleeding off some of the exhaust to preheat the fuel and pipe the exhaust back out the rear?

[gruntguru]

Much easier to use coolant to preheat fuel unless you want fuel temps above 100*C or thereabouts - which has not ever been the case in the past.

If you needed to use exhaust to heat the fuel it would be much easier to route the fuel to the exhaust than vice versa.

[Cold Fussion]

The measurement is taken at a high sampling rate (1kHz) and then the average over a certain timespan is taken. It will be difficult to pulse the fuelflow in such high frequency in sync with the sensor. Even more, as I guess the sensor won't output a trigger signal.

Is it a turbine-style flow meter? Or one of the non-contacting measurement methods, like ultrasonic?

If they're sampling at 1kHz, the sensor definitely responds much slower than that; at the very most, Nyquist frequency is half the sample rate, and that's assuming an impossibly steep high-cut filter on the output signal to prevent sampling artifacts during the digitization process. Realistically, the sensor's response to changes in flow probably drops off around a couple hundred Hz. Still far to fast for much in the way of flow trickery.

I was envisioning some kind of surge/release with an accumulator after the flow sensor for momentary bursts of power at a much slower rate, such that the ERS can respond accordingly and still deliver a smooth output to the wheels.

All this is simply conjuncture based on the pulsing sound from the engine as the car accelerates out of the turns and down the straight. It could just be a test engine map setting with goofy things going on to limit power and RPM, and nothing more. We'll see as testing progresses, I guess.

The flow meter has an internal measurement of 2khz, however the datasheet only specifies 100 hz output over CAN. The datasheet doesn't actually mention 1khz at all, only their website does. I don't know why their website and datasheet do not match.
http://gillsc.com/content/fuel-flow-sensor.html
http://gillsc.com/content/datasheets/gs ... l-unit.pdf

[PlatinumZealot]

Honda answers questions on the Jerez test runs.

https://www.facebook.com/HondaJP/photos ... =1&theater

Translated by Autosport User (or you can use google chrome if you rather read it directly)
http://forums.autosport.com/topic/19649 ... try7035669

The most informative bits happened mostly outside the streamings today.

Arai on PU trouble at Jerez:

- There was heat issue
- Had expected to encounter heat issue to some degree due to tight packaging of 30
- There wasnt serious trouble, but some components were exposed with excessive/intense heat (maybe ancillaries like water/oil pump, wires, etc, I guess?)
- There was cooling issue on ERS. It wasnt about heat itself but about temp management of the system. Water pressure dropped a bit, so stopped the car to be on safe side.
- Acknowledge the cause for those issues already
- As a power unit as a whole, there's no major trouble.

http://as-web.jp/new...c_id=1&no=63095

-------------------------------------------------

Also Arai had Q&A session on facebook
https://www.facebook...?type=1

some interesting bits:

on strange exhaust note, and overall engine performance at Jerez testing
-had imbalance in fuel combustion due to control issue, hence strange noise. Engine actually has nice sound, so look forward to it!
-Hardware is ok. still capping the horsepower so top speed is low.
-tight packaging is one achievement that we have great confidence in

on fuel/oil
-working with Mobil 1 very closely

will see livery change?
-wouldnt deny the possibility.

prospect for OZ?
-objective is to be on good grid, and to be able to fight and be "more than equal" against rivals

do this year's Mclaren car have potential to win championship?
-to be frank, YES

[Andres125sx]

do this year's Mclaren car have potential to win championship?
-to be frank, YES

Wow, they must be really confident to do such a statement at this point of the season

That´s good

[tuj]

had imbalance in fuel combustion due to control issue, hence strange noise

This sounds cagey. Did they have a control issue with some of their injectors or are they actually doing something clever here? It seems strange to me that if they were having injector control issues, they would have stopped running as that could endanger the engine. Me-thinks they are testing cylinder de-activation under decel or perhaps a 'big-bang' firing order.

[PlatinumZealot]

Arai said that is why the car sounded like a truck. He said you will hear the real sound of the engine in Barcelona.

[gruntguru]

Me-thinks they are testing cylinder de-activation under decel or perhaps a 'big-bang' firing order.

Big-bang firing order can't be switched on and off at will, like the car in the video was doing.

[GoranF1]

Giorgio Piola (Gazzetta) analyzes the placement of the turbo Unit Honda power.

[dren]

That doesn't agree with the picture we saw of the PU. The ICE air intake looked like it went to the front of the ICE.

[Andres125sx]

That doesn't agree with the picture we saw of the PU. The ICE air intake looked like it went to the front of the ICE.

Do you really think the pictures we saw it was the current unit?

I don´t think Honda is willing to share his final config with the world/competitors, knowing how F1 works I´d bet they intentionally published pictures of a unit very different to what they´re using

[frosty125]

That doesn't agree with the picture we saw of the PU. The ICE air intake looked like it went to the front of the ICE.

Do you really think the pictures we saw it was the current unit?

I don´t think Honda is willing to share his final config with the world/competitors, knowing how F1 works I´d bet they intentionally published pictures of a unit very different to what they´re using

I think he was referring to this photo from Jerez.

[bill shoe]

OK, so yesterday Honda must have submitted an initial engine to the FIA for homologation. Now Honda has to wait to find out how many development tokens they will get in 2015 based on the average unused competitor tokens in the competitors' initial 2015 submission.

Any rumors what the number is? Any actual clear information from the FIA?

EDIT: not clear if competitors have to submit an initial engine at same time as Honda or if competitors can submit initial engine two weeks later at first race?

Comic situation: what if Honda submitted revised engine at first race before any competitor, and it used maximum number of 2015 development tokens. Then it would be legal until the first competitor submitted a revised engine with one new token. This would reduce Honda's allotment and thereby make Honda's engine illegal after the fact. Yes I know this won't happen but always interesting to ponder the logical implications of FIA rule changes.

[damager21]

I am sure Honda would have submitted their engine for homologation and would now be working on improving reliability of its PU.

To some extent I am hoping that Honda's woes during testing was intentional to ensure that Renault and Ferrari dont use maximum tokens. If these 2 manufacturers dont see Honda as a threat then quite likely they will retain more tokens trying to catch up with Mercedes later during the year. In this process, Honda will also benefit.