Technical Regulations for 2009-2015

[Conceptual]

Guys, on the AS forum people are wondering whether the latest amendments to the rules for 2009 outlaw Williams, Toyota and BGP style diffusers.
Can anyone comment this for the ordinary mortals?

I guess it's these pieces that they are talking about but I'm not sure if they've changed, they're referring to bodyowrk behind the rear wheels

3.10.1 Any bodywork more than 150mm behind the rear wheel centre line which is between 200mm and 730mm above the reference plane, and between 75mm and 355mm from the car centre line, must lie in an area when viewed from the side of the car that is situated between 150mm and 350mm behind the rear wheel centre line and between 300mm and 400mm above the reference plane. When viewed from the side of the car no longitudinal cross section may have more than one section in this area.

3.10.2 Any bodywork behind a point lying 50mm forward of the rear wheel centre line which is more than 730mm above the reference plane, and between 75mm and 355mm from the car centre line, must lie in an area when viewed from the side of the car that is situated between the rear wheel centre line and a point
350mm behind it. When viewed from the side of the car, no longitudinal cross section may have more than two closed sections in this area.

If this does outlaw them for 2009 2 weeks before the season starts, it is just gonna throw sparks on the gas pit...

[ben_watkins]

Mad Max has been quoted on the subject..

http://uk.reuters.com/article/sportsNew ... 5620090321

Looks like the other teams have written asking for clarification and it'll go to court..

[donskar]

"It's a very clever device and you can make a very good case for saying that it's legal and a very good case for saying that it's illegal," Mosley said.

Now THAT is an example of leadership!

[Conceptual]

"It's a very clever device and you can make a very good case for saying that it's legal and a very good case for saying that it's illegal," Mosley said.

Now THAT is an example of leadership!

ESPECIALLY since the FIA gave the teams clearance early in the development cycle.

If these are outlawed now, do the affected teams get some in-season testing time to adapt to the change? Or is it being done simply because BrawnGP is smoking Ferrari?

I swear, the f***ing drama makes me nauseous.

Is there a single, accountable person anywhere to be found in the FIA/FOM?

It makes me sick that the "almost didn't make it" underdog is being lashed out upon because they adjusted to the new rules better than anyone else.

I sincerely feel for Williams and Toyota as well.

I also feel for the FOTA since this BS is nothing more than a way to wedge between the teams and bust them apart.

What would happen if BGP/Williams/Toyota simply offered to sell their diffusors to the teams that dont have them? Would that help at all?

Also:

If the diffusor is challenged in Australia and deemed legal by the scrutineers, can the teams simply contest it at every venue until they find one that will say it isn't legal?

That would be disgusting if it were allowed...

[myurr]

"It's a very clever device and you can make a very good case for saying that it's legal and a very good case for saying that it's illegal," Mosley said.

Now THAT is an example of leadership!

I can't remember where I read it now, but apparently the teams have been given conflicting advise with some teams being told it was illegal (hence not developing it) and others being given the go ahead.

The FIA is a massive and useless joke.

To use the political lexicon that Max usually hides behind, the FIA is not fit for purpose.

[meves]

"It's a very clever device and you can make a very good case for saying that it's legal and a very good case for saying that it's illegal," Mosley said.

Now THAT is an example of leadership!

I can't remember where I read it now, but apparently the teams have been given conflicting advise with some teams being told it was illegal (hence not developing it) and others being given the go ahead.

The FIA is a massive and useless joke.

To use the political lexicon that Max usually hides behind, the FIA is not fit for purpose.

To make matters worse if this was a company they'd be taken to court but because it's the FIA all the teams know that as soon as they do they'll be scrutinised on everything and every penalty under the sun will be thrown at them. So the FIA are untouchable.

[timbo]

Oops posted in wrong thread somehow)))

[nudger]

To make matters worse if this was a company they'd be taken to court but because it's the FIA all the teams know that as soon as they do they'll be scrutinised on everything and every penalty under the sun will be thrown at them. So the FIA are untouchable.

its also subject to french law, which makes things a lot more complicated. Normal legal arguments such as precident apparently dont apply in french law..so ive been told

[myurr]

Okay time for an assessment of the 2009 rules. I think they worked pretty well overall. We had overtaking, cars with big differences in pace at different stages of the race, more tactical decisions to be made regarding the tyres.

The front wings are more fragile, but in a way that helps remove the need for stewards decisions on overtaking moves. If you get through and don't destroy your front wing then you probably made it through cleanly enough.

It certainly seemed like the cars could follow more closely than before and that even on this circuit there were several overtaking opportunities. This is both with and without KERS.

I liked that the cars looked more difficult to drive. The drivers showed more skill, but also made more small mistakes allowing faster cars a chance to overtake.

All in all I give the new rules a cautious welcome!

[nudger]

[quote="Conceptual"

Also:

If the diffusor is challenged in Australia and deemed legal by the scrutineers, can the teams simply contest it at every venue until they find one that will say it isn't legal?

That would be disgusting if it were allowed...[/quote]

the diffusers, and associated bodywork were always going to be declared to comply by the stewards of the race. that wont change next week. By the written rule they are legal. However, passing scrutineering dosnt mean a car is legal, it simply means it passes scruteneering. That is why you appeal the stewards decision, so that the fia can establish and clarify interpretations of the rules.

[Metar]

It certainly seemed like the cars could follow more closely than before and that even on this circuit there were several overtaking opportunities. This is both with and without KERS.

I agree. In the fast left-right esses halfway through the lap, cars could follow each other within metres of each other.

Also, the usage of KERS became very obvious in the race. Glock complained loudly to his engineers that Alonso "is using KERS every time" when he couldn't overtake (before resorting to that very aggressive and somewhat dirty move). There was also a few fantastic moments when Hamilton and Raikkonen just powered through and overtook with ease on a straight. Overtaking was quite plentiful, and excepting the Kubica/Vettel incident and the traditional first-corner clash, also mostly clean (and the Alonso/Glock duel was very nearly an accident, as well).

[ISLAMATRON]

It certainly seemed like the cars could follow more closely than before and that even on this circuit there were several overtaking opportunities. This is both with and without KERS.

I agree. In the fast left-right esses halfway through the lap, cars could follow each other within metres of each other.

Also, the usage of KERS became very obvious in the race. Glock complained loudly to his engineers that Alonso "is using KERS every time" when he couldn't overtake (before resorting to that very aggressive and somewhat dirty move). There was also a few fantastic moments when Hamilton and Raikkonen just powered through and overtook with ease on a straight. Overtaking was quite plentiful, and excepting the Kubica/Vettel incident and the traditional first-corner clash, also mostly clean (and the Alonso/Glock duel was very nearly an accident, as well).

Did you see right after Glock said that they got onto the main straight and Alonso just dissapeared from Glock like he was strapped to a rocket booster!

[Metar]

Did you see right after Glock said that they got onto the main straight and Alonso just dissapeared from Glock like he was strapped to a rocket booster!

Yeah, it was quite amazing.

I also recall Hamilton and Raikkonen spanking a few with their KERS systems - following through the first corner (thanks, 2009 aerodynamics!), and then blasting past.. Sometimes, it looked as if the overtaken car wasn't even close.

[jamsbong]

Did you see right after Glock said that they got onto the main straight and Alonso just dissapeared from Glock like he was strapped to a rocket booster!

Yeah, it was quite amazing.

I also recall Hamilton and Raikkonen spanking a few with their KERS systems - following through the first corner (thanks, 2009 aerodynamics!), and then blasting past.. Sometimes, it looked as if the overtaken car wasn't even close.

Is great to watch that but at the same token, these cars (Renaults and Ferraris) can't hold the speed because they do not have sufficient overall speed. Only 6.5secs of fast speed then they are slow again. In the end, they still struggle to stay ahead.

[alvinkhorfire]

Ogami

I did not know whether this matter has been discussed. If so, please direct me to the particular post. We all know that the aerodynamic change in 2009 is to improve overtaking. Does the controversial double-decker diffuser in Brawn cars negate this aerodynamic change? What I mean, is it possible that if everyone is using this diffuser, it will become difficult once again to overtake?

Thanks for clarification.