2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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rssh
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Re: 2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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RZS10 wrote:
komninosm wrote:
thomin wrote: As much as I love Mercedes and as great a drive by Rosberg this was, I think you're overstating your case. Within the realm of Rosberg's bad luck, he was fortunate to have Perez behind him who shielded him from Massa and the Red Bulls. Rosberg was clearly slower than these cars and even Perez could have been quicker despite his ancient tires.

As for the MGU-K, it's not just the loss of power that's an issue, but also the loss of rear brake power coupled with the smaller discs.

However, what has become obvious is that the W05 is an all around great piece of machinery and that it's not just the engine. The way Rosberg cranked out these awesome first and second sector times lap after lap speaks volumes.
I agree. Do you also think he was coasting on the straight to save fuel? (along with saving breaks)

Also why did Merc not take countermeasures for failure as they admitted?
According to Rosberg it was exactly that, more coasting in order to save the brakes which also led to lower fuel consumption ... and ofc the SC helped a lot with that
He had to coast so that he could complete the race under 100kg of fuel that is a given. But remember that Rosberg had the brake bias to the forward so that the smaller rear brakes aren't stressed out; so he had to brake lightly comparatively not to lock the front wheels.

SpainFAN
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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Holm86, that is un-refutable documentation of the cause... Perez was avoiding the car in front and Massa was too far out and had to duck to the interior and found himself taking out Perez... thanks for putting that together, geri insightful.

beelsebob
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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SpainFAN wrote:Holm86, that is un-refutable documentation of the cause... Perez was avoiding the car in front and Massa was too far out and had to duck to the interior and found himself taking out Perez... thanks for putting that together, geri insightful.
What on earth are you talking about – Vettel was 3 car lengths in front, and had remained that distance in front for the entire braking zone.

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Holm86
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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SpainFAN wrote:Holm86, that is un-refutable documentation of the cause... Perez was avoiding the car in front and Massa was too far out and had to duck to the interior and found himself taking out Perez... thanks for putting that together, geri insightful.
Perez was not avoiding Vettel. The only reason Vettel is in the pictures is to show the driving line.

But it shows that Massa is the one who changes his line.

Sevach
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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Massa doesn't change his line, he is steering slightly because there is a corner there.

In the same way Perez having zero steering input means he isn't making the corner.
Last edited by Sevach on 14 Jun 2014, 03:40, edited 1 time in total.

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Phil
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Re: 2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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WilliamsF1 wrote:Rosberg was doing the race with a brake balance forward while Hamilton was rearward bias. Rosberg locked up badly after the first stop because of the front bias, then changed it to a more rear bias based on Hamilton's data, soon after which the problem struck. Luckly Rosberg had more rear brakes left in comparison to Hamilton and nursed the car to the finish.
I'd say Rosberg locked up badly foremost because he was under pressure, braked late and compensated by braking harder, which then caused the lock. After all, he didn't lock them at any point before that instance, when Hamilton was further behind. There's no "right" or "wrong" where brake-bias is concerned - there's always going to be a limit, when you go on the brakes. Usually, you want a bit of forward bias because you don't want the rears to lock when going on the brakes (oversteer with the potential to lose the rear). The ideal set-up would be to have the front lock a bit before the rear would. Also a setting will not be identical on every braking point. I would think that braking from a higher speed causes more weight (load) to shift to the front of the car, so there's no ideal setting for the entirety of a lap. As the fuel load and weight (and grip of the tyres as well as surface conditions changes), so does the optimum setting.

Of course, a too forward brake bias will mean that you are running with less braking power in total since the rear are underbraked (relatively speaking).
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
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mrluke
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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Perez was complaining of brakes failing, Massa drove into the back of him. The emphasis is always on the following driver?

Massa should have overtaken 10 laps previously anyway.

timbo
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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Sevach wrote:Massa doesn't change his line, he is steering slightly is because there is a corner there.

In the same way Perez having zero steering input means he isn't making the corner.
This. And what actually caught Massa was not that Perez moved out, it was that he moved out AND braked really early.

wesley123
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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What I've seen it seems more of a racing incident than anything else. Perez had to react to the car in front, and thus had to go to the left to overtake him. Massa didn't react quick enough to this and collided.

I wouldn't put the blame on anyone here, but I'd say it was more of a driver error from Massa than anything else. Perez had to move to the left, and thus Massa should have too.
"Bite my shiny metal ass" - Bender

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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Hamilton was again up 4% on fuel in the race... I was soo looking forward to HAM overtaking ROS and just pulling away into the Canadian sunset lol
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sennaf1god.94
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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Valteri Bottas wrote:We need to look back at the second pitstop though in terms of timing and the stop because I didn't come back out where I should have.

"I was then in traffic, stuck behind the Force India, which overheated the engine and brakes, and I had to save everything to get to the flag."

"Not our day really,"
Another driver blaming both the race engineer and pitstop crew. Two out of two...

50% of the pitstops were a failure both strategic and executive wise.

Looks there isn't any hunger for winning on the other side of the wall...
I don't know driving in another way which isn't risky. Each one has to improve himself. Each driver has its limit. My limit is a little bit further than other's.

Ayrton Senna da Silva

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Powerslide
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Re: Williams/Massa lost an easy win today...just bad luck?

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Holm86 wrote:I still feel Massa is to blame for this crash. https://twitter.com/trasnochadoF1/statu ... 4236090368
Last I check, Formula One racing do have corners
speed

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Powerslide
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Re: 2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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djos wrote: Perez is usually a clean driver so they prolly thought applying license points would be overly harsh.
Bit too aggressive for Jensen Button but aggression and unfair are two different entities of course.
speed

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Powerslide
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Re: 2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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Rosberg was locking up because he was starting to have brake issues hence his call to the pits to ask about Hamilton's settings. Hamilton was closing in already. I was expecting Hamilton to score this especially after that brilliant start but real unfortunate. Rosberg, however, produced a really strong performance.
speed

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mertol
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Re: 2014 Canadian Grand Prix - Montreal

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Neither Perez or Massa broke any rules. It was racing incident and it was Massa's fault. Rosberg however clearly broke the rules.I say investigate the corrupt stewards.